akvector
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
I will most likely do the exhaust and mine is paid for and the riding I do does not require boost and elevation is not too much of a factor here in ak.
Swelly we do need to ride. Here is my dilema it is crash season in business is in full swing. That being said i really only can ride on weekends.
I am not a big lost lake fan unless we were to go in snug harbor side.
I am riding saturday for essentially the 1st time. riding next sunday somewhere
Swelly we do need to ride. Here is my dilema it is crash season in business is in full swing. That being said i really only can ride on weekends.
I am not a big lost lake fan unless we were to go in snug harbor side.
I am riding saturday for essentially the 1st time. riding next sunday somewhere
casaflyr
Veteran
Another post from a former Yamaha rider. I am still pretty newbie to this sport. I am still learning to ride and have owned or own 3 different sleds from three different manufactures in my short time in this sport. If your heart is set on a Yamaha, then go for it, my Yamaha was more than adequate, but realize that AKrider is pretty realistic in his thoughts. I was getting ready to sink $9K into a used 08...just so I could keep up with the 800s. Your current M7 is a superior machine as it sits right now in just about every way. I'm not trying to put down the Yamaha, it's a great machine in some ways, just not in the ways I was looking for. I think the design is dated and was never really that great to start with. The engine is where it's at with a Yamaha. It's a great reliable power plant that can be heavily modified with very little penalty on reliability.
My laundry list: Clutching, New skid, Track, Supercharger, Airframes, Steering Relocator, Roll over valve, Skinz front end, etc. That's over $9K in accessories. I could have probably pared that list down to Clutching, Skid, Track, Relocator, and Roll over. But that's still $4K, which is basically what I'd give in cash for my M8, a sled that IMO outperforms the Nytro in nearly every way, out of the box.
As hinted to above, I decided last minute (thanks Scott, Jeff) to go another direction:
I found a dealer who was willing to give me what I paid for my used Nytro in trade. I took that plus half of what I would have spent in after market stuff for my Nytro, and ended up with a brand new 2011 AC M8 Ltd. So in contrast to HYFLR, I walked out with a 162hp sled with warranty for under $10K. With the weight savings I'd bet HP to weight, these sleds (turbo Nytro/AC M8) are probably nearly a dead heat, then on top of that the M8 handles better in every way, without any modification. The stock Yamha was truck like compared to this AC, my Ski Doo was truck like compared to the Yamaha, I say this to be fair, it's all relative.
I wanted in EVERY way to prove all of the two smokers wrong that I ride with. They had every excuse and derisive remark, true or not true, that their 2 smoke was superior. Quicker here, better power there, lighter, blah blah blah. They had never ridden a 4 stroke, they were all talking out their @$$. I liked my Yamaha, the four stroke is the future. It's more reliable, much easier on gas. More reliable is a tough thing to hang your hat on though. If you're looking for overall performance, and I think most riders are, then the Nytro needs to be heavily modified. With the SC it would have had the most HP in my group by far. But in the end, the money I would have spent vs the money I spend for equal if not superior handling, and nearly equal power (esp. if you take the weight into consideration) was just not worth it to me.
My laundry list: Clutching, New skid, Track, Supercharger, Airframes, Steering Relocator, Roll over valve, Skinz front end, etc. That's over $9K in accessories. I could have probably pared that list down to Clutching, Skid, Track, Relocator, and Roll over. But that's still $4K, which is basically what I'd give in cash for my M8, a sled that IMO outperforms the Nytro in nearly every way, out of the box.
As hinted to above, I decided last minute (thanks Scott, Jeff) to go another direction:
I found a dealer who was willing to give me what I paid for my used Nytro in trade. I took that plus half of what I would have spent in after market stuff for my Nytro, and ended up with a brand new 2011 AC M8 Ltd. So in contrast to HYFLR, I walked out with a 162hp sled with warranty for under $10K. With the weight savings I'd bet HP to weight, these sleds (turbo Nytro/AC M8) are probably nearly a dead heat, then on top of that the M8 handles better in every way, without any modification. The stock Yamha was truck like compared to this AC, my Ski Doo was truck like compared to the Yamaha, I say this to be fair, it's all relative.
