Heavily modded nytro vs viper

[beleafer]

Wondering if it's worth trading in my nytro with numerous upgrades on a viper. Is the handling that much better than a fully set up nytro? I understand the high c.o.g. Is not ideal on nytro , and the viper is considerably better than a stock nytro in the handling dept. Is it worth trading in or selling a sled with a lot invested? Would like to hear from people who have experience with both. When I say handling I mean as it pertains to carving, side hilling etc. Not to concerned with trail riding.

 

[Grimm]

I think if you check out "Yellowknife's" videos on youtube, you probably wouldn't risk the chance. He's got a couple of Nytros too.

You can read up on his adventures here, along with links to his videos. They are quite entertaining. http://www.ty4stroke.com/viewtopic.php? ... highlight=

 

[NOS-PRO]

Read your mods on your Nytro....holy crap!

I have a nytro and a Viper....but my Nytro is a 121 but I love to do off trail. The Viper is a great sled and if I were you....sell the Nytro for the best buck and get a new turbo Viper. The handling is so much better and rides much better which means more control. Just my .02

 

[fxnytroxtx]

HELL NO MAN! My nytro was modded almost just like yours and I sold it to get a viper and what a mistake it was! I personally ( I think I'm the only one on here) hated my viper ltx se in Stock form, for my style of riding, it drove like brick! It was then that I realized that it too will need a ton of money to make ride like I wanted it to, and that a turbo is must on it iMO where the nytro didn't need as much. From now on thw only yamaha I will buy is if it is 100% yamaha, but it's becoming more clear that they all going to be yamacraps soon.

 

[Yamadog]

No - and to get a viper to that level you will have $30,000 in it and still no better other than slightly in the handling dept if that.

 

[09nytro]

We'll if you really like your nytro then why sell it ?
If you don't then if it was me I would find a dealer next year and test ride everything (All Brands ) to see what fits your ridding style the best , you are the only one that knows what you like , nobody on here does !

But just taking in what I read ............I would say 2015 skidoo summit X T3 !!!! IMO !!!!!!!

 

[Studroes144]

No - and to get a viper to that level you will have $30,000 in it and still no better other than slightly in the handling dept if that.

Gotta agree with dog here..with all the money invested in your nytro(if you did all the work yourself that is and didn't buy it that way) I gotta think you easily have $20k+ into it. Sounds to me like you're a deep snow rider so ultimately a better suspension is irrelevant because the snow is your main source of suspension. Really that is the only difference from the nytro to the viper. Never did much deep snow riding but it sounds like the viper handles the deep snow far better than the nytro but like stated it's gonna take some serious coin to get the viper to the same potential as your nytro. And if you sell your nytro what are u gonna get out of it?..not even half of what u have invested.

 

[Yamadog]

Another thing that is not talked about on here is that several of us have blown motors on the Viper running 6 lbs of boost!!! I have no faith in the CAT ECU vs what the Yamaha unit does in the Nytro. one was blamed on the KOSO combo gauge even though it was showing great numbers it still ran lean and that was at 3000 miles. Mine was blamed on the boost gauge even though it was dropping cylinders, multiple times, from 150 miles and I only added the gauge at 460 miles.

To push mine safely to 240 ish hp i rebuilt with carillo rods and low comp pistons. I am still considering playing with the timing (retard) cause this thing scares me to death that it is going to break again.

It certainly is not plug and play - even after upgrading fuel pump and quick spool wastegate to run at 11#'s my AFR #'s are all over the place. The last ride of the season after everything upgraded, if I would slowly rase throttle to WOT I was seeing 10.9 to 11.1 but if I launched hard and ran it wot it would jump to 12.9 and I would have to get out of the throttle. I know that I have to play more with the fuel controller but things seem to change. What worked Saturday did not on Sunday.

 

[stingray719]

I am out west and understand what you are talking aout when you say sidehilling and carving. I had two Nytros I was determined to make work, one ultralight for the girlfriend and a 280 horsepower supercharged one for me. Ultralight was all timbersled front and back with narrowed front weighing 540 ready to ride (you know how expensive that was). Even that light it was topheavy and much better but still a turd sidehilling...and carving forget it. Super Nytro was 600 pounds ready to ride all timbersled and more than I want to list here. Would wear you out in the powder. OH, and with the Nytro being front heavy don't even try to follow real mountain sleds into the steep and deep.

