Took my primary off to check the stub shaft bearing/press it back into place. First sign something was wrong was looking at the stub shaft itself - it was obvious that the clutch had been spinning on the shaft. The sled was a habitual roller-eater. Any time I tried doing longer pulls on the lake it felt like it was hitting a wall just past 120 mph. I haven't put the clutch back on to check yet, but that crack goes all the way through, and no doubt gets bigger once the bolt is tightened to 108 ft/lbs. The weights would be trying to force the moveable sheave over a shaft with a now too-large diameter. If it isn't clear from the photo, the crack is on the fixed sheave shaft.
As for cause, I'd guess one of the belts that I blew at speed forced the primary onto the shaft enough to make the fixed sheave fail. Might be worth checking yours if you've blown a few belts and have similar symptoms.
As for cause, I'd guess one of the belts that I blew at speed forced the primary onto the shaft enough to make the fixed sheave fail. Might be worth checking yours if you've blown a few belts and have similar symptoms.
iceback
Pro
Good catch , these sleds turned up need to be inspected after each day of riding to be safe , not that they are not good machines but being pushed beyond orginal power somethings going to give without a upgrade .
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Wow, now that's not a common place for a crack.....or at least it wasn't on past Yamaha clutches
How many miles on it?
Motorhead
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I have had sheaves crack, or sheave wear due to tough or hard rubber belt design, and both were after thousands of miles and years of my abusing them. But have never seen the shaft crack like yours has.
Do you think dual forces at work to cause this, bolt torque holding the clutch on the shaft and the slapping of the clutch when blowing a belt?
Hope this is a very isolated incident that happened to you.
I did check my sheaves for wear and cracks during my pre season maintenance and all looked good, thankfully!
Do you think dual forces at work to cause this, bolt torque holding the clutch on the shaft and the slapping of the clutch when blowing a belt?
Hope this is a very isolated incident that happened to you.
I did check my sheaves for wear and cracks during my pre season maintenance and all looked good, thankfully!
Sled has about 2800 Km on it.
KnappAttack
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Jim,
That is unreal. I believe Yamaha had these clutches and even the 998 engine itself sourced out of China.
One thing I always noticed when installing the SideWinder clutch on the shaft is it always seemed to "ping" when it was being torqued onto the shaft and took a bunch of travel to get it seated onto the shaft at 108 ft. lbs. I always thought the bolt was stretching or going to break prior to it hitting that 108 ft. lbs., but sooner or later it always seated and stopped.
I put on an old RX-1 clutch on my machine last week and noticed no "pinging" or excess travel of the bolt and it seated up right away to 108 ft. lbs. like it was nothing. In my mind I wondered if that was normal to seat up that fast and not act as though the bolt was going to strip or break. Now seeing your broken shaft I wonder if they just used cheap china metal on that winder clutch shaft where it stretches and in your case actually broke. Another thing I noticed with the RX-1 clutch is it sits out away from the engine about 1-1.5mm more than the Winder clutch did. I had to add back in my circlip behind the secondary on the shaft to get it to align properly. Leads me to believe the RX-1 clutch is not "stretching" as its torqued onto the shaft like the Winder does.
I always lap the clutch on the shaft with valve lapping compound every time I put a clutch on to make sure it's seating the whole area and have never had a clutch spin on any engine before. Might be worth a try, but I'm really starting to believe the clutches Yamaha put on the Winder are JUNK, hence the reason I've decided to try the old RX-1 drive clutch and the Viper secondary. Along with the XS825 belt I hope to finally find some good consistent clutching without all the belt and roller failures.
I bet you have an old Apex or RX-1 clutch sitting around! Combine that with the Viper or Nytro secondary!
Anyway I have to try it to see if it's all that everyone who has switched over says it is. I just can't take the stock crap roller issues, blowing and cording all these belts anymore.
That is unreal. I believe Yamaha had these clutches and even the 998 engine itself sourced out of China.
One thing I always noticed when installing the SideWinder clutch on the shaft is it always seemed to "ping" when it was being torqued onto the shaft and took a bunch of travel to get it seated onto the shaft at 108 ft. lbs. I always thought the bolt was stretching or going to break prior to it hitting that 108 ft. lbs., but sooner or later it always seated and stopped.
I put on an old RX-1 clutch on my machine last week and noticed no "pinging" or excess travel of the bolt and it seated up right away to 108 ft. lbs. like it was nothing. In my mind I wondered if that was normal to seat up that fast and not act as though the bolt was going to strip or break. Now seeing your broken shaft I wonder if they just used cheap china metal on that winder clutch shaft where it stretches and in your case actually broke. Another thing I noticed with the RX-1 clutch is it sits out away from the engine about 1-1.5mm more than the Winder clutch did. I had to add back in my circlip behind the secondary on the shaft to get it to align properly. Leads me to believe the RX-1 clutch is not "stretching" as its torqued onto the shaft like the Winder does.
I always lap the clutch on the shaft with valve lapping compound every time I put a clutch on to make sure it's seating the whole area and have never had a clutch spin on any engine before. Might be worth a try, but I'm really starting to believe the clutches Yamaha put on the Winder are JUNK, hence the reason I've decided to try the old RX-1 drive clutch and the Viper secondary. Along with the XS825 belt I hope to finally find some good consistent clutching without all the belt and roller failures.