I wanted in EVERY way to prove all of the two smokers wrong that I ride with. They had every excuse and derisive remark, true or not true, that their 2 smoke was superior. Quicker here, better power there, lighter, blah blah blah. They had never ridden a 4 stroke, they were all talking out their @$$. I liked my Yamaha, the four stroke is the future. It's more reliable, much easier on gas. More reliable is a tough thing to hang your hat on though. If you're looking for overall performance, and I think most riders are, then the Nytro needs to be heavily modified. With the SC it would have had the most HP in my group by far. But in the end, the money I would have spent vs the money I spend for equal if not superior handling, and nearly equal power (esp. if you take the weight into consideration) was just not worth it to me.
lund
Pro
I am one to CRITIZING manufacture's, i've been in this sport for well over 30yrs, i'm a professional mountian guide and BRP sponsored hillclimber. I hold no loyalty to any manufactures.
All and all its MY cash that goes in the sled and when i feel a manufacture could do better i'll voice it. KOODO's to anyone that does.
Shame on anyone that is just going for the ride and waits for the new thing's.
There is a HUGE amount of room for improvement on the Yamaha mountian sled, i know Yamaha has the knowhow on doing so.
I love the Nytro and its 4stroke, IMO the best in the industry but i won't just settle for that.
I ride a Nytro because i guide in Revelstoke all winter long and have very little time for maintinance, never mind rebuilds. The Nytro fits the bill but if it wasn't for BOOST and HUGE tracks, i won't own one. In Revy stock Nytro's are anchors and i'ed lose my customer's quickly.
So YES be critical of your brand, it keeps them THINKING.
All and all its MY cash that goes in the sled and when i feel a manufacture could do better i'll voice it. KOODO's to anyone that does.
Shame on anyone that is just going for the ride and waits for the new thing's.
There is a HUGE amount of room for improvement on the Yamaha mountian sled, i know Yamaha has the knowhow on doing so.
I love the Nytro and its 4stroke, IMO the best in the industry but i won't just settle for that.
I ride a Nytro because i guide in Revelstoke all winter long and have very little time for maintinance, never mind rebuilds. The Nytro fits the bill but if it wasn't for BOOST and HUGE tracks, i won't own one. In Revy stock Nytro's are anchors and i'ed lose my customer's quickly.
So YES be critical of your brand, it keeps them THINKING.
cacsrx1
Expert
AKrider said it perfectly in his first reply.....plain and simple, a stock or nearly stock Nytro is a heavy 600 with better than average power.
Hyflyer,
If you want to the Nytro is compare favoribly with a stock 800 2-stroke it takes more than a boosted engine. At $14,500 for a new boosted Nytro you need an aftermarket front end to get the sled to handle better. That is $1,000-$2,000 depending if you want to replace your shocks. Then a guy will want to drop weight, that's a new skid that can easily run over $2000. Then add a lighter battery, different boards, seat, OFT steering relocator (I highly recommend it), roll over valve, Trail Tank and new skis. You get to $20,000 pretty quickly with new parts. A guy doesn't need to buy any of this but if he doesn't, his Nytro will be much heavier and won't handle anywhere as good as a stock 800. At the end of the day you will have a sled that is more reliable motor wise than a high strung 2-stroke twin but it will be more tempremental than compared to stock.
I look at what modded RX-1's go for on Anchorage Craiglist and feel bad for the guys who spent so much money on a sled that is now obsolete. I believe for the same money they could have been riding a new 2-stroke sled every couple years. I guess it's how and when you want to take your loss. A few thousand every year or two or a huge hit at the end of 5 years or more with a Yamaha?
What would help the most is Yamaha providing a better base to build from (a lighter, improved Nytro) or starting over with a clean sheet of paper and they build the 2nd generation of their rider forward 4-stroke. I believe 4-strokes are the future, we just arn't there yet, particurally in the mountain sled segment.
If you want to the Nytro is compare favoribly with a stock 800 2-stroke it takes more than a boosted engine. At $14,500 for a new boosted Nytro you need an aftermarket front end to get the sled to handle better. That is $1,000-$2,000 depending if you want to replace your shocks. Then a guy will want to drop weight, that's a new skid that can easily run over $2000. Then add a lighter battery, different boards, seat, OFT steering relocator (I highly recommend it), roll over valve, Trail Tank and new skis. You get to $20,000 pretty quickly with new parts. A guy doesn't need to buy any of this but if he doesn't, his Nytro will be much heavier and won't handle anywhere as good as a stock 800. At the end of the day you will have a sled that is more reliable motor wise than a high strung 2-stroke twin but it will be more tempremental than compared to stock.
