mattymac
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Im getting ready to do an engine build, EMS upgrade, and a chassis upgrade on my apex mtx impulse 2860 setup.
I am leaning towards the MOTEC M400, ive called, and emailed precision sports a few times over the last couple weeks and nothing? I was really hoping that the M400 could be setup more of a race application as far as getting rid of the bulky factory complex wiring harness to clean it up some and just run the engine itself and not have the handlebar controls, factory gauge, and just be able to simplify and clean up the sled? Im under the impression its more of a factory plug and play setup with all the factory stuff? I thought that precision/motec would have more support but it doesnt seem like it after trying to get in touch with em? Are there any other options for fuel/timing with support nowadays for my application? Theres been so many different fueling setups come and go over the years, obviously motec isnt going anywhere for a while.
Also looking for an engine builder in the lower 48. Would like to be able to be 400+ hp safely and looking for info to get me to that level but still be able to turn it down and be rideable and reliable at say 300hp on pump fuel. Im looking to do 10:1 pistons and rods (carrillo) at minimum. Info on turbo sizing is also welcome!
Chassis will be a diamond S titanium tube 162, kmod rear skid, 3" camo extreme, drop and rolled chaincase.
2871? 30 series? I have the t25 4 bolt header flange now, ive heard that going V band and a high end aftermarket turbine housing and external gate is worth it and I have heard dont waste my money if I already have a standard 4 bolt flange setup?
Thanks!
I am leaning towards the MOTEC M400, ive called, and emailed precision sports a few times over the last couple weeks and nothing? I was really hoping that the M400 could be setup more of a race application as far as getting rid of the bulky factory complex wiring harness to clean it up some and just run the engine itself and not have the handlebar controls, factory gauge, and just be able to simplify and clean up the sled? Im under the impression its more of a factory plug and play setup with all the factory stuff? I thought that precision/motec would have more support but it doesnt seem like it after trying to get in touch with em? Are there any other options for fuel/timing with support nowadays for my application? Theres been so many different fueling setups come and go over the years, obviously motec isnt going anywhere for a while.
Also looking for an engine builder in the lower 48. Would like to be able to be 400+ hp safely and looking for info to get me to that level but still be able to turn it down and be rideable and reliable at say 300hp on pump fuel. Im looking to do 10:1 pistons and rods (carrillo) at minimum. Info on turbo sizing is also welcome!
Chassis will be a diamond S titanium tube 162, kmod rear skid, 3" camo extreme, drop and rolled chaincase.
2871? 30 series? I have the t25 4 bolt header flange now, ive heard that going V band and a high end aftermarket turbine housing and external gate is worth it and I have heard dont waste my money if I already have a standard 4 bolt flange setup?
Thanks!
mbarryracing
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Hi mattymac,
I can give you some insight into the Motec M400 and my experiences with it as I finish my coffee and mix my bloody mary.
I upgraded to the M400 from a piggyback fuel controller quite a few years ago now on my Apex after doing extensive research, looking for a more tunable ECU. It wasn't cheap but I'll do it again.
So you don't get the wrong impression, the available M400 Plug-In kits for snowmobiles do not eliminate the factory harnesses. They use an adapter harness that plugs into the factory harness at the factory ECU plugs for convenience and the specific calibration files are programmed to use the factory engine sensors. You can make a custom bare bones single harness yourself for the ECU to run anything, but that will take some time. You'd have to purchase the terminals, specific terminal crimp pliers, plugs, etc. and either hack up a factory harness for the plugs for the designated engine sensors or buy them new from Yamaha.
There are a few other aftermarket tunable ECU options out there, less expensive too, but likely none will be plug and play for the Apex unless you find one that someone had already custom developed for their Apex and is now parting out. You'd have to build a custom harness for all of them then spend a ton of time developing a calibration file to make it start and run, then more time fine tuning to dial it in. None would be as expandable as the Motec, either.