Now, we have a Viper XTX that I long tracked and put narrowed front on for the girlfriend and I have a 2014 M8 so they are essentially both same chassis now. WOW what a difference, if I had to go back and ride a Nytro in the mountains I would stay home....really. We ride 5 or 6 hours now and back in the Nytro days 2 hours wrestling those was enough. With the Viper you don't even need to stand up to sidehill most of the time. Mountain Viper you slide butt left on seat and steer about 20 degrees right hit the gas and carry the front ski in the air as far as you want. The Viper XTX with the original shortrack would still go anywhere the 162 Nytro would. Now we long tracked the Viper NO WAY a Nytro can follow us, and as I HATE being stuck that is a biggy for me. How is this? The Proclimb chassis puts the weight on the track not the skis. Long track Viper will smoke a Polaris Pro across a deep powder snow field because of superior traction in the testing we did.

Read alot of guys with LTX saying it rode bad but our XTX even before the long track was a pleasure to ride, maybe its the air shocks on the XTX? For the riding you do go with the Mountain Viper and you will never look back on the Nytro.

If you don't have a Viper to test ride a 2014 (NOT a 2012 or 2013) Arctic Cat M8, they ride so much like a Viper you will get an accurate test. In fact moving the lower skid shock forward a bit in our converted XTX made it JUST LIKE the M8.

If they would have give me more for my M8 on trade I would have bought a 2015 Mountain Viper with boost. I rode the demo Mountain Viper with boost and the superior traction to the Nytro made the 190hp Viper feel faster than my old 280hp Nytro was because the Nytro would spin the track where the Viper digs in and gives you a "oh my god" kind of monment.

SIDE NOTE: seems the 2014 Viper came with a less than optimal belt and clutch, see the "found our lost power" thread for the fix that should be in the 2015 Vipers...at least it seemed to be in the 2015 demos. Viper with clutch set right pulls same equiped Nytro by around 4 lengths in 0 to 50 drag race.



Do your research, do a test ride and take alot of what you read with a grain of salt knowing those happy with thier sleds don't post alot and those unhappy are a very vocal few.

 

[stingray719]

No - and to get a viper to that level you will have $30,000 in it and still no better other than slightly in the handling dept if that.

Gotta agree with dog here..with all the money invested in your nytro(if you did all the work yourself that is and didn't buy it that way) I gotta think you easily have $20k+ into it. Sounds to me like you're a deep snow rider so ultimately a better suspension is irrelevant because the snow is your main source of suspension. Really that is the only difference from the nytro to the viper. Never did much deep snow riding but it sounds like the viper handles the deep snow far better than the nytro but like stated it's gonna take some serious coin to get the viper to the same potential as your nytro. And if you sell your nytro what are u gonna get out of it?..not even half of what u have invested.

Viper on deep powder floats and carves

Nytro in deep powder drops the front and sinks like a stone. You can buy new carry over turbo Nytros here for pennies on the dollar.

 

[stingray719]

Another thing that is not talked about on here is that several of us have blown motors on the Viper running 6 lbs of boost!!! I have no faith in the CAT ECU vs what the Yamaha unit does in the Nytro. one was blamed on the KOSO combo gauge even though it was showing great numbers it still ran lean and that was at 3000 miles. Mine was blamed on the boost gauge even though it was dropping cylinders, multiple times, from 150 miles and I only added the gauge at 460 miles.

To push mine safely to 240 ish hp i rebuilt with carillo rods and low comp pistons. I am still considering playing with the timing (retard) cause this thing scares me to death that it is going to break again.

It certainly is not plug and play - even after upgrading fuel pump and quick spool wastegate to run at 11#'s my AFR #'s are all over the place. The last ride of the season after everything upgraded, if I would slowly rase throttle to WOT I was seeing 10.9 to 11.1 but if I launched hard and ran it wot it would jump to 12.9 and I would have to get out of the throttle. I know that I have to play more with the fuel controller but things seem to change. What worked Saturday did not on Sunday.