I look at what modded RX-1's go for on Anchorage Craiglist and feel bad for the guys who spent so much money on a sled that is now obsolete. I believe for the same money they could have been riding a new 2-stroke sled every couple years. I guess it's how and when you want to take your loss. A few thousand every year or two or a huge hit at the end of 5 years or more with a Yamaha?
What would help the most is Yamaha providing a better base to build from (a lighter, improved Nytro) or starting over with a clean sheet of paper and they build the 2nd generation of their rider forward 4-stroke. I believe 4-strokes are the future, we just arn't there yet, particurally in the mountain sled segment.
tapex_07
TY 4 Stroke Master
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- '10 Nytro MTX SE IMPULSE 174x3
'14 Viper XTX SE MPI 159x14x1.25
'07 Apex RTX SC2 MPI 128x1
casaflyr said:
IMO, I would most likely be doing all of the listed above to ANY brand anyways. I do agree that they need to come out with something that will actually compete with the other 3. And if Yamaha doesnt step it up with their next release, I may find myself on a ProRMK, with the listed above mods. All sleds get clutched, who doesnt want the best or one of the best tracks, better and lighter skids, some form of "Better Board" aka Airframes, the front end is up for debate but needs shocks, skis most likely too!
Oh and BOOST for sure!!!!!
So to me its, "What you make of what you have." but hey thats my 2 cents.
tapex_07 said:casaflyr said:IMO, I would most likely be doing all of the listed above to ANY brand anyways. I do agree that they need to come out with something that will actually compete with the other 3. And if Yamaha doesnt step it up with their next release, I may find myself on a ProRMK, with the listed above mods. All sleds get clutched, who doesnt want the best or one of the best tracks, better and lighter skids, some form of "Better Board" aka Airframes, the front end is up for debate but needs shocks, skis most likely too!
Oh and BOOST for sure!!!!!
So to me its, "What you make of what you have." but hey thats my 2 cents.
I'm with you on this one.No matter what sled i have I try to get the most out of it and customize it to fit me but I agree yamaha has to come out with something or its a diffrent brand for me too.
casaflyr
Veteran
tapex_07 said:casaflyr said:
IMO, I would most likely be doing all of the listed above to ANY brand anyways. I do agree that they need to come out with something that will actually compete with the other 3. And if Yamaha doesnt step it up with their next release, I may find myself on a ProRMK, with the listed above mods. All sleds get clutched, who doesnt want the best or one of the best tracks, better and lighter skids, some form of "Better Board" aka Airframes, the front end is up for debate but needs shocks, skis most likely too!
Oh and BOOST for sure!!!!!
So to me its, "What you make of what you have." but hey thats my 2 cents.
I thought that I'd probably want to mod anything I had too, and that's how I justified the thought of spending the $9+K on my Yamaha. I mean, I'd better LOVE the sled because that's just a little less cash than I bought a brand new holdover M8 for! I also know now I'll be tweaking the AC as opposed to fixing the Yamaha. Let me break this down:
First of all I'm starting with a much better designed mountain sled. Out of the box this thing blows away the Nytro. I'm not placing band aids on stuff that should have been right from the factory, I'd be adding personal improvements. These aren't must haves, they are wants. To make the Nytro the sled my AC is, expensive improvements become must haves.
Clutching. Yes I'll probably mess with it some, but right now it's set up from AC for 6-9000ft, I ride the Horns, so basically that's right where I want to be. I'm happy with my RPMs, my engagement, my top end, so for now, I'm all set. In the future as I want to tweak things out, I'll be messing around with the clutch. I was told that clutching needed help on the Yamaha.
Skid. I really don't see a need to replace it, it performs, it transfers the power decently, my AC doesn't trench, it stays on top. Yeah I'd save a few lbs, but I'm already way lighter than my Yamaha ever thought of being.
Edit: Track. The M8 comes stock with one of the tracks everyone here seems to be going with. I really don't see a need to change. I've got 150 miles on the new sled now, and there is no evidence of the tips rolling over at all. The Maverick, which is universally vilified, had taken a very noticeable set.
Supercharger. I was looking at a heavy sled with about 130hp, now I have a sled that's a lot lighter with 162hp, it's not 200, but the sled doesn't weight 600+ either. My 162hp, or whatever it is up high, has been great for my newbie riding style. The Yamaha wasn't noticeably underpowered to me either, but I guessing it would have revealed itself as I got better and demanded more from my machine.
