Nytro Suspension- Need help getting a softer ride

Guys, as some of you know, I am about as loyal of a Yamaha guy as you can get. I am the 40th Anniversary of the Snowmobile author and have one hell of a Yamaha collection so don't take this as a slam email. I am completely at a loss on this Nytro FX RTX Anniversary.

I have been riding in a group of three Nytro FX RTX's all week. I have done an amazing amount of tuning on the front and rear suspensions trying to get this sled to perform for trail riding. Three of the guys working on the sleds with me either work at Yamaha dealerships as mechanics or have owned a Yamaha dealership for 30 years.

Maybe if I was jumping six footer's the sled would be great, but in my opinion this sled is terribly stiff. I weight 155 the other two people are 155 and 230 pounds. None of us are happy. I ride very fast, aggressive, on trails in Northern Wisconsin. The sled just does not perform in my opinion any where near what it should. Some of the other guys I am also riding with have Rev 600 and Rev XP 800. Both sleds stock rail on the curves, they absorb the bumps front and rear. These guys are not drinking around all day trying to get their sleds to work. And they are not adding aftermarket skis to their sleds.

What I have done to get this sled to ride like a normal high performance trail sled that has created some improvements but no where near enough.

Rear Suspension:
1. Limiter strap 2 holes.
2. Front shock, spring adjusted down to 1 thread showing off set the 2 holes on the limiter. Big help.
3. Rear springs set to SOFT
4. Rebound set to three clicks back from stock
5. Dampening on front and rear shocks set all the way out to where you can not turn them any more. Sorta helped.
6. I was running 144 studs standard pattern inner and outer belts. Removed the outer belts to try and get this thing to stop pushing even after all the stuff I have already done. Some benefit.

Front End - I have the RTX but installed the base Model Clicker shocks
1. softened the front springs by 6 mm. Big help
2. Dampening. A click or two back from stock
3. Rebound 2 clicks forward from stock to eliminated roll
4. Installed 8" Woody's Dually carbides to help eliminated push.

After experimenting with all of this the sled is still a brick

Guys, the bottom line is I am at a loss to what it will take to make this sled absorb bumps and ride comfortably?? All of these changes were done over five days with each day performing different changes. I again, only weight 155 with gear maybe 185. This is completely to the point of being unacceptable to me to have to do this much work on a sled to make it ride like it should on rough trails. It should absorb bumps with what I have done. It does not. It just does not absorb. It is a brick.

So, now I am down to this. Calling Pioneer Performance to see if they can revalve these shocks to a calibration that a normal every day consumer will appreciate or at least one who weighs less than 230 pounds. Or attempting to put a mono-shock rear skid into this sled.

I have run Vipers, SRX's and the Apex the past ten years and all I can say is this sled is just not right for someone who wants to ride aggressive trails with chop and bumps. It is designed to one thing well, Stand up and jump six foot drive ways. My one friend just put the Nytro he bought away and now is driving his old Apex again.

What I do like is the lightness, ride position is great like the Apex was, the engine performance is awesome. Hand warmers are weak as we all know. Installed the 14 windshield now after two days of have snow all over the inside of my helmet. snow flap is lame, gets wedged up with ice and then blows snow all over your friends behind you - or rocks.

So, I hope I am not the only thinking this. I hate beating up something I have invested a lot of money and pride in but something needs to change. ANY OTHER suggestions on what to do to this rear skid?

Thanks

Just did some tweaking myself (FX standard not RTX) and this is what I have done.

GYTR Front

-Backed off springs to zero preload when unloaded.
-Rebound dampening 20 clicks out
-Compresion dampening 12 clicks out

Basically as soft as you can get and this has made the front end start to perform much better, stopped the wild left right pitching in the rough, very flat and predictable now over the rough moguls.

Rear Center Shock

-Pulled up strap one hole (now at position 2)
-backed off spring so zero preload when unloaded (about 1" threads showing)

Rear Shock

-Rear spring set to soft
-Rear compression dampening 12 clicks out

Basically as soft as you can get it.

Now this works really well for stutters and the sled is railing almost as good as my Apex but the issue now as you can imagine it bottoms very easily. I will say bottoming is not a bad thing and you should be just bottoming on the big ones, I do not mean crashing at the end of the travel but a good solid bottoming without a lot of energy tranmitted though the chassis is fine and how I like to tune.

I am thinking a revalve to have a decrease in dampening on the first 1/2 of the travel to deal with the stutters and a progressive increase in dampening on last 1/2 of the stroke to slow down and reduce bottoming (Pioneer are the guru's) and go back to medium on the rear spring block.

Pioneer revalved my Ohlins and it transformed my Apex GT it could really boogy after that, I was able to take out the big boy spring and not bottom yet have great stutter performance. Proves the point that a bigger spring in not the answer to bottoming and vavling plays a more crucial role in how a shock performs.

I agree it is a real shame we have to do this, I can not understand why they cannot get the valving right. All the test ride reports last spring said it was sucking up all the bumps and was spot on ???

I believe that for some reason the great calibration they had in the proto types ridin in the spring was scraped for production (no idea why) and I would kill to have know that setup and get the valving spec.

Re: Nytro Suspension- Handling mmh....NOT HAPPY

82SRX500, I'll be the one to say it. There is absolutely nothing wrong with the Stiffness of the suspension, Yammie finally built an sled that works for those of us North of 230 lbs.

At 155 you should have bought an non-rtx. Either you should have realised this or your dealer should have done an better Job advising you. This is not an trail Sled for 155 lb Riders. For 155 lb riders is it built to jum p the 6'ers. For those of us north of 230 it fulfills the mission you described.