The Motec M400 for the Apex has been around for many years so base run files are downloadable from the Motec website plus many different calibration files obtainable from guys who are already running Motec's on their Apex's that you can make run almost immediately, fine tune for your specific fuel injectors and fuel pressure. I've shared Motec files with other TY members for comparisons and trouble shooting, shared knowledge which is a huge advantage. I could email one of the 30 different cal files I have just for my Apex to someone and they could download into their Motec an run it.
There is tons of tech support available. You can get tech support for Motec specific questions (just not necessarily Apex application specific) from Motec itself, and tech support or purchase accessories / upgrades (like bigger data logging, etc) from any other Motec dealer in the country. Doesn't have to be Martin... Tons of stuff on the Motec website. I learned tons about programming and tuning from their website, forums, and watching their Youtube Webinars.
I have an engine built by Justin at Full Power Performance in NY with good rods, 10:1 CR forged pistons, heavier valve springs, blue printed and itself is capable of 400+ HP. This is the same original engine I've had for over a decade since I first turbocharged my Apex, but currently in trail setup is tuned at 310hp on pump gas only and capable of maybe 360hp on race gas. Not because of the limits of the engine build itself but just rather because it's limited by other components like my current model fuel pump capacity, current model 2860 turbo compressor map, intercooler size, and trail muffler flow restriction, etc. He builds the same engine for pure race and mountain customers that are running 30+ psi boost levels reliably. My personal experience is engine reliability is heavily dependent on fuel. Over building an engine doesn't make it reliable against poor fuel...
He isn't overly expensive but the downfall is he doesn't have a very quick turnaround time, it's months or more.
Turbo, depending on the power level you want I'd consider one of the GTX series., maybe a 2863 etc. Quicker spooling and still capable of big power. Again, depending on the power level you want to target and what you plan on doing with it will determine if you need to spend the $ for the turbo setup, V band, etc. I'm not interested in an Outlaw Drag power level so 4 bolt flange and internal wastegate turbo's are fine for me. I like keeping things simple when I don't get a big gain or benefit from not keeping it simple.
I am seriously considering building a snow drag race Apex with all the extra parts I have available to me. I'd use a M400 again but have to find a light chassis or it's pointless, can't run with a big HP doo 1200. That is my hold up. I'd like to go 151 or longer.
Mauri
I can give you some insight into the Motec M400 and my experiences with it as I finish my coffee and mix my bloody mary.
I upgraded to the M400 from a piggyback fuel controller quite a few years ago now on my Apex after doing extensive research, looking for a more tunable ECU. It wasn't cheap but I'll do it again.
So you don't get the wrong impression, the available M400 Plug-In kits for snowmobiles do not eliminate the factory harnesses. They use an adapter harness that plugs into the factory harness at the factory ECU plugs for convenience and the specific calibration files are programmed to use the factory engine sensors. You can make a custom bare bones single harness yourself for the ECU to run anything, but that will take some time. You'd have to purchase the terminals, specific terminal crimp pliers, plugs, etc. and either hack up a factory harness for the plugs for the designated engine sensors or buy them new from Yamaha.
There are a few other aftermarket tunable ECU options out there, less expensive too, but likely none will be plug and play for the Apex unless you find one that someone had already custom developed for their Apex and is now parting out. You'd have to build a custom harness for all of them then spend a ton of time developing a calibration file to make it start and run, then more time fine tuning to dial it in. None would be as expandable as the Motec, either.
The Motec M400 for the Apex has been around for many years so base run files are downloadable from the Motec website plus many different calibration files obtainable from guys who are already running Motec's on their Apex's that you can make run almost immediately, fine tune for your specific fuel injectors and fuel pressure. I've shared Motec files with other TY members for comparisons and trouble shooting, shared knowledge which is a huge advantage. I could email one of the 30 different cal files I have just for my Apex to someone and they could download into their Motec an run it.
