Secondary issue after cleaning

[ATV PRO #11]

Hi, could use some help here.

Followed the steps in tech folder to clean secondary. Also cleaned primary the other night.
Haven't touched since new last dec and currently have 5500 on the dial.

After cleaning and reassembling "dry" and no lube I was on a long ride yesterday and started to notice my rpms creeping up and speed dropping. I did pull over several times and check temp of prim/sec and I was able to keep my hand on them. On the last 50 it started getting really bad and they were so hot the sweat on my hand sizzled on them. Belt was red hot too.

Pulling apart this morning it seemed, to me, the helix was sticking for some reason. Could barely push it in to get clip off.
Things I noticed:
1)Copper dust like crazy in there.
2)Helix was not moving freely on shaft. Was very hard to get down not smooth at all.
3)Helix did slide smoothly in/on buttons (not assembled, half sheeve only)
4)inner most copper ring (there's two with the grooves) was worn right out. No groove in it at all.


What the heck did I do wrong??
Put 271 on the dial yesterday with some long straight runs I kept rpm in the 11-11500 range.

Will post a few pics shortly.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

Here's a few pics.
The last photo looks to me the belt is not fully where it should be running. Marked it mocking together without spring at full shift out.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

Here's what it looked like after cleaning. 2000grit clean.
Used dishsoap and water. Very hot rinse.
Really cleaned up ramps and sides of helix.
I saw nothing other than buttons needing replacement.

 

[Voda2000]

What did you set the spring to when you reassembled it?

Also did you get the spacers under the main bolt back in? I'm wondering if alignment was off.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

What did you set the spring to when you reassembled it?

Also did you get the spacers under the main bolt back in? I'm wondering if alignment was off.

Yes, set to A1 stock.
All spacers back in exactly the way it came out.

Reading through moosmans help post with setting. Noticed that the belt should be above sheaves. Day 1 it's always been below approx 1/8- 1/16th". A lot of posts indicate setting above is better. I did try that last spring but had that annoying squeal idling in the primary.
Going to double check primary is clean behind nylon slider things allowing to open fully.

 

[Voda2000]

Ya I run my about 1/8" below too.

That's strange. The only time I've had something like that was when my brothers lost the circle clip and the whole thing came apart.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

Clip was intact.
I can rotate secondary flush with primary. Spec calls for .57~.69 for checking offset. Tried both with spring in and spring out. But yet belt clearly didn't bottom right out. Helix gear that slides onto shaft with clip definately was choppy and not sliding freely until I wire brushed. I'm sure that was main issue but what caused it.
Free play is within spec at .048.

I'm wondering if I should have used grease to put back together. Almost seems like one half hung up and once it started rotating it ground up the inner grooved bushings. And just got worse from there.

 

[Voda2000]

I usually use metal polish on the helix and that helps.

Just finalized my conversion to the new style so no more issues with that.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

Helix was shinny like glass on ramps. Very similar on sides. What year secondary did you get? Have to machine or just bolt on?

You had issues too? Similar to mine?

Looking on yamis site I'll have to buy an entire sliding side and may as well do the fixed side. Doesn't show bushings other than the big on the helix glides against.
My 07 has 2.5 times more mileage and I never ever touched it. Still sits in my yard and friend that bought it still walks away from me top end.

 

[Voda2000]

Sounds right for being shiny.

Secondary came off a 97 SX 600. They came with a 43* helix and a green spring, which for my weight is about right.

It did require machining; Extreme Machine in Winnipeg cut the spines down. The spacer from the SX had to be cut down and a new bolt was required.

Never had an issue with my stock one other than it was annoy to change a belt and seem like need to be cleaned all the time. Plus there are not a lot of helix available.

 

[ATV PRO #11]

Gotta ask, your stocker available for purchase?
I found rebuild bushings through royal but don't want the headache of more running around. I'll probably hit up powerhouse in Ldb Monday for the half, buttons and probably helix through Schmidt.
I am in the city in the morning to help a customer then a quote.

Hoping someone still can offer an opinion on what I did wrong. Had it apart 6 times last spring messing with b1, c1 ect. Keep going through what I did the night I cleaned.

 

[MikeWalters]

94-96 vmax 600 direct bolt on, just need longer bolt and a spacer (apex collar cut down) usually come with 41* helix which is good starting point. Cheap cheap cheap on eBay and no machining

 

[Voda2000]

Since I've only got 50 km on the new one I want to hang on to my old one for a while just to make sure things are good. Also, my siblings both ride Phazers so I may keep it for spares for them.

The 96-98 Phazers also work without machining.

I had a hard time finding any YVXs on eBay that were reasonable once shipping was added, especially with the CDN dollar. I ended up getting mine off Kijiji locally.

One thing to consider is if it's an older one you might need to buy bushings vs using a newer one and paying for machining.

A used YVX clutch even with machining may be cheaper than rebuilding yours.

Still can't imagine what caused your problem.

 

[Snowmixer]

I'm wondering if I should have used grease to put back together. Almost seems like one half hung up and once it started rotating it ground up the inner grooved bushings. And just got worse from there.

This was my initial thought, since you mentioned the 'copper dust.' I'm not exactly sure where it came from, but I do remember seeing a copper colored 'residue' or staining on the jackshaft on my sled after removing the secondary, basically what you'd have on there after having a copper-type bushing sliding back and forth over it for a long period of time. Maybe try a little grease on the jackshaft (where the diameter steps up near the bearing) and see if it makes any difference?

 

[ATV PRO #11]

They were perfect before cleaning.
The bushing on the main shaft was ok.
It's the outside bushing in the sliding part of secondary that's pooched. Pic above shows the pile of dust/coarse bushing. There's to much play when reinstalled to run it. I'll probably do more damage.
I'm still thinking I should have greased where it called for it