jetpilot785
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Anyone know the weight of the stock primary weights in the 2014 viper ltx se? I'm currently playing around with clutching and will be trying the 8DN belt as well and don't currently have a gram scale in my hands and was curious as to what stock weights were. I see they are loaded heavier in the heal and mid weight for smoother engagement and a nice pull through the midrange. I am also playing around with a D&D NT helix which they claim is a 50-46. Is the stock helix a straight 45? D&D also sent me an orange pink orange spring and their 53-69 adjustable weights. I tried their recommended 0112 in the weights with the OPO spring and their NT helix at 2-6 (80*) and the sled had no pull and was all over the limiter so I played with weight and ended up with 1232 in the weights and the sled pulls decent all the way up and holds 8750-8800 rpm.
Now I may play with spring rates/weights as the sled fights hard to do 85mph and I'm not sure if the finish rate of the OPO spring is too heavy for the helix/sec spring setup. I haven't marked the primary with a marker to see where the belt shifts out to and I will be doing that soon. I may try going back the stock blue silver blue with the lighter finish to see if I pick up mph due to more primary shift.
The sled pulls hard up to 75-80 but flattens out and creeps to 85 which makes me think the finish rate may be a little strong for the current setup.
D&D claims the magnets in the kit for the primary weights are 1.3 grams each and I have 8 total with the 53-69 weights so that should put me about 63.4 grams. That's why I am curious what the stock weights are. I increased helix angle, increased secondary tension from 1-6 to 2-6 and increased primary tension from 35-101kg to 30-137kg on a stock machine so that makes me wonder if the clutches aren't shifting out all the way. I have also tried going back to 1-6 and the sled pulls a little harder upshift but a little slower/lazier backshift.
Now I may play with spring rates/weights as the sled fights hard to do 85mph and I'm not sure if the finish rate of the OPO spring is too heavy for the helix/sec spring setup. I haven't marked the primary with a marker to see where the belt shifts out to and I will be doing that soon. I may try going back the stock blue silver blue with the lighter finish to see if I pick up mph due to more primary shift.
The sled pulls hard up to 75-80 but flattens out and creeps to 85 which makes me think the finish rate may be a little strong for the current setup.
D&D claims the magnets in the kit for the primary weights are 1.3 grams each and I have 8 total with the 53-69 weights so that should put me about 63.4 grams. That's why I am curious what the stock weights are. I increased helix angle, increased secondary tension from 1-6 to 2-6 and increased primary tension from 35-101kg to 30-137kg on a stock machine so that makes me wonder if the clutches aren't shifting out all the way. I have also tried going back to 1-6 and the sled pulls a little harder upshift but a little slower/lazier backshift.
oe loaded arm in the ltx se weighted 63gr
stingray719
TY 4 Stroke God
See 8DN post or "CLUTCHING ANSWER" post. Stock Viper belt slips. Waste of time to tune when belt changes every time out (ask me how I know...lol)
jetpilot785
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mewaschuk said:
Thanks brother!!
jetpilot785
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stingray719 said:
I actually just ordered a couple belts to convert over to the 8DN. I also figured out the stock helix is a straight 43* based on the part numbers. I also ordered a couple more primary springs to try as I believe the clutch kit D&D sent me wasn't totally tested for various conditions and riders needs which is tough to do so I wanted to play around with it a little myself and see if I can get it a lot closer to how I want it for my personal preference.
Now that I know what the stock helix angle is and what the stock weights are, it makes sense as to why it revs and doesn't pull hard and peaks out at 85mph with the D&D kit. They sent me a 50/46 helix, increased secondary tension from 70* to 80* or 1-6 to 2-6, sent me an OPO spring which is 30/137kg (stock was BSB at 35/101kg) and have 63.5 grams of weight in the primary weights just to make it feel decent 0-70 without bouncing all over the limiter on take off and at WOT. I believe the helix and sec torsion is good but strongly feel the primary spring they sent me is too strong for the stock engine to over come and shift out completely. Instead it shifts out about 70-80% of it's potential and flattens out as the 137kg is possibly too strong and in order to have enough force to overcome that, the weights will be too heavy for the stock powerband to spin it in the proper rpm band. So I ordered a couple springs to test to see if I can keep the heavier weight in the arms for a better pull but also be able to fully shift the clutches out.
I ordered a GSG which is 35/126 with a 2.75 spring rate and a YSY which is a 35/118 with a 2.5 spring rate. The OPO spring D&D sent is 30/137 with a 3.25 spring rate. Stock is a BSB and is 35/101 with a 2.0 spring rate. So those 2 springs I ordered should put me in the middle of where I was and where I am now and should hopefully yield a decent result. Combine that with a hopefully more consistent clutching from the 8DN and hopefully I will have decent baseline clutching for those trail riders like me who like a nice and smooth but strong pull from bottom to top with decent top end. I'm not all about top end like some others are but I do like respectable top end and 85 mph on a 2014 1050 triple is not respectable IMO. I would be happy with 95-100. At this point, anything over 90 would be an improvement.
running DNF in the Viper with 8JP. my experience from tuning: 4 back-to-back 1500ft WOT runs and you can hold your hands on the primary sheave. 9150 rpm peak @ 98mph. i consider that tuned.
YamahaTim
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mewaschuk said:
Well your lucky, running 4 wot for me cost me 4 8JP belts...lol 8DN and no problems with high speed.
jetpilot785
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mewaschuk said:
I would consider that a great start. Any chance you would share your setup or is it one of those "racing secrets"?
Dnf + white spring and weights to suit.
09nytro
TY 4 Stroke God
What's in the secondary ?mewaschuk said:
Does it work good on trail ?
09nytro said:
all else stock. have ~1100mi of trail/race riding with this setup.
Buster696
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Ran the 8dn belt for a 50+ mi ride with the following changes.
Primary: 14.5 rollers // ST’s with 2g’s in heel. When I ran them stock seemed to up shift too much, so I slowed it down a bit with the 2’g per. Stock primary spring.
Secondary: Hauck 47/41 with Silver at 70-deg.
Results: Love the low engagement 3000rpm-ish. Actually pulls harder than stock. RMP is low at 8400~8500 on a standard pull. On a longer pull on trail/hard pack creeping up past 8500 and could feel the MPH gaining. Sled felt quicker and more consistent with 8dn meaning each ride/turn through the trail was always there and ready for some more. Clutches were much, much cooler than the stock belt even when I checked it on a wide open run.
Changes: going with a little stiffer primary spring (total force). First going to add 10kg of total force to get the RPM up to 8800. Then going to play a little with secondary spring(s) as I have a few different stock and non-stock/OEM ones in my tuning box.
Also, here are a couple picks of the weights-stock and ST’s I’m using.
Primary: 14.5 rollers // ST’s with 2g’s in heel. When I ran them stock seemed to up shift too much, so I slowed it down a bit with the 2’g per. Stock primary spring.
Secondary: Hauck 47/41 with Silver at 70-deg.
Results: Love the low engagement 3000rpm-ish. Actually pulls harder than stock. RMP is low at 8400~8500 on a standard pull. On a longer pull on trail/hard pack creeping up past 8500 and could feel the MPH gaining. Sled felt quicker and more consistent with 8dn meaning each ride/turn through the trail was always there and ready for some more. Clutches were much, much cooler than the stock belt even when I checked it on a wide open run.
Changes: going with a little stiffer primary spring (total force). First going to add 10kg of total force to get the RPM up to 8800. Then going to play a little with secondary spring(s) as I have a few different stock and non-stock/OEM ones in my tuning box.
Also, here are a couple picks of the weights-stock and ST’s I’m using.