There is tons of tech support available. You can get tech support for Motec specific questions (just not necessarily Apex application specific) from Motec itself, and tech support or purchase accessories / upgrades (like bigger data logging, etc) from any other Motec dealer in the country. Doesn't have to be Martin... Tons of stuff on the Motec website. I learned tons about programming and tuning from their website, forums, and watching their Youtube Webinars.
I have an engine built by Justin at Full Power Performance in NY with good rods, 10:1 CR forged pistons, heavier valve springs, blue printed and itself is capable of 400+ HP. This is the same original engine I've had for over a decade since I first turbocharged my Apex, but currently in trail setup is tuned at 310hp on pump gas only and capable of maybe 360hp on race gas. Not because of the limits of the engine build itself but just rather because it's limited by other components like my current model fuel pump capacity, current model 2860 turbo compressor map, intercooler size, and trail muffler flow restriction, etc. He builds the same engine for pure race and mountain customers that are running 30+ psi boost levels reliably. My personal experience is engine reliability is heavily dependent on fuel. Over building an engine doesn't make it reliable against poor fuel...
He isn't overly expensive but the downfall is he doesn't have a very quick turnaround time, it's months or more.
Turbo, depending on the power level you want I'd consider one of the GTX series., maybe a 2863 etc. Quicker spooling and still capable of big power. Again, depending on the power level you want to target and what you plan on doing with it will determine if you need to spend the $ for the turbo setup, V band, etc. I'm not interested in an Outlaw Drag power level so 4 bolt flange and internal wastegate turbo's are fine for me. I like keeping things simple when I don't get a big gain or benefit from not keeping it simple.
I am seriously considering building a snow drag race Apex with all the extra parts I have available to me. I'd use a M400 again but have to find a light chassis or it's pointless, can't run with a big HP doo 1200. That is my hold up. I'd like to go 151 or longer.
Mauri
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kinger
VIP Member
I will be setting up my Motec and Martin may be busy but has always gotten back to me. I had Ulmer Racing build me a 400HP engine and I intend to run about that in trail form with 91 + 32 OZ of Torco every tank. I went with 9.2:1 CR for extra safety and will be using a stage 1 SC which will be fed by a Impulse race turbo, starting with a 2860R but might upgrade to new G25-550 series if I get any compressor surge from the compound set up. The Motec has knock protection calibrated to the Apex and I plan to use that to control the external wastegate and actually hoping it will be capable of cutting the turbo out completely and I just run on the supercharger on 87 with such low CR that should be safe. Otherwise no knock I will run around 20-30?? psi not sure where it will land, I am not going to restrict the boost, it will be table based in the Motec on many factors such as IAT, ECT, TPS, etc. I will probably have it taper the boost at WOT after say 1/4 mile so when I get on long runs I always leave it pinned and I can add a measure a safety on those long runs. I am adding the powertune digital dashboard that will flash warning lights at me for almost any sensor feeding the Motec. Going to be a really sweet tool. Downside is its not waterproof so I will have to create a protective case for it but really excited to have that dash with a GPS module that can data log, the motec will use the factory speed sensor and I should be able to log the delta and even create a traction control type logic to flutter the boost for faster accel.
Motec is amazing and I can't wait to play with it. As MBARRY said LOTS of info on the motec site, I have watched most webinars and feel ready for it. I still don't know how it does the injector calculations but I will figure that out later with Martin's help.
I love the impulse set up! Apex on boost with long track like my 151, it will rip your arms off! I like the punch of the SC and the legs of the impulse and I am hoping I can make both play nice with each other, if not I will dump the SC and leave impulse on and deal with tiny amount of lag.
Good luck, you are now working with the Ferrari on snow once you get into that type of power and a Motec!!
Motec is amazing and I can't wait to play with it. As MBARRY said LOTS of info on the motec site, I have watched most webinars and feel ready for it. I still don't know how it does the injector calculations but I will figure that out later with Martin's help.