Airframes. Nice, really Nice. Probably better at shedding snow than any other board out there. My AC boards work pretty well, my buddies stock boards are all iced up, but I just stomp a couple of times, kick a couple and I'm basically clean. I just can't see spending the $475 now. The AC boards work, not as well as Airframes, but they do a pretty darn good job. The AC boards are worlds stiffer than the stock Nytro boards too. Very happy, and probably will stay that way for quite a while, the earlier M8 boards definitely needed some help, AC has redesigned them and they shed snow pretty well now.
Steering Relocator. No need, body position is great. Probably need to add stiffener in the future though. Weak spot in the AC, but weak spot in the Nytro and a must have for better body position.
Roll over tether. No need again. AFAIK, I can roll this thing over, pull it back on it's skis and pull the cord (if it's stopped) and go right back to it. My Yamaha went past about 60 degrees in a carve, got an oil light. Definitely a must have, definitely a flaw in the Nytro, rolling out of a stuck is very common.
Skinz front end. The AC front end works. No need or want for a change here. If I were to do it, it would be for a weight weenie thing as opposed to making the Nytro close to what I already have.
I'll certainly play around with my M8 changing this or that. I enjoy tinkering with stuff. I'll do it a little at a time when I feel like doing it. The point is, it's very very good right now. I have great power, not TC or SC power but great none the less. I felt a bit overwhelmed with the Yamaha. I was getting a lot of feedback here as to what was necessary just to make it decent. It added up to a lot of money very quickly. I am ecstatic with my M8 right out of the box. I haven't done a thing to it to improve performance, all I've done is put some MA rails on it and carry what I need for the day. Even that was daunting on the Yamaha, the exhaust threatened to burn my stuff up.
It sounds like I'm ripping on Yamaha, but, really, I'm just trying to be honest. I really want Yamaha to come out with a great mountain sled. I'd be in line to buy it. The power plant is worth it, the $$ to fix something that should already be good from the factory is frustrating. Hopefully we'll see a new mountain design that does it all well. The M8 is already pretty universally known as a great mountain sled. RMKs and XPs are great too. I'd love to see Yamaha blow right past all of them, I'm waiting patiently.
Great way to sum things up casaflyr. The stock 800's are so good out of the crate that a guy doesn't need to do much to them. A Nytro to compete at the 800 level requires a lot of money, parts & time.
If a guy stays at the 600 level than you can ride it stock or close to stock and receive all the benefits of a 4-stroke.
If a guy stays at the 600 level than you can ride it stock or close to stock and receive all the benefits of a 4-stroke.
lund
Pro
Interesting and understandable but in reality a little misunderstood and misleading.
The Nytro in the hands of an inexperienced mountian rider, new mountian rider or rider that just doesn't get the seat time in the mountian's. The key is mountian's and plain years of experience will NEVER be great at handling the Nytro.
Fact is the new 2strokes like the XP's and Pro's are kids toy's and make poor rider's look good thus why many won't have a Nytro.
Here in Revelstoke and Sicamous a very large portion of the extreme rider's or better, not the extreme but "ELITE" group ride NYTRO'S(modified boosted sleds). Why?
Nothing on snow can touch them, though you have to know how to ride at that level, most cannot.
In the hand's of an experienced highly skilled rider, the Nytro is FAR ahead in many way's. Just that the majority will never reach that level and might be best on something easier to ride. Though there is room for improvement with Yamaha's Nytro when it come to mountian use.
Personnaly alot of the mods listed, are realy not needed and its personnal preferance. Mods won't make you a superstar if you already are not, i can assure you.
The Nytro in the hands of an inexperienced mountian rider, new mountian rider or rider that just doesn't get the seat time in the mountian's. The key is mountian's and plain years of experience will NEVER be great at handling the Nytro.
Fact is the new 2strokes like the XP's and Pro's are kids toy's and make poor rider's look good thus why many won't have a Nytro.
Here in Revelstoke and Sicamous a very large portion of the extreme rider's or better, not the extreme but "ELITE" group ride NYTRO'S(modified boosted sleds). Why?
Nothing on snow can touch them, though you have to know how to ride at that level, most cannot.
In the hand's of an experienced highly skilled rider, the Nytro is FAR ahead in many way's. Just that the majority will never reach that level and might be best on something easier to ride. Though there is room for improvement with Yamaha's Nytro when it come to mountian use.
