I've seen many LTX and XTX with a turbo, but haven't noticed much chatter from RTX owners with turbo.
Seems the XTX is a wheelie machine due to the uncoupled skid. The LTX is reportedly overly coupled/planted. The RTX is said to transfer much better? I'm curious how the RTX handles the turbo in relation to transfer and ditch running? My ditch banging days should be over, but I am looking for that nice extra "squirt" to launch over berms etc without overly harsh landing caused by nose heavy weight. The ability to get the nose up on command would be quite handy.
REALLY tempted by the Yamaha turbo deal...
Seems the XTX is a wheelie machine due to the uncoupled skid. The LTX is reportedly overly coupled/planted. The RTX is said to transfer much better? I'm curious how the RTX handles the turbo in relation to transfer and ditch running? My ditch banging days should be over, but I am looking for that nice extra "squirt" to launch over berms etc without overly harsh landing caused by nose heavy weight. The ability to get the nose up on command would be quite handy.
REALLY tempted by the Yamaha turbo deal...
Yamahatim & I ran into a guy up in the Yooper with a turbo on the shorty cannot remember his name on here but hopefully he is listening in (or watching) I cannot remember his reasons but he was not happy with his. I have to say at that time I was not happy with mine either. I think he was getting a lot of track spin and did not feel that he was getting the HP out of it he was promissed.
I am not sure even with the turbo on the shorty you will get the squirt sled your looking for. Mine will lift the nose on command but still cannot just ride up to an approach and launch it. The nose is going to be heavy on all of these because of the motor. When I am frisky i break out the Pro r 800 with only 154 hp it is so light that I jump every road I come too. Just a flick of the flipper it takes off and then comes down like a feather. The Viper lifts the nose but when it gets in the air the nose drops hard and always lands heavy on the skis. My right wrist is still in bad shape due to a landing after jumping a plow berm and landing on the other side on the front bumper. I almost did a Superman and ran over myself
Some of us that bought the 1st year model sled and turbo packages did not know what to expect and were thinking that these would be monsters with the 6#'s of boost. In actuallity until I got gauges and found out I was only at 4.5#'s the sled was only slightly faster than the stock ones. With all of the clutching, belt and other issues to staighten out there was almost a full season of work to get it dialed in. And with mine being in the shop so much for all kinds of problems including blowing up, the season ended without seeing the full potential.
Because the Nytro had a long run the kits were bullit proof in the latter years with spot on clutch kits but they took a bit to get the recipe down at first. Heck I put a bender rear turbo on an RX-1 and played with it for 3 yrs and only got it running right 2 or 3 times then it would blow the intercooler clean off and have to limp it back to the trailer. Back then the temperature, humidity and elevation would change requiring jetting changes and HP could fluctuate 30 to 40 hp causing the clutching to be way off.
I am not sure even with the turbo on the shorty you will get the squirt sled your looking for. Mine will lift the nose on command but still cannot just ride up to an approach and launch it. The nose is going to be heavy on all of these because of the motor. When I am frisky i break out the Pro r 800 with only 154 hp it is so light that I jump every road I come too. Just a flick of the flipper it takes off and then comes down like a feather. The Viper lifts the nose but when it gets in the air the nose drops hard and always lands heavy on the skis. My right wrist is still in bad shape due to a landing after jumping a plow berm and landing on the other side on the front bumper. I almost did a Superman and ran over myself
Some of us that bought the 1st year model sled and turbo packages did not know what to expect and were thinking that these would be monsters with the 6#'s of boost. In actuallity until I got gauges and found out I was only at 4.5#'s the sled was only slightly faster than the stock ones. With all of the clutching, belt and other issues to staighten out there was almost a full season of work to get it dialed in. And with mine being in the shop so much for all kinds of problems including blowing up, the season ended without seeing the full potential.
Because the Nytro had a long run the kits were bullit proof in the latter years with spot on clutch kits but they took a bit to get the recipe down at first. Heck I put a bender rear turbo on an RX-1 and played with it for 3 yrs and only got it running right 2 or 3 times then it would blow the intercooler clean off and have to limp it back to the trailer. Back then the temperature, humidity and elevation would change requiring jetting changes and HP could fluctuate 30 to 40 hp causing the clutching to be way off.
rbell14
TY 4 Stroke Guru
The last post has adequately scared me from adding the turbo. So many unknowns, tough decisions...
There are 2 guys here that partially induced a lot of their own failures so their comments could be taken with a grain of salt.
Yes when you have the reccomended dealer install your turbo and it blows up blame it on the owner - the second one blew up while the installer was riding it so put that in your margarita and drink it!!!! If by inducing a failure is riding it then I am guilty!!!!