I love the impulse set up! Apex on boost with long track like my 151, it will rip your arms off! I like the punch of the SC and the legs of the impulse and I am hoping I can make both play nice with each other, if not I will dump the SC and leave impulse on and deal with tiny amount of lag.
Good luck, you are now working with the Ferrari on snow once you get into that type of power and a Motec!!
mattymac
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Appreciate the feedback!
I figured the motec on the apex would be more of a factory wiring plug and play setup. I just was hoping that getting rid of the bulky factory wiring and complexity of it would be an easy option to be able to remove if running the M400. Its not a make or break thing to me by any means, When talking to paul a while ago on this his standalone had an optional "race harness" setup to remove all the more trail friendly features. Last I talked to him he didnt even know if he had enough stuff to build a standalone setup for an apex anymore. And the ecu he used on the 4strokes was different than the ecu on the two stokes as they were fuel only, no timing.
Which now brings me into something I have seen become a problem for many things in this industry, future support. I had plans on running a boost it setup but there is zero support for it nowadays in getting a fuel rail, base maps etc. then by the time you did get all that figured out, price wise its not far from the price point of the motec, and then youre getting ignition control and so many other features and upgrades along with the fact that I dont see motec going anywhere anytime soon. Look at dobeck, vipec, rapid bike, boondocker, etc. either gone completely or no more product support.
An engine with just say rods and pistons, whats the safe hp level that it could be pushed to? Whats the next weak link in the apex engine beyond those parts?
Whats the max hp for a 2871 at moderate elevations? I have seen some built rx1's in the 24-26 psi range running a 2871. I was always told at 5000 feet in elevation or so the 2860 runs out of air at around 18 psi?
Fuel/octane isnt much of a problem for me. I have a great local supply of av gas and a sunoco dealer.
I figured the motec on the apex would be more of a factory wiring plug and play setup. I just was hoping that getting rid of the bulky factory wiring and complexity of it would be an easy option to be able to remove if running the M400. Its not a make or break thing to me by any means, When talking to paul a while ago on this his standalone had an optional "race harness" setup to remove all the more trail friendly features. Last I talked to him he didnt even know if he had enough stuff to build a standalone setup for an apex anymore. And the ecu he used on the 4strokes was different than the ecu on the two stokes as they were fuel only, no timing.
Which now brings me into something I have seen become a problem for many things in this industry, future support. I had plans on running a boost it setup but there is zero support for it nowadays in getting a fuel rail, base maps etc. then by the time you did get all that figured out, price wise its not far from the price point of the motec, and then youre getting ignition control and so many other features and upgrades along with the fact that I dont see motec going anywhere anytime soon. Look at dobeck, vipec, rapid bike, boondocker, etc. either gone completely or no more product support.
An engine with just say rods and pistons, whats the safe hp level that it could be pushed to? Whats the next weak link in the apex engine beyond those parts?
Whats the max hp for a 2871 at moderate elevations? I have seen some built rx1's in the 24-26 psi range running a 2871. I was always told at 5000 feet in elevation or so the 2860 runs out of air at around 18 psi?
Fuel/octane isnt much of a problem for me. I have a great local supply of av gas and a sunoco dealer.
mbarryracing
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Other than stiffer valve springs, my Apex engine only has rod and pistons. I found my limitation with stock valve springs on good safe octane fuel was about 25 psi boost before the power flat lined due to valves being held open from the boost and exhaust back pressure.
AV gas will do, my favorite is still fresh Sunoco Maximal 116 but often find it stale in 5 gallon pails more than fresh, with a poor Reid vapor pressure. As is the case with any race gas though.
mattymac
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At what power point are guys having to close deck the block for cylinder support and keep them from getting pushed out of round from high boost?
mbarryracing
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Haven't hit it yet and don't have any intention of trying to hit it. You won't even come close with a 2871... IMO it maybe something to look into wasting your $ on if you have a locomotive sized turbo pushing 40+psi of boost at sea level, and then guys still even manage to break those...
