Clutching on the cheap

[shagman]

Ok here it goes. Started with 60y supertips. Still testing but don't like any of the results so far. Went to Colorado rode at 10000'. Ran 8fp with Y-G-Y spring and 46/40 helix at 6-1. Worked great but hit rev limiter on top end. 3.2 in tip would have fixed. Left alone as I wasn't running up there much in rpm range. Tested at home 600' alt. 8fp 5.5g tip 4.7g mid 4.7 heel. Y-G-Y spring 46/40 helix 6-1. Went to Houghton and rode 150 miles. Sled rocks and very fast. But hitting rev limiter on the top end after 105 mph. Rpm's climb slow into limiter from 8800. Have not tested or rode since. Possible changes. Smaller rollers or more weight. More weight is going to be tough with these weights. I am waiting for some new weights to test from OSP. I am very picky with clutching. I want it perfect. All testing done with machined clutches and pint secondary spring. Hope this helps. Need more snow as I have to trailer to test.

 

[shagman]

Oops pink spring.

 

[STAIN]

How is the throttle response with that much weight? Do you think that a higher finish angle might bring the rpm's down ? What was the engagement?

 

[NOS-PRO]

Just wanted to say thanks to stingray,nospro,and shagman.
Following their posts and advise i used the green white green primary spring, 2 primary spring shims. 8fp weights with 3.1 gram rivets 8dn belt and shimmed stock helix.
The seat of the pants difference is quite noticable. I am now very impressed with the performance of my viper rtx.
I was hoping this was going to resolve my complaints about performance and it absolutely has.
My top speed also improved some from 85 to 92 @8800-8900 rpm.
I have a 46/40 helix showing up tomorrow that i will be trying next weekend that i hope will improve this set up even more.
Again thank you guys so much! This is now the sled i had hoped it would be!!

You are very welcome RTX

At 412 miles, you will see rpms increasing as you drive and put more miles on.... The sled will build more power also as the engine loosens up

The 46/40 helix will make the take off much more noticeable by transferring more power to the track on take off and the top end will also have more pull with the 40° angle

 

[shagman]

How is the throttle response with that much weight? Do you think that a higher finish angle might bring the rpm's down ? What was the engagement?

Throttle response is great. 30 to 60 mph all i can say is hold on. I will be trying different helix's but the flatter finish angle allows you better top end. tried a straight 43 and it pulled rpm down a little but it really reduces backshift on the low end. Engagement is 2900 and very smooth with no slippage. Would like to try 48/42 and see how it is but i have not bought one yet. More testing to come and will keep you posted. Should get out this weekend.

 

[superb]

You are very welcome RTX

At 412 miles, you will see rpms increasing as you drive and put more miles on.... The sled will build more power also as the engine loosens up

The 46/40 helix will make the take off much more noticeable by transferring more power to the track on take off and the top end will also have more pull with the 40° angle

What wrap do you put on the 46/40 helix and do you use the stock secondary spring? Thank-you in advance.

 

[shagman]

Pink spring @ 6-1.

 

[NOS-PRO]

This post is about a helix I just purchased...... which really opened my eyes to other helix's.

Received a call from TJ telling me that something wasn't right with the helix he bought. This is a new helix and is different than the helix I used last winter. TJ told me the holes 0,3,6,9 on the helix did not match up to the stock helix and he is right. TJ called and let them know what he found. To my dismay, I picked up some helix's I have in my box and the other aftermarket helix's are different also!

TJ came up with an idea that will help anyone that is using an aftermarket helix, no matter what brand it is. If it's a 46/40 (so to say) the angles will be the same but the spring twist will be different. TJ and I put the stock helix on the spring in 6-1 holes (without twisting the spring) and marked with black marker where the mounting holes were and the start of the ramp. Put the new aftermarket helix on and was way off so we swapped it around to find something close to where our original marks were on the secondary where the ramp of the helix started and the mounting holes. Both TJ and I ended up putting the new helix at 3-2 (3 in the helix, 2 in the secondary) to get the correct spring tension.

This is yet another variable to add to our clutching findings. Little did I know that the holes would be that much different between all of the helix's out there.....(shaking my head). This makes me think of the caption "You had one job and one job only......." LOL

 

[stingray719]

This post is about a helix I just purchased...... which really opened my eyes to other helix's.

Received a call from TJ telling me that something wasn't right with the helix he bought. This is a new helix and is different than the helix I used last winter. TJ told me the holes 0,3,6,9 on the helix did not match up to the stock helix and he is right. TJ called and let them know what he found. To my dismay, I picked up some helix's I have in my box and the other aftermarket helix's are different also!