Personnaly alot of the mods listed, are realy not needed and its personnal preferance. Mods won't make you a superstar if you already are not, i can assure you.
casaflyr
Veteran
What I am getting here is that you say it takes a VERY special skill set to be able to handle a Nytro, I am also getting that through years of experience you have that special skill set. I appreciate and respect that. I think the years of experience are the key here, those years make it possible for you to ride the Nytro to a very high level. It's mostly the experience, not so much the sled.
At the same time, and maybe I'm reading between the lines too much here, I am feeling a condescending tone that smacks of attitude. I know at my skill level, which isn't much, I find the newer 2 stroke mountain sleds a lot easier to ride. And on top of that I can't for the life of me think of why I'd want something that is more difficult to ride...unless there is a performance payoff on the other end. I think the fact that the newer sleds make poor riders look good IS good. That means they've done their job, they've made a good simple handling snowmobile. Yeah, maybe they'll get themselves in over their heads, and the consequences of that might be really bad, but that's not really the fault of the sled, is it? And in the end, the essence of the rider will shine through, and mitigate any advantage or hinderance inherent in the sled, no matter if kids toy or manly sled.
What I gathered from your first post in this thread was that:
-you wouldn't own a Nytro if it weren't for boost and big tracks (boost and big track are on my list, and they cost a lot of money, money I don't have to spend on my kids toy)
-a stock Nytro is a boat anchor and very difficult to ride (I think that's basically the same thing I said)
-you guide with a Nytro because it's maintenance requirements are small, and you haven't got the time for the MX and that makes it a perfect sled for you (I think the biggest Yammi advantage is from the four-stroke, bomb proof engine, and I've also said that)
Again, maybe reading between the lines too much, but from that post, it sounds like the Nytro is a somewhat ill handling sled, and requires a fair amount of money to bring it to be a rideable sled for anyone, including the "elite". So, I can conclude that you'd be riding something else if it weren't for you spending at least $5K on your Nytro (to make it into something else). If you didn't, couldn't, or wouldn't (let's say boost wasn't available and the CE or PC track wasn't available), put the $5K into the Nytro; then, would you be riding a "kids toy" today?
The majority will never be "elite" highly skilled riders, most of us are weekend warriors and will always opt for something easier to ride. We have neither the time nor in some cases the physical ability to be "elite". I still wonder why I or anyone would purposely ride something that was more difficult, just because it was more difficult. Maybe there is a performance payoff in the end for the Nytro, maybe it becomes a Ferrari in the right hands, after years of experience. I've never heard that sentiment from anyone until now, and I'm not really sure if that's really what I'm hearing here. I do know it felt much like a 1970 Power Wagon in my decidedly non elite hands, and my M8 feels more like maybe...a Corolla? It's not a sports car, but it's not a truck either, the M8 just feels...good.
In my research here the listed mods were the mods I was told would make the difference on my Nytro. I am inexperienced, and I had to rely on the experience of others to come up with those mods. I was in no way deluded into thinking that those mods were suddenly going to change my riding level or ability, nothing would really do that except more riding. I still stand by that list, the post speaks for itself. Each item was suggested to me to make the differences I needed to in order to level the field with the 800 2 strokes. You even admit, you NEED a track and boost. Even just those two things add up to quite an investment, then for me I'm still left with a lot of other little, maybe some big, some real, some perceived, Nytro shortcomings. Maybe a Nytro is worth it all if there's a great sled at the other end. I haven't seen or heard much more than anecdotal evidence that a great payoff exists.
At the same time, and maybe I'm reading between the lines too much here, I am feeling a condescending tone that smacks of attitude. I know at my skill level, which isn't much, I find the newer 2 stroke mountain sleds a lot easier to ride. And on top of that I can't for the life of me think of why I'd want something that is more difficult to ride...unless there is a performance payoff on the other end. I think the fact that the newer sleds make poor riders look good IS good. That means they've done their job, they've made a good simple handling snowmobile. Yeah, maybe they'll get themselves in over their heads, and the consequences of that might be really bad, but that's not really the fault of the sled, is it? And in the end, the essence of the rider will shine through, and mitigate any advantage or hinderance inherent in the sled, no matter if kids toy or manly sled.