Again, detonation does more distortion damage to the block than actual cylinder pressures from just boost big boost. I have no concerns of running my stock block with stock head studs and stock head gasket at 30 psi as long as I have known fresh high octane fuel with a good Reid vapor pressure and cool intake charge temps.
Again, detonation does more distortion damage to the block than actual cylinder pressures from just boost big boost. I have no concerns of running my stock block with stock head studs and stock head gasket at 30 psi as long as I have known fresh high octane fuel with a good Reid vapor pressure and cool intake charge temps.
Last edited:
kinger
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Block is good to 400, then it will still last, but eventually oval out cylinders. The block I bought Ulmer had it re-nick'ed and bored round again so its good for ~10,000 miles at that level is my hope. Detonation is the killer, but the Motec is pretty trick. You can retard timing instantly and help save deto as well in certain cases. The engines are so tough when set up right.
Vmax4creed
VIP Member
Interesting info on the valve springs never thought about that which ones did you end up going with? The standard Arp head studs are enough to to keep the head down for 30psi ?I was looking at adding the 1" longer studs that go down further into the block only because I thought they wouldn't hold.
mbarryracing
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Valve springs are a component that is frequently overlooked because people, like myself, tend to think springs are something that only needs to be upgraded when the RPM range is being raised significantly in order to avoid valve floatation. What I was shown was that in boosted applications valve springs also have to overcome the pressures in the intake and exhaust ports pushing the valves open too, preventing them from closing and / or sealing.
When valves don't close, you don't make power...
I don't believe that stock Apex valve springs brand new have enough seat pressure to produce 30 psi of boost, let alone tired springs with some mile on them. I ended up with a combination installed of specific Kibblewhite springs and some sort of stiffer Yamaha racing springs of which the details I wasn't given.
I was also introduced to a different school of thought that showed you really don't need ARP head studs for 30 psi boost reliability. If detonation is kept in check, the stock studs perform fine because cylinder pressures don't rise directly proportional to boost pressure, the head doesn't lift... If you deto rattle an engine at 30 psi boost, with stock studs it's likely going to allow it to lift the head and leak past the gasket like a pressure relief... When detonation occurs with the stronger stiffer ARP studs, they won't budge to allow that relief, but rather the next weakest link will. As I have witnessed, that next weakest link was usually always the more expensive engine block.
Yes, eventually at some boost pressure threshold above 30 psi, you'll exceed stock head stud yield capability for sure.
When valves don't close, you don't make power...
I don't believe that stock Apex valve springs brand new have enough seat pressure to produce 30 psi of boost, let alone tired springs with some mile on them. I ended up with a combination installed of specific Kibblewhite springs and some sort of stiffer Yamaha racing springs of which the details I wasn't given.
I was also introduced to a different school of thought that showed you really don't need ARP head studs for 30 psi boost reliability. If detonation is kept in check, the stock studs perform fine because cylinder pressures don't rise directly proportional to boost pressure, the head doesn't lift... If you deto rattle an engine at 30 psi boost, with stock studs it's likely going to allow it to lift the head and leak past the gasket like a pressure relief... When detonation occurs with the stronger stiffer ARP studs, they won't budge to allow that relief, but rather the next weakest link will. As I have witnessed, that next weakest link was usually always the more expensive engine block.
Yes, eventually at some boost pressure threshold above 30 psi, you'll exceed stock head stud yield capability for sure.
Last edited:
kinger
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Agree on ARP, the OEM TTY bolts are great. I have ARP in my new build but they have a different TQ spec and process that should really be researched before doing it (or have a builder do it) and its very different then OEM in service manual. I had ARP leak on me and had to go back to TTY on my RX1 build a few years ago.
mattymac
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Great info guys!
So with motec am I going to be doing my own mapping for adjustments or how does the support side work for making changes? I can tweak a fuel map here and there but some of the more complex stuff I would be needing some help for sure.
And isn't the deto sensor and extra add on for the apex system? Theres two different knock sensors shown on the motec site, one fairly costly?