I blew an Apex engine with just under 2k miles on it. Doesn't mean the Apex engine or electronics are bad one though, I attributed it to a load of fuel with extra ethanol in it. Friend who delivers fuel tells me they mix the ethanol in at delivery and it is rarely the same amount. Anybody know for sure?

 

[cacsrx1]

I am out west and understand what you are talking aout when you say sidehilling and carving. I had two Nytros I was determined to make work, one ultralight for the girlfriend and a 280 horsepower supercharged one for me. Ultralight was all timbersled front and back with narrowed front weighing 540 ready to ride (you know how expensive that was). Even that light it was topheavy and much better but still a turd sidehilling...and carving forget it. Super Nytro was 600 pounds ready to ride all timbersled and more than I want to list here. Would wear you out in the powder. OH, and with the Nytro being front heavy don't even try to follow real mountain sleds into the steep and deep.

Now, we have a Viper XTX that I long tracked and put narrowed front on for the girlfriend and I have a 2014 M8 so they are essentially both same chassis now. WOW what a difference, if I had to go back and ride a Nytro in the mountains I would stay home....really. We ride 5 or 6 hours now and back in the Nytro days 2 hours wrestling those was enough. With the Viper you don't even need to stand up to sidehill most of the time. Mountain Viper you slide butt left on seat and steer about 20 degrees right hit the gas and carry the front ski in the air as far as you want. The Viper XTX with the original shortrack would still go anywhere the 162 Nytro would. Now we long tracked the Viper NO WAY a Nytro can follow us, and as I HATE being stuck that is a biggy for me. How is this? The Proclimb chassis puts the weight on the track not the skis. Long track Viper will smoke a Polaris Pro across a deep powder snow field because of superior traction in the testing we did.

Read alot of guys with LTX saying it rode bad but our XTX even before the long track was a pleasure to ride, maybe its the air shocks on the XTX? For the riding you do go with the Mountain Viper and you will never look back on the Nytro.

If you don't have a Viper to test ride a 2014 (NOT a 2012 or 2013) Arctic Cat M8, they ride so much like a Viper you will get an accurate test. In fact moving the lower skid shock forward a bit in our converted XTX made it JUST LIKE the M8.

If they would have give me more for my M8 on trade I would have bought a 2015 Mountain Viper with boost. I rode the demo Mountain Viper with boost and the superior traction to the Nytro made the 190hp Viper feel faster than my old 280hp Nytro was because the Nytro would spin the track where the Viper digs in and gives you a "oh my god" kind of monment.

SIDE NOTE: seems the 2014 Viper came with a less than optimal belt and clutch, see the "found our lost power" thread for the fix that should be in the 2015 Vipers...at least it seemed to be in the 2015 demos. Viper with clutch set right pulls same equiped Nytro by around 4 lengths in 0 to 50 drag race.



Do your research, do a test ride and take alot of what you read with a grain of salt knowing those happy with thier sleds don't post alot and those unhappy are a very vocal few.

We need to run this through the BS filter........you sir have one magical sled on your hands.

 

[stingray719]

I am out west and understand what you are talking aout when you say sidehilling and carving. I had two Nytros I was determined to make work, one ultralight for the girlfriend and a 280 horsepower supercharged one for me. Ultralight was all timbersled front and back with narrowed front weighing 540 ready to ride (you know how expensive that was). Even that light it was topheavy and much better but still a turd sidehilling...and carving forget it. Super Nytro was 600 pounds ready to ride all timbersled and more than I want to list here. Would wear you out in the powder. OH, and with the Nytro being front heavy don't even try to follow real mountain sleds into the steep and deep.

Now, we have a Viper XTX that I long tracked and put narrowed front on for the girlfriend and I have a 2014 M8 so they are essentially both same chassis now. WOW what a difference, if I had to go back and ride a Nytro in the mountains I would stay home....really. We ride 5 or 6 hours now and back in the Nytro days 2 hours wrestling those was enough. With the Viper you don't even need to stand up to sidehill most of the time. Mountain Viper you slide butt left on seat and steer about 20 degrees right hit the gas and carry the front ski in the air as far as you want. The Viper XTX with the original shortrack would still go anywhere the 162 Nytro would. Now we long tracked the Viper NO WAY a Nytro can follow us, and as I HATE being stuck that is a biggy for me. How is this? The Proclimb chassis puts the weight on the track not the skis. Long track Viper will smoke a Polaris Pro across a deep powder snow field because of superior traction in the testing we did.

