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HELP: 2006 Apex ER stall issue

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ViperMatt

Veteran
Joined
Jan 8, 2015
Messages
42
Age
40
Country
Canada
Snowmobile
2015 SR Viper XTX SE
2006 Apex ER
***JAN. 30th UPDATE ON SECOND PAGE - POST #24***

Been searching and googling for a similar problem and found one thread but it didn't come out to anything conclusive so was hoping to find some answers or suggestions of what to check to narrow down the problem.

Issue:

Often the engine drops RPMs to near stall or stall after letting off throttle. This happens randomly anytime cold, warm, or hot. Same result from above freezing temps down to -25 Celsius (-13 F). I have watched the RPMs when coming off the throttle and it often gets low (900-1000) and sounds like its in a near stall and kinda "chuckles" rough for a second before coming back up to 1500ish. The times I watched it stall out it hits about 800 then stalls out completely. No error codes, no warning light, nothing abnormal showing on the dash. If I pump the throttle a few times while coming to a stop I can save it from dropping or stalling.

Sometimes on startup it has a bit of a variable idle for the first few minutes, then will maintain around 1500RPM consistently as long as I leave it idle. Had it stall out only once after starting (before changing the plugs - more on that below)

Had the manager at the dealership witness one of these weird stall outs while he was driving it from the shop to the loading ramp. So they aren't blaming it on me or calling BS on me.

No issues, burps, or anything noted while riding. Only happens at start or when coming off the throttle.



Sled background:

Bought it second hand from a dealership. It sat in their back shop for about a year or a little more. They often showed it off to customers and would turn it on briefly, rev it up, let them hear it then shut it down. No actual running out of the shop happened in that time frame. Owner before didn't report this issue (could have selectively left that out to maintain trade in value).

It has somewhere around 12,000-12,500 miles on it (around 20,000 km). Unsure of the exact numbers but if that matters much I can double check later.

No modifications, all stock.



What has been done so far:

Dealership first said the plugs were probably fowled from the show off sessions over the year or so. Pulled the plugs and they were. Replaced those. Resulted in a little bit of improvement on the variable idle after first starting it, but did not fix it.

Ran two tanks of gas (89) through now with seafoam added to clean out the carbon build up. Ran it hard during this time as they recommended (many full pinned runs across the lake). Hasn't improved the variable idle, the dropping RPMs to near stall, nor the stall outs. Happening around the same amount still.

I asked them about the throttle position sensor and they said there would be an error code showing up. Which they said any sensor would show a code, however, I have read on here that this might not always be the case.

Now that I ran the two tanks through with seafoam like they asked, I will be bringing it back in again.

What should I be thinking? What jumps out at you? Have you had this issue? Any suggestions?



I will keep this thread updated to hopefully help someone else out until it's either fixed or I get irritated and get rid of this sled.

Thanks in advance!
 
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Try adjusting the CO setting try -10 first

By: LeadDog
Apex C0 Fuel Adjust:
- Install a wire (or paperclip) from ground to the pale green wire in the connector on the left of the delta box. This wire has no mating wire in the male connector and only needs to be grounded to the Delta Box.




Enter Diagnostic mode:
- With the key and kill switch off, press and hold both "Select and Reset" buttons then power up the gauge by turning both the key and kill switch on.
- Wait 8 seconds and the gauge will go blank except for "DI" in the display.
- Press "Select" to toggle between "DI" and "C0", Select "C0".
- Press and hold both "Select and Reset" 3 seconds
- Gauge will display "C:01", (this is where you select which cylinder you want to adjust)
- Press and hold "Select and Reset" 3 seconds and 0 should appear in the odometer section
- Press "Select" to increase the number (richer), "Reset" to decrease the number (leaner)
- Example: (10 would be richer) (-10 would be leaner)
- Press both "Select and reset" to chose C:02 and adjust the same as above (must do this for each cylinder)

You will want to go RICHER (positive numbers). Generally up 10 will be enough to get past any hesitation or stumble you may run into.

Attached Files:
 
Last edited:
I thick that just the CO setting procedure should be a sticky not that long winded thread. jmo
 
Thanks for the quick replies! I did go through that thread already and kinda got lost in it. I agree TBay Sledhead, if someone can make a summary of that thread and clearly point out the issue and fix that would probably help a lot of people out.

I'll be trying this out either this evening or tomorrow and report back on what happens.

Again, thanks for the replies.
 
My Apex was doing the same thing, I found that I had play in the throttle right at the closed position, What i found was the throttle bodies were not closing all the way, they were dirty and gummed up. remove the airbox and check yours i bet your throttle bodies need a cleaning
 
I agree TBay... It took me some time to go threw that thread but it was very helpful.. A short sticky with people's symptoms and the above possible solution would be helpful to many with higher mileage sleds. My two cents :)
 
I can't seem to get it to switch from DI to CO. Tried it exactly as above and all different button combinations and it doesn't seem to switch over. Any reason for this? Not grounding it out good enough?

EDIT: Disregard this. Had to scrape a spot on the frame for better contact and it worked.
 
Last edited:
Update on what happened. At -10 it wouldn't even start unless I gave a little throttle. Tried the other end and moved them to +10 and it seems to be better so far.

Only thing I'm noticing is that it idles higher now at around 2000RPM vs what I'm used to seeing with it before and with my 2015 viper at 1500RPM. Is this supposed to happen? All 4 were at +3 when I got into the settings. Was 10 too high of a jump? Should I bring it back to 8 maybe? Or is an idle at 2000RPM ok?

Sorry if I'm asking a lot of questions. Not really familiar with 4 strokes or this apex yet. This is my first season with these two sleds.
 
If you remove the left side cover and look in below the black headlight pod mounting bracket you will see a black knob for adjusting the idle speed.
 
Perfect, I'll have a look and play with that.

Thanks again for the help.
 
So, dispite a better idle the stall out issue has now become worse. It will stall out everytime I come off the throttle now. And had two bad starts that I had to give a little bit of throttle to get it going.

I haven't gone into the throttle bodies to see if they're dirty yet, I'll hopefully get to that in the next two days. But before I pull some things apart any ideas on why else to look at or check? I'll see if the plugs are fouled again as well.

I will be going back to the dealer on this as well, but hoping to get things solved with as little run around as possible. So suggest away. Thanks.
 
i'm having the same issues with my 08. I changed the plugs yesterday, gapped them to .018 for my s/c and checked the stator, tps and the coils. everything checked out fine. I tried playing with the idle adjuster, doesn't really do a lot. the sled will run fine at 1800-2000rpm then you hit the throttle it stumbles and away you go.
when I removed my plug because I thought they were fouled? nope, golden brown. I installed new ones anyway but, I think it's an electrical issue of some sort.
i'm curious on what the dealer finds because this problem is really starting to pi$$ me off.
 
It a bad ecu buddys sled did the same thing. Changed everything else (tps,plugs,messed with CO settings and idle knob) Took ECU out of good running sled and ran perfect. Bought a used ECU for hibsman barn of parts works great
 
that's what the yamaha dealer told me today. im going to borrow one from a friend and try theirs to see if that's the problem.
 
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