So with motec am I going to be doing my own mapping for adjustments or how does the support side work for making changes? I can tweak a fuel map here and there but some of the more complex stuff I would be needing some help for sure.
And isn't the deto sensor and extra add on for the apex system? Theres two different knock sensors shown on the motec site, one fairly costly?
kinger
VIP Member
You will need a motec tuner to help, Martin at Precision would be the best, he told me he would offer remote service for $75/hr. I bought my Motec from a guy that bought it from Martin.
The process to tune is get a base map, then data log mild runs and check how much the unit is fueling to maintain your ratios, so if its adding or deleting 10% fuel you go into your fuel map and delete or add 10%, trying to get the adder to be around 0%. That will get you dialed in. It doesn't look at injector output just adds fuel accordingly. It should be relatively easy to get up and running then fine tuning will take longer but you will really be able to see the engine working well with all the data logging.
Yes Knock module is an add on. Its spendy and it needs to be calibrated to the apex, I only know one source for that and its Martin. I don't believe MBARRY is using the knock module, I know others are not. I think its required for my build but it may not be for all builds. Mine is a trail sled and fueling in random parts of the northwoods, I need the protection. If you're running fresh fuel all the time and high octane its less important.
The process to tune is get a base map, then data log mild runs and check how much the unit is fueling to maintain your ratios, so if its adding or deleting 10% fuel you go into your fuel map and delete or add 10%, trying to get the adder to be around 0%. That will get you dialed in. It doesn't look at injector output just adds fuel accordingly. It should be relatively easy to get up and running then fine tuning will take longer but you will really be able to see the engine working well with all the data logging.
Yes Knock module is an add on. Its spendy and it needs to be calibrated to the apex, I only know one source for that and its Martin. I don't believe MBARRY is using the knock module, I know others are not. I think its required for my build but it may not be for all builds. Mine is a trail sled and fueling in random parts of the northwoods, I need the protection. If you're running fresh fuel all the time and high octane its less important.
mbarryracing
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I would venture to say if you are a capable tuner and you are starting out with someone elses trust worthy tune that already starts and runs and it fairly dialed in to begin with, you don't need to hire a guru motec tuner to get it dialed in and make tuning changes. Maybe if you were starting from nothing, a blank map then I'd say pair up with an expert.
Again, there are enough guys on here willing to work with you with the Motec too, a few in this thread like myself, and it's not like you would be starting from scratch.
Martin was very instrumental in getting me up and running in the beginning after I purchased my motec setup from him, help with initial troubleshooting, etc as I was green and could barely spell Motec... but I couldn't see continuing to bothering him by sending him log files to have him make changes in a map for me everytime forever because he just doesn't have that time and really that responsibility fell on me to learn my way around the motec software to become quasi self sufficient. I bought it so I could make the changes and be in control.
Kinger is correct, i do NOT have ESC knock control nor closed loop control. I haven't really pushed the envelope with fuel octane yet, been conservative on the tune at 14-16 psi on always known fresh 91 to 93 R+M/2 pump gas, but starting to get to the point of thinking about pushing things to the limit because i'm now bored. Might consider the knock module.
You can buy the add on module and a generic knock sensor i'm sure from any motec dealer but where the magic happens is in the programmed cal tables that are fine tuned to the Apex engine specifically and that comes from someone who spent the time to develop it. That is where the big $ is spent. You won't get that from a dealer in Arizona tuning PWC's...
Again, there are enough guys on here willing to work with you with the Motec too, a few in this thread like myself, and it's not like you would be starting from scratch.
Martin was very instrumental in getting me up and running in the beginning after I purchased my motec setup from him, help with initial troubleshooting, etc as I was green and could barely spell Motec... but I couldn't see continuing to bothering him by sending him log files to have him make changes in a map for me everytime forever because he just doesn't have that time and really that responsibility fell on me to learn my way around the motec software to become quasi self sufficient. I bought it so I could make the changes and be in control.