Read alot of guys with LTX saying it rode bad but our XTX even before the long track was a pleasure to ride, maybe its the air shocks on the XTX? For the riding you do go with the Mountain Viper and you will never look back on the Nytro.

If you don't have a Viper to test ride a 2014 (NOT a 2012 or 2013) Arctic Cat M8, they ride so much like a Viper you will get an accurate test. In fact moving the lower skid shock forward a bit in our converted XTX made it JUST LIKE the M8.

If they would have give me more for my M8 on trade I would have bought a 2015 Mountain Viper with boost. I rode the demo Mountain Viper with boost and the superior traction to the Nytro made the 190hp Viper feel faster than my old 280hp Nytro was because the Nytro would spin the track where the Viper digs in and gives you a "oh my god" kind of monment.

SIDE NOTE: seems the 2014 Viper came with a less than optimal belt and clutch, see the "found our lost power" thread for the fix that should be in the 2015 Vipers...at least it seemed to be in the 2015 demos. Viper with clutch set right pulls same equiped Nytro by around 4 lengths in 0 to 50 drag race.



Do your research, do a test ride and take alot of what you read with a grain of salt knowing those happy with thier sleds don't post alot and those unhappy are a very vocal few.

We need to run this through the BS filter........you sir have one magical sled on your hands.

Nothing magical about a good set up, what part confuses you?

 

[vsmpowered]

in the mountains viper xtx would be ahead but for flatlanders it doesnt matter even if theres 5 feet of snow to play around in

 

[Studroes144]

Another thing that is not talked about on here is that several of us have blown motors on the Viper running 6 lbs of boost!!! I have no faith in the CAT ECU vs what the Yamaha unit does in the Nytro. one was blamed on the KOSO combo gauge even though it was showing great numbers it still ran lean and that was at 3000 miles. Mine was blamed on the boost gauge even though it was dropping cylinders, multiple times, from 150 miles and I only added the gauge at 460 miles.

To push mine safely to 240 ish hp i rebuilt with carillo rods and low comp pistons. I am still considering playing with the timing (retard) cause this thing scares me to death that it is going to break again.

It certainly is not plug and play - even after upgrading fuel pump and quick spool wastegate to run at 11#'s my AFR #'s are all over the place. The last ride of the season after everything upgraded, if I would slowly rase throttle to WOT I was seeing 10.9 to 11.1 but if I launched hard and ran it wot it would jump to 12.9 and I would have to get out of the throttle. I know that I have to play more with the fuel controller but things seem to change. What worked Saturday did not on Sunday.

I blew an Apex engine with just under 2k miles on it. Doesn't mean the Apex engine or electronics are bad one though, I attributed it to a load of fuel with extra ethanol in it. Friend who delivers fuel tells me they mix the ethanol in at delivery and it is rarely the same amount. Anybody know for sure?

What exactly are you thinking caused the engine to go up? I have ran regular 87 most of the season in my viper with no issues but really it's as reliable as a vehicle engine. Next year with the turbo there won't be any chance of any ethanol gas being used. Blown up a banshee 1 too many times from ethanol fuel. Now I don't even mess with it and just run good race fuel and 3 years and many long stretch radar runs on the same engine and runs just as good as day 1. I'm sure the turbo vipers will be a lot the same. Is there any word of anyone that can reprogram these viper ecus? That in my opinion is a big key to making these turbo vipers reliable. I've heard just a bit of talk that it may be possible for a reprogram of the ecu and good chance I'll be able to use my ecu as a "test project" when turbo goes on. Retard the timing and advance rev limiter..that's all that a Cat 1100 turbo reflash is..retard the timing=less chance of detonation, increase rev limiter means more boost. Ultimately more safe hp.