I don't find it harsh at all. Yeh Yamaha you finally built an sled for us.

Heavy guys and agressive riders on X spec XP's are finding them too soft and are asking for stiffer suspensions.

Either revalve your shocks or put Standard ones in, like you did on the front.

I'm with morrisond
these sleds rock with us heavy hitters on em!

I'm 240 w/o gear and i haven't touched a thing on my suspension, I've bottomed out a couple of times but is was not harsh at all(not apex harsh). I can only imagine what the rtx is like cause the std is pretty stiff.

Od has 200 miles on it and i've loved every mile! Hope you figure out what works for you, when you do you'll love it.

Maybe you should put bricks in your pockets j/k!!

If you didnt want it stiff why did you waste the extra money on the RTX. It is taking work to dial in for corners but the suspension in the rough stuff is awesome. Im about 175-180 and when it gets rough put the flipper to the bar that will smooth the ride out quite a bit, the faster you go the better the suspension works

ya I weight 210 geared up and this thing is close to perfect for me. The sled is supposed to be stiff, and some of you guys who are complaining either don't ride as hard as you think you do and should have bought the std, not the rtx.

Reaper, I didn't like the front springs with no preload as I found it was diving too much in the corners. Here's mine so far and I'm FINALLY starting to enjoy it.

front shocks
preload 1/8" tighter than minimum
rebound 16 clicks
compression 6 clicks
skis - 1/8" toe out

center shock
preload - 1/4" looser than minimum

rear shock
compression 6 clicks

front & rear straps - raised 1 hole each
spring on medium

I only bottomed out a few times today and handling is night and day since I adjusted front & rear straps. The only thing is to fine tune the front end for even less inside ski lift. I'm going 2 holes on front & rear straps for tomorrows ride so we'll see.

I have both an Apex GT, and a Nytro RTX, adn I'm #240 with gear.
My Apex will bottom out at least 50 times to the Nytro's 1 on any given trail. I haven't done anything to the Nytro, as I don't have enough miles on it to get an accurate asesment of the sled. Our trails have been a good test of this machine lately. Ditch trails that have had 1000 sleds on them in one day.
I did notice that the Nytro was tippier than my Apex, but definately handled the harsh stuff better.
As I get some more miles on the Nytro, I'll write as good a reprt as I can, but for now, SRX500, I'd say to post an ad in the classifieds for your RTX stuff to trade for some standard stuff. Or call Bruce @ Pioneer to help you set it up. You definately bought a sled that us bigger guys were asking for. I see alot of guys buy a sled because they think they want the bigget, baddest sled out there, adn then realise that it wasn't the model they should have chosen. My buddy Nick thought he wanted the biggest, baddest Ski Doo out there, and bought a Renegade 1000, and now wishes he bought an 800X. Bought a brick, when he wanted a snow-crosser!

BB, think I will try pulling up rear strap one hole, I am runiing stock ski's so my front end will tune a little different.

I also noticed the tippiness, and I'm cool with that. It will not tip over on me, just raise the ski and I'm learning to ride like that (my old ZL 500 wouldn't raise a ski if you shot it off one side of snow bank). I weigh in at 180 before gear and I'm totally happy with this sled. I need to adjust it, play with it, and work on it, but in MY case, its the rider thats slowing the sled down, not the sled. The skis are working alright (could be better, but not bad) with 8" woody's carbides, not duelies. They are worn to #$@*, and my new pair should be in monday.

I weigh 145 and ride a Nytro RTX as well. I didn't know the RTX stood for "rubber tire xtra" around the waist to enjoy the ride of these sleds! This is just nuts!!!

I got the RTX as I'm a rough trail rider and thought I would really enjoy the ride with the adjustable rear clicker shocks, which now appear a bit worthless for my weight. I miss my Apex GT ... I guess it might be a revalve for me too!

Re: Nytro Suspension- Handling mmh....NOT HAPPY

The problem that I have is that the brochures sales data etc. states the RTX is for Rough Trail. It does not say if you weigh under 200 pounds the sled will be too firm. The Apex GT I ran the last two years got the 5.5 stiffer spring put in and it ran like a dream and did not bottom out. The brochures did not state that in order to drive the GT I should weigh under 200 and over for the RTX. If that were the case I should not have needed the 5.5 stiffer spring in the GT. Yamaha also changed out the springs in the Apex's to correct the problem on the GT's being too soft. They now fit the "majority" of the riding public. The RTX Nytro appears to be fitting those well over 200+ which appears to be the only weight that will compress the suspension on Rough Trails. Weighing in at 155 with out gear I should still be able to adjust the skid down to a ride that absorbs bumps or a rough trail.

I appreciate the advice on going to Pioneer. They will get a call tomorrow.

The difference between the RTX and base model is basically the clicker shocks with thicker MM shocks and air shocks up front. I had changed out the air shocks to clickers so that variable is gone.

Question here.... what will be the effect if I pull the rear limiter strap one or two holes? I have only pulled the front limiter strap 2 holes.

I for one hate the fox floats. i've set them to 55 psi 3 seperate times, and each time I recheck them, they are at 85 psi. Its been driving me nuts, but at least the right one is finally staying within 10 psi of what I set it to... The other one? Not a chance, 85 or 75 each time.

What is this HCS? The guy has a legitimate problem (For him) and all people are telling him is that he got the wrong sled. I totally disagree!

Here is the thing you need to realize....THERE IS NO PERFECT SET-UP! It sounds like you obviously need to go softer...maybe start by slowing the rebound down on the skid. Bring the compression for both shocks down to 6 clicks (50%). Make SMALL changes, one at a time. You will get it...but it may take all year.

Good luck!