Kinger is correct, i do NOT have ESC knock control nor closed loop control. I haven't really pushed the envelope with fuel octane yet, been conservative on the tune at 14-16 psi on always known fresh 91 to 93 R+M/2 pump gas, but starting to get to the point of thinking about pushing things to the limit because i'm now bored. Might consider the knock module.
You can buy the add on module and a generic knock sensor i'm sure from any motec dealer but where the magic happens is in the programmed cal tables that are fine tuned to the Apex engine specifically and that comes from someone who spent the time to develop it. That is where the big $ is spent. You won't get that from a dealer in Arizona tuning PWC's...
kinger
VIP Member
@mbarryracing What safeguards do you have in place? Say you fill up with labeled 91 and its 87, what happens in the Motec?
I am pretty sure you look at IAT's and are retarding timing for that right? When the motor gets heat soaked you can use this to de-power and cool it down.
Anything other tricks you're using to prevent detonation? I know your boost level is safe and your not pushing the envelope yet so maybe you don't even need it at this point.
Myself I will be looking at Knock and cutting boost first, I am going to be able to have the Motec pull boost from 25psi down to 12psi in milliseconds with my close loop boost control. After that I will retard timing and add fuel to get rid of the knock. What I am hoping is that on the dyno I can find out when the motor knocks just from too much boost, say 29psi it finally starts deto, then I will cap it off at something lower like 25, at that point the Motec will keep it at 25psi all the time UNLESS if detects a knock then will cut boost from turbo in 3 psi increments, once its gone then add boost back in until it gets to 25 psi again. With my powertune digitial display it will flash in a huge red screen knock is happening, at that point I can add more Torco ( I plan to build storage on the sled for it) until it gets me back to 25psi (Or whatever I run) to compensate for bad gas. I haven't figured it out yet but I am hoping to build a low octane map that if this occurs and I cannot get the knock out (Say out of Torco or its really crap fuel) then I want the motec to run a 18 psi (as example some boost that is known safe when we test with 87 octane on the dyno) then it won't knock at all and I can continue to hit WOT and even though my RPMs will be down because my clutch is off, I can ride it back to the trailer or good fuel with no issues and hammer on it at that lower PSI.
Sounds good in theory right? LOL We shall see if I can make this 400+hp engine live on the trails for 10,000 miles with no issues that is the goal!
I am pretty sure you look at IAT's and are retarding timing for that right? When the motor gets heat soaked you can use this to de-power and cool it down.
Anything other tricks you're using to prevent detonation? I know your boost level is safe and your not pushing the envelope yet so maybe you don't even need it at this point.
Myself I will be looking at Knock and cutting boost first, I am going to be able to have the Motec pull boost from 25psi down to 12psi in milliseconds with my close loop boost control. After that I will retard timing and add fuel to get rid of the knock. What I am hoping is that on the dyno I can find out when the motor knocks just from too much boost, say 29psi it finally starts deto, then I will cap it off at something lower like 25, at that point the Motec will keep it at 25psi all the time UNLESS if detects a knock then will cut boost from turbo in 3 psi increments, once its gone then add boost back in until it gets to 25 psi again. With my powertune digitial display it will flash in a huge red screen knock is happening, at that point I can add more Torco ( I plan to build storage on the sled for it) until it gets me back to 25psi (Or whatever I run) to compensate for bad gas. I haven't figured it out yet but I am hoping to build a low octane map that if this occurs and I cannot get the knock out (Say out of Torco or its really crap fuel) then I want the motec to run a 18 psi (as example some boost that is known safe when we test with 87 octane on the dyno) then it won't knock at all and I can continue to hit WOT and even though my RPMs will be down because my clutch is off, I can ride it back to the trailer or good fuel with no issues and hammer on it at that lower PSI.
Sounds good in theory right? LOL We shall see if I can make this 400+hp engine live on the trails for 10,000 miles with no issues that is the goal!