TJ came up with an idea that will help anyone that is using an aftermarket helix, no matter what brand it is. If it's a 46/40 (so to say) the angles will be the same but the spring twist will be different. TJ and I put the stock helix on the spring in 6-1 holes (without twisting the spring) and marked with black marker where the mounting holes were and the start of the ramp. Put the new aftermarket helix on and was way off so we swapped it around to find something close to where our original marks were on the secondary where the ramp of the helix started and the mounting holes. Both TJ and I ended up putting the new helix at 3-2 (3 in the helix, 2 in the secondary) to get the correct spring tension.

This is yet another variable to add to our clutching findings. Little did I know that the holes would be that much different between all of the helix's out there.....(shaking my head). This makes me think of the caption "You had one job and one job only......." LOL

Some helix vendors use odd naming conventions that seem to sere no purpose but protect what they are doing from those who would copy. Another good reason mixing parts may not work out as expected, and real world testing is needed.

 

[sixstringorsnow]

So I got to do some running this weekend. My weights were empty and it over revd on the top from 70 mph up. I am going to put some weight in the tip to try and correct this. It worked really good until about 70 mph. I am trying to figure out if adding the weight to the tip is going to compromise my rpm's from 0-60 mph. Its hard to tel from this tach if your running a straight shift from takeoff because of the lag. Im thinking of trying a different primary spring BWB or something like that to see if it straightens out my shift, or I may have to remove some weight from the weight itself. When I was running polaris the rate of the primary spring would change the rpm. 10 less pounds would roughly be 100 rpm. How does this relate to KG? Example 10 less KG = how many less RPM?

 

[shagman]

This post is about a helix I just purchased...... which really opened my eyes to other helix's.

Received a call from TJ telling me that something wasn't right with the helix he bought. This is a new helix and is different than the helix I used last winter. TJ told me the holes 0,3,6,9 on the helix did not match up to the stock helix and he is right. TJ called and let them know what he found. To my dismay, I picked up some helix's I have in my box and the other aftermarket helix's are different also!

TJ came up with an idea that will help anyone that is using an aftermarket helix, no matter what brand it is. If it's a 46/40 (so to say) the angles will be the same but the spring twist will be different. TJ and I put the stock helix on the spring in 6-1 holes (without twisting the spring) and marked with black marker where the mounting holes were and the start of the ramp. Put the new aftermarket helix on and was way off so we swapped it around to find something close to where our original marks were on the secondary where the ramp of the helix started and the mounting holes. Both TJ and I ended up putting the new helix at 3-2 (3 in the helix, 2 in the secondary) to get the correct spring tension.

This is yet another variable to add to our clutching findings. Little did I know that the holes would be that much different between all of the helix's out there.....(shaking my head). This makes me think of the caption "You had one job and one job only......." LOL

NOS Just checked my Dalton 46/40 and the holes are in the correct location and labeled correctly.

 

[shagman]

So I got to do some running this weekend. My weights were empty and it over revd on the top from 70 mph up. I am going to put some weight in the tip to try and correct this. It worked really good until about 70 mph. I am trying to figure out if adding the weight to the tip is going to compromise my rpm's from 0-60 mph. Its hard to tel from this tach if your running a straight shift from takeoff because of the lag. Im thinking of trying a different primary spring BWB or something like that to see if it straightens out my shift, or I may have to remove some weight from the weight itself. When I was running polaris the rate of the primary spring would change the rpm. 10 less pounds would roughly be 100 rpm. How does this relate to KG? Example 10 less KG = how many less RPM?

What spring are you running now? Please list your setup and we can help you adjust. I ran 8FP empty @ 10500' altitude with Y-G-Y spring with 2 shims, 46/40 helix at 6-1 and it was a little light in the tip but was o.k. for the amount of time I rode there. Note that is with a turbo at 6 lbs. boost. Only change for 800' altitude was to add rivets. 5.5 tip, 4.7 mid and inner. Still hitting limiter after 110 mph but ok for now. Its a bad idea to adjust rpm with spring as it changes your shift. Better to add to the tip.

 

[sixstringorsnow]

8FP empty , GWG, 5 shims, 46/40 dalton stock spring in 6-1 Studded.

 

[shagman]

8FP empty , GWG, 5 shims, 46/40 dalton stock spring in 6-1 Studded.

Put 3.2g in the tip and reduce to 2 shims. and you should be good. You will be happy. Depending on how many mile on your sled, you will have to change to 4.7 in tip when broke in. 1500-2000 miles. At 3300 miles stock last year i was at 4.7 tip and 2.1 mid and it rocked. Added turbo during summer and starting all over with clutching. But close now. lol Where are you from?

 

[sixstringorsnow]

I had 4.5 in the tip before that and it would not hall the rpm. I would only get 8200-max 8600 rpm. My sled has over 4000 miles.