What I gathered from your first post in this thread was that:
-you wouldn't own a Nytro if it weren't for boost and big tracks (boost and big track are on my list, and they cost a lot of money, money I don't have to spend on my kids toy)
-a stock Nytro is a boat anchor and very difficult to ride (I think that's basically the same thing I said)
-you guide with a Nytro because it's maintenance requirements are small, and you haven't got the time for the MX and that makes it a perfect sled for you (I think the biggest Yammi advantage is from the four-stroke, bomb proof engine, and I've also said that)
Again, maybe reading between the lines too much, but from that post, it sounds like the Nytro is a somewhat ill handling sled, and requires a fair amount of money to bring it to be a rideable sled for anyone, including the "elite". So, I can conclude that you'd be riding something else if it weren't for you spending at least $5K on your Nytro (to make it into something else). If you didn't, couldn't, or wouldn't (let's say boost wasn't available and the CE or PC track wasn't available), put the $5K into the Nytro; then, would you be riding a "kids toy" today?
The majority will never be "elite" highly skilled riders, most of us are weekend warriors and will always opt for something easier to ride. We have neither the time nor in some cases the physical ability to be "elite". I still wonder why I or anyone would purposely ride something that was more difficult, just because it was more difficult. Maybe there is a performance payoff in the end for the Nytro, maybe it becomes a Ferrari in the right hands, after years of experience. I've never heard that sentiment from anyone until now, and I'm not really sure if that's really what I'm hearing here. I do know it felt much like a 1970 Power Wagon in my decidedly non elite hands, and my M8 feels more like maybe...a Corolla? It's not a sports car, but it's not a truck either, the M8 just feels...good.
In my research here the listed mods were the mods I was told would make the difference on my Nytro. I am inexperienced, and I had to rely on the experience of others to come up with those mods. I was in no way deluded into thinking that those mods were suddenly going to change my riding level or ability, nothing would really do that except more riding. I still stand by that list, the post speaks for itself. Each item was suggested to me to make the differences I needed to in order to level the field with the 800 2 strokes. You even admit, you NEED a track and boost. Even just those two things add up to quite an investment, then for me I'm still left with a lot of other little, maybe some big, some real, some perceived, Nytro shortcomings. Maybe a Nytro is worth it all if there's a great sled at the other end. I haven't seen or heard much more than anecdotal evidence that a great payoff exists.
sonds
Lifetime Member
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- Oct 7, 2008
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- Golden Valley MN
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- ductworksmn.com
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- USA
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- 08 T-Nytro
lund said:
Agree 100%
Casa,
I know Lund, and consider him a friend...your reading way too much into things, and your making a common mistake on forums...we are not trying to do anything but inform...and since your not the original thread owner, if you have questions and concerns of your own, start your own thread...(no offense intended, just don't hijack Dirtmovers thread)
As to Lund's comments....yes he is clearly an elite rider, but you have to remember also, he lives in one of the most premiere areas to ride in the world...life is radically different when you are a flat lander heading out west, vs. someone that lives here works in the industry, and rides 3-5 times every week 6 months of the year...
It is a lot like any sport, if you compete in city league, you might be the best in that city, but when you compete against pro's you realize the landscape is radically different....
It is a different league doing downhill powder turns....above a 500 foot cliff to make to the pristine pow...or having to make the line or lose the sled...or dropping into a canyon to try and help some people get out who got in over their heads...
Guys like Lund...and a few others on here are the people you want with you when the crap hits the fan...
And, he is spot on with the comments on the Nytro...I am the type that is going to mod the crap out of any sled I buy, and will more than likely drop $5-9k in mods and upgrades on top of purchase price...which means if your going to spend the money anyways, you might as well get the best platform to build upon, and there is NOT a better platform than the Nytro...
I am hoping the M1100t is the next best platform ...as that is what I am dropping my leg on this year...
However, I would not hesitate to have a Nytro again, but would require Skinz front end, Timbersled, and BOOST...which all of which I require for every sled I ride...once you get those luxuries, you cannot go back!!!
I know Lund, and consider him a friend...your reading way too much into things, and your making a common mistake on forums...we are not trying to do anything but inform...and since your not the original thread owner, if you have questions and concerns of your own, start your own thread...(no offense intended, just don't hijack Dirtmovers thread)
As to Lund's comments....yes he is clearly an elite rider, but you have to remember also, he lives in one of the most premiere areas to ride in the world...life is radically different when you are a flat lander heading out west, vs. someone that lives here works in the industry, and rides 3-5 times every week 6 months of the year...