The sled had problems from day 1 dropping cylinders averyone said it was electrical not motor. th time it dropped cylinder it blew a hole between 2 cylinders a typical lean condidtion even though at WOT the AFR was reading 11.4.
It hurt $$$$ but now with the wisco pistons and carillo rods and other parts inclding new block and valves it is everything I wanted from day 1 with 9#'s of boost I will never have to change wear bars cause the skis are never on the ground and is an effective tool for looking for racoon and squirells in the tree tops
The only problem is night riding I cannot set the headlight to shine on the trail when under power.
This was not the fault of the turbo.
Continuing to operate a machine that is "dropping cylinders" is a definite contributor.
My comments are not meant to be negative or demean anybody. I'm just looking at this objectively. Looking at the vast number of turbo installs w/o grief that were installed properly and left alone, the failure rate is zero that I have seen.
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The motor was dropping cylinders from 150 miles on did it 3 times out too 400 miles (the first time was on the first TY ride in Houghton/Hancock, MI) . I never touched anything (controller or boost) until 450 miles I added gauges and found out that mine was set at 4.5#'s of boost. After talking to both THE INSTALLER and Matt at MPI they both told me to turn up the waste gate to reach 6#'s. Then the clutching was off for the new HP and I took the sled it to have the clutching re-done and 3 warranty items fixed. After that point I had several more cylinder drops (each time I called both Matt and the installer), 1 time a quart of oil blew out the vent hose onto the hot exhaust and made calls again no one had any concern.
When it blew I dropped it off at the installers and his findings - so he says was the line to the boost gauge got against the heat shield and burnt a pin hole in the line which confused the ECU - but I had the line zip tied to the frame rail and that was impossible unless they cut it loose to pull the hood for the warranty work when they had it because all of the connections were inside the mesh cover behind the bars and did not require cutting them lose to pull the hood.
Even at 6#'s of boost I carried fuel 93 octane even though it supposedly was not required and only 2 times filled up with store bought gas, once at the Marathon Station on the ride in Hancock and 1 time at Pats Yamaha in Greenland on that ride (after it dropped a cylinder the 1st time). It was running so fat at 4.5#'s the sled was getting less than 9 miles per gallon.
I wanted to ride the thing so I had to agree to the findings (and pay for it) to get the motor built and back on the trails, the only other option was a lengthy battle.
I can tell you that after dropping it off at Ulmers and finding out that there are 3 bolts missing, the one for the front frame tube that is replaced to fit the turbo, 1 exhaust bolt and even the retainging bolt on the arm on the clutch (that could have been catastrophic) with only 3 days of riding on it after I got it back. I have no faith in the installer, not to mention everytime it came back it was missing fasteners on the body work.
And at 52 years old and bad back and hips if you say I ride too hard I will take that as a compliment
When it blew I dropped it off at the installers and his findings - so he says was the line to the boost gauge got against the heat shield and burnt a pin hole in the line which confused the ECU - but I had the line zip tied to the frame rail and that was impossible unless they cut it loose to pull the hood for the warranty work when they had it because all of the connections were inside the mesh cover behind the bars and did not require cutting them lose to pull the hood.
Even at 6#'s of boost I carried fuel 93 octane even though it supposedly was not required and only 2 times filled up with store bought gas, once at the Marathon Station on the ride in Hancock and 1 time at Pats Yamaha in Greenland on that ride (after it dropped a cylinder the 1st time). It was running so fat at 4.5#'s the sled was getting less than 9 miles per gallon.
I wanted to ride the thing so I had to agree to the findings (and pay for it) to get the motor built and back on the trails, the only other option was a lengthy battle.
I can tell you that after dropping it off at Ulmers and finding out that there are 3 bolts missing, the one for the front frame tube that is replaced to fit the turbo, 1 exhaust bolt and even the retainging bolt on the arm on the clutch (that could have been catastrophic) with only 3 days of riding on it after I got it back. I have no faith in the installer, not to mention everytime it came back it was missing fasteners on the body work.
And at 52 years old and bad back and hips if you say I ride too hard I will take that as a compliment
OK now just take a look back at the post from rbell14. Your post effectively scared him off based on your bad experience which was directly attributable to installation error and maybe more.
Why anyone would recommend continuing to ride a machine that was misfiring is beyond me. And to turn up boost without first fixing the issue???
I think that the morale of the story is don't have a turbo installed by (a) "Ha_ck"
rbell14,
I'd suggest calling out to Matt at MPI and have a chat with him. He can tell you about the new electronic wastegate control or better yet maybe he can post some pics here or on the MPI web site (hint hint)
Yamaha made them jump through a lot of hoops to get approval so I'd say that this setup will be ultra reliable.
