BigMac said:
rockmeister said:
The following is a link to a study of Synthetic oil life, the oil managed to last well over 10,000 miles!
After reading this, I revised the oil change interval on my car to 6,000 miles and don't fret if it goes over a bit.
Wow. That isn't even close to being a scientific study. Among other things, the lack of a control group makes their findings meaningless, and just one more set of anecdotes to add to the already mind-numbing hype and misinformation coming out of the oil companies and their marketing departments.
I do agree that modern engine oils, whether they're group II base stock or PAO-based, provide really good shear stability these days. I go 6000+ miles between oil changes routinely, just like my owner's manual says. And I only use synthetic oil in it in the winter.
Variation between oil filter brands is MUCH wider. One has to be more careful about selecting their oil filter than their oil, IMHO.
Actually anecdotal evidence is something like "I FEEL like my car runs better on Brand X".
Scientific information is generally something you can repeatably and accurately measure.
These are simply guys with common sense actually taking the time to measure and study things that we use everyday.
They sent the samples to a real lab, and provided the real numbers to you and I.
More than you, I, or most here, are willing todo.
Did they do "control groups"? No.
Does that make the information they provided any less valuable? No. Only if you are looking for comparisions.
Cardboard is cardboard. Whether you measure it against steel, paper, plastic or anything else, doesnt change what it is.
Viscosity is viscosity, same as above.
I myself am VERY happy they took the time to answer some of the questions I had about products I use all the time!
Did they answer the question "How well does Mobile1 oil hold up?"
I believe so.
Did I KNOW this before? Not really.
Could they be out and out lying? Possibly.
(Reading the entire site and cross-checking other sources, I doubt they are lying, they were pretty honest about what they found and what they didn't understand. In scientific arenas, showing a willingness to openly say what you don't understand, is usually a good sign of how accurate the balance of the information is.)
Have we been lied to many times in advertising? Yes.
They didn't do a comparision to regular oils in the same conditions. Would regular oils hold up the same?
Possibly. I don't tend to believe that, BUT they could!
However, I KNOW (assuming they were truthful) that Mobile1 and Amsoil WILL!
I am ok with that and willing to put it in my vehicles without a concern on my part.
(The reason I use 6000 miles rather than 10,000 or more, is that I know it lasted 12,000 or so for them in their conditions. I don't know that my conditions are better, or worse, so Im tending to error on the safe side.)
My ONLY concern about Amsoil in my sled is the viscosity rise over time, as this will greatly effect start-up lubrication in the cold.
(This rise in viscosity over time surprises me also, as studies I have read on regular oils show a trend of viscosity dropping over time of use. (Viscosity breakdown) This is usually due to the polymers used to make the viscosity change over temperature, wearing out and the oil returning to the base viscosity. For example a 5w-30 returning to straight 5w. This is why your oil pressure usually tends to drop if your oil is worn out.)
As far as anecdotal evidence is concerned, I feel the W arms on the RX1 are weak.
Do I have a scientific study to prove it? No.
Do I know of many others that have broken? Yes.
Do I have control groups? No, not really.
However, we all have seen enough failures of them to KNOW it is something to watch for, all based on anecdotal evidence.
In some areas, anecdotal evidence is good enough.
My whole purpose in sharing this info was not to say "use this or that!".
It was to show that at least these two synthetics WILL last ok.
And that not ALL filters in a metal can are the same, be careful what you get.
I was personally burned by a bad manufacturer, hoping to save others the trouble and expense it cost me.
Like I said in my first post. I personally use NAPA gold filters, NOT because they are THE best, but simply because I know they are ONE of the better ones, and I can remember that! lol
I don't care to try to remember ALL of them!
Pick a safe one to use that you like and stick to it.
These guys were good enough to get REAL numbers over time.
So in the end, the information these people were willing to collect and offer for our use is SOOO much more than ANY oil company has ever given us.
They have answered, to my satisfaction, some simple questions.
I appreciate that.