It is a lot like any sport, if you compete in city league, you might be the best in that city, but when you compete against pro's you realize the landscape is radically different....
It is a different league doing downhill powder turns....above a 500 foot cliff to make to the pristine pow...or having to make the line or lose the sled...or dropping into a canyon to try and help some people get out who got in over their heads...
Guys like Lund...and a few others on here are the people you want with you when the crap hits the fan...
And, he is spot on with the comments on the Nytro...I am the type that is going to mod the crap out of any sled I buy, and will more than likely drop $5-9k in mods and upgrades on top of purchase price...which means if your going to spend the money anyways, you might as well get the best platform to build upon, and there is NOT a better platform than the Nytro...
I am hoping the M1100t is the next best platform ...as that is what I am dropping my leg on this year...
However, I would not hesitate to have a Nytro again, but would require Skinz front end, Timbersled, and BOOST...which all of which I require for every sled I ride...once you get those luxuries, you cannot go back!!!
casaflyr
Veteran
Well I'm sorry, I though I was on subject, and just responding to comments made to me on this thread.
I'm out.
I'm out.
I took Lunds post the same way as Casaflyr so I want to be careful here as I'm not interested in getting into a pissing match. My view is if the Nytro was such a great sled with whatever is consider to be the ideal set of modifications, a lot more people would be riding them AND doing well on them. The Nytro would dominate hillclimb competitions but it doesn't, it would be in all kinds of freeride snowmachine videos but it isn't, and there would be a lot more of them out on the snow, which there are not.
We've had high performance 4-strokes for 10 years now and the idea still hasn't really caught on, especially in mountain riding where light weight is very important. I look at the Nytro like where 4-stroke dirt bikes were in the 80's. It's like an XR 600 or TT 600. Heavy, reliable, makes good power but requires a lot of mods to compete on the same level as a 2-stroke. We are currently without our break through, game changing, YZ 400F type sled. The Yamaha YZ 400F is the bike that started the entire 4-stroke revolution in motocross back in '98. Yamaha did an excellent job marketing the Nytro as that sled when Robbie won the first sno-x national. Unfortunately for the majority of the snowmachine market's potential buyers the Nytro has not lived up to expectations. Hopefully the next generation of Yamaha snowmachine will be bring things to the next level. Yamaha HAS to do something as they are losing market share. They are the OEM with the most to gain by coming out with a ground breaking 4-stroke sled. Doo hasn't done anything since the 1200 and it's pretty much the same sled as it was in '09. Polaris doesn't seem to care about 4-strokes. Cat is trying but they really don't have an engine that compares.
I bought into the whole 4-stroke thing back in '05 and still love the reliability and dependability of the motors. But, it is silly (I'm speaking in general here, not to anyone in particular) to be so closed minded to the competitive sleds. Riding something that is lighter, better handling, easier to ride and get unstuck and performs better right out of the crate is appealing to anyone.
I hope we didn't scare the OP away?
We've had high performance 4-strokes for 10 years now and the idea still hasn't really caught on, especially in mountain riding where light weight is very important. I look at the Nytro like where 4-stroke dirt bikes were in the 80's. It's like an XR 600 or TT 600. Heavy, reliable, makes good power but requires a lot of mods to compete on the same level as a 2-stroke. We are currently without our break through, game changing, YZ 400F type sled. The Yamaha YZ 400F is the bike that started the entire 4-stroke revolution in motocross back in '98. Yamaha did an excellent job marketing the Nytro as that sled when Robbie won the first sno-x national. Unfortunately for the majority of the snowmachine market's potential buyers the Nytro has not lived up to expectations. Hopefully the next generation of Yamaha snowmachine will be bring things to the next level. Yamaha HAS to do something as they are losing market share. They are the OEM with the most to gain by coming out with a ground breaking 4-stroke sled. Doo hasn't done anything since the 1200 and it's pretty much the same sled as it was in '09. Polaris doesn't seem to care about 4-strokes. Cat is trying but they really don't have an engine that compares.
I bought into the whole 4-stroke thing back in '05 and still love the reliability and dependability of the motors. But, it is silly (I'm speaking in general here, not to anyone in particular) to be so closed minded to the competitive sleds. Riding something that is lighter, better handling, easier to ride and get unstuck and performs better right out of the crate is appealing to anyone.
I hope we didn't scare the OP away?