I bet you have an old Apex or RX-1 clutch sitting around! Combine that with the Viper or Nytro secondary!
Anyway I have to try it to see if it's all that everyone who has switched over says it is. I just can't take the stock crap roller issues, blowing and cording all these belts anymore.
WinterWolf
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Thats about 2000 miles..that’s no miles at all! Holy defective clutch it seems!?? Was it a belt blower? How many belts have you blown? Do you have the extended warranty on the machine? That shouldn’t have happened imo.
Thanks Mike, And I like that lapping idea.
I’ve got a nice RX clutch that I can build up for the weekend. Really tempted to get on the phone with Dave @ Powderlites but going to explore some other options first.
I’ve never seen a clutch fail like this before. One of the things I’ve always like about Yamaha were their clutches; they just always worked. Really like the sled, but this crap is getting old.
I’ve got a nice RX clutch that I can build up for the weekend. Really tempted to get on the phone with Dave @ Powderlites but going to explore some other options first.
I’ve never seen a clutch fail like this before. One of the things I’ve always like about Yamaha were their clutches; they just always worked. Really like the sled, but this crap is getting old.
WinterWolf
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Jim,
That is unreal. I believe Yamaha had these clutches and even the 998 engine itself sourced out of China.
One thing I always noticed when installing the SideWinder clutch on the shaft is it always seemed to "ping" when it was being torqued onto the shaft and took a bunch of travel to get it seated onto the shaft at 108 ft. lbs. I always thought the bolt was stretching or going to break prior to it hitting that 108 ft. lbs., but sooner or later it always seated and stopped.
I put on an old RX-1 clutch on my machine last week and noticed no "pinging" or excess travel of the bolt and it seated up right away to 108 ft. lbs. like it was nothing. In my mind I wondered if that was normal to seat up that fast and not act as though the bolt was going to strip or break. Now seeing your broken shaft I wonder if they just used cheap china metal on that winder clutch shaft where it stretches and in your case actually broke. Another thing I noticed with the RX-1 clutch is it sits out away from the engine about 1-1.5mm more than the Winder clutch did. I had to add back in my circlip behind the secondary on the shaft to get it to align properly. Leads me to believe the RX-1 clutch is not "stretching" as its torqued onto the shaft like the Winder does.
I always lap the clutch on the shaft with valve lapping compound every time I put a clutch on to make sure it's seating the whole area and have never had a clutch spin on any engine before. Might be worth a try, but I'm really starting to believe the clutches Yamaha put on the Winder are JUNK, hence the reason I've decided to try the old RX-1 drive clutch and the Viper secondary. Along with the XS825 belt I hope to finally find some good consistent clutching without all the belt and roller failures.
I bet you have an old Apex or RX-1 clutch sitting around! Combine that with the Viper or Nytro secondary!
Anyway I have to try it to see if it's all that everyone who has switched over says it is. I just can't take the stock crap roller issues, blowing and cording all these belts anymore.
You are correct Knapp...the clutches are complete junk! The Cats aren’t having any of these problems, and there’s the proof. I know the cats in 17 had a few clutches coming apart, but they addressed and warrantied the bad ones, and it’s been good for the Cat guys since. Seems these Yamaha clutches are cheaply made, in many different ways, and can’t stand up to the power that the sled can produce even at stock(205hp) levels. Now if it’s tuned, we’ll just forget it. Maybe the 2020’s have improved/addressed these issues?? I hope so.
It’s too bad because, Yamaha clutching was always so spot on and dependable. My Apex never had even a blip of an issue with clutching, in the 10 years I had it.
It was a belt blower like many were until the offset and clutching were dialed in. I broke 2 belts last year in about 800k, probably blown 6-7 in total since new.
Extended warranty isn’t going to do anything to help this situation. You should read the list of exclusions from Yamaha in your added coverage. I believe the factory warranty is only 90 days on clutches, but I’d have to confirm (just going from memory and it’s been a while).
KnappAttack
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Couldn't agree more! I too almost went to a TAPP as well, but also decided to try what I had sitting on the shelf. Eventually I will also go back and try my PB80 this winter too. That PB80 worked so well on my turbo 1200 it was amazing, and it was quiet and even took down these boosted up winders. So I believe the PB80 will stand up well too.
I'm hoping we can make these things reliable and fast eventually. I've never had such a problem trying to clutch a snowmobile before. And for what these things are supposed to make for power, it should be easier than tougher!
WinterWolf
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Wow..that was a real belt blower. I have about the same mileage as you on my 18 Winder(2400 miles). I blew two in that time. Both at 630 miles-first one was at stock tune, the other the sled was tuned and all aligned/dialed in. The 8JP seems hit or miss too..so that’s not helping imo. After the second belt last March, I made the decision to go with aftermarket/High performance clutching. The stock clutching is the weak link here imo. It can’t harness and handle the torque and HP that the engine produces.
Yamaha chinced on the clutching for this beast...when they should have gone the extra mile and Beefed it up for this type of power.
Put on a Viper or Apex Primary set it forget it will take all you can give it and not eat rollers. Keep an eye on the secondary also had one crack and come apart.