Why anyone would recommend continuing to ride a machine that was misfiring is beyond me. And to turn up boost without first fixing the issue???
I think that the morale of the story is don't have a turbo installed by (a) "Ha_ck"
rbell14,
I'd suggest calling out to Matt at MPI and have a chat with him. He can tell you about the new electronic wastegate control or better yet maybe he can post some pics here or on the MPI web site (hint hint)
Yamaha made them jump through a lot of hoops to get approval so I'd say that this setup will be ultra reliable.
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Already getting the electronic controller and adding 4th injector by next week it will be 12#'s of boost & close to 250 hp to run with the big dogs. Ulmer has taken over and is going through it stem to stern!!!!
The problem is the only way to set these up properly is on a track dyno at WOT on 9#'s it was so wicked you could not focus on the AFR because at 40 mph on up it would stand on the tail and threaten to blow over, you could not take your eyes off the trail which you had to do by looking down the side of the bodywork -But that is getting corrected when I get it back. I am coupling the rear suspension and adding Axis shocks
That's not an issue for those of us looking for a simple out of the box install and go setup. That is what this discussion is about or so I thought. True I may end up turning up the wick a bit, but the commentary about major catastrophic issues with non standard setups seems to be scaring off prospective buyers.
This was originally supposed to be the basic out of the box and install and go set up the 180 kit is advertised at 6#'s of boost!!!!
What I did after the motor blew is not for a stock motor. I added carillo rods, low comp pistons new waste gate and larger flow fuel pump to get it to 9#'s and now adding controller and 4th injector to go to 12#'s
What I did after the motor blew is not for a stock motor. I added carillo rods, low comp pistons new waste gate and larger flow fuel pump to get it to 9#'s and now adding controller and 4th injector to go to 12#'s
rbell14
TY 4 Stroke Guru
Appreciate all the info and do plan to discuss with MPI reps. I also want to ensure the. Installer is reputable and knows how to do this perfectly for the out of the box set-up...
I'm very interested but continue to research...
I'm very interested but continue to research...
YamahaTim
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I would only have to assume, that I am the other person that had issues with my sled this year. Well as I have always stated in every post is that this is not a Turbo issue! Belt issue could of happened from the extra HP, but the dealer that put the turbo in should of accounted for that! So no fault to the Turbo, oil seporator is not on the turbo. Everyone has one, but mine was moved. Was that the problem who knows. All I know is that they now have a fix for that on the trail turbo. So that should not be an issue. My other issue was the gauge, that I bought at the same dealer that installed my turbo. They recommend this gauge as well as put it in.
Now with them riding my sled countless times to figure out my belt issues, they were at WOT a lot of the time and they trusted the gauge. I went through 4 belts, so they ran it hard a lot. And when I was having running issues the Owner was riding my sled at the time about 5, 1/2 mile wot runs, at the third run he said I was running rich and he could not get it to run any leaner. Then by the fifth run it was spraying out antifreeze. And he never took responsibility for the gauge reading false readings. Even after the Viper was fixed with 3 new pistons and two head gaskets put back on the gauge was reading the same. They still would not take responsibility for the gauge. Now me and Tom had tons of conversations about this gauge and it's In proper readings. So I ran mine rich on purpose. But again I never said anything bad about the MPI turbo, in fact I always say how great I think the kit is and how helpful the guys at MPI are!!
I agree with Steve(YamaDog) on this and that is that on 4.5 pounds it just doesn't seam to have an extra 45 HP. Even at 6 pounds it's fast, but not almost 50% more HP fast. Now I didn't have the clutches perfect, but it was close. And Matt at MPI helped me with my clutching. But for 2 years of warranty and 2200 dollars for 45 hp is going to be fun on any of the Vipers. The RTX should be fun with some extra movement in the suspension. For anyone extra HP is a good thing!! And I hope these kits provide you with what you are looking for! But the MPI kit is a great kit and I would buy it again.
I just think the Viper itself needs to be improved, not the turbo! When they do get the bugs ironed out I will be buying another one. And it would be another LTX. Good luck to anyone that buys this kit or any of the kits MPI provides! Just BE CAREFUL who puts it in!! Cause that was my major mistake!
Now with them riding my sled countless times to figure out my belt issues, they were at WOT a lot of the time and they trusted the gauge. I went through 4 belts, so they ran it hard a lot. And when I was having running issues the Owner was riding my sled at the time about 5, 1/2 mile wot runs, at the third run he said I was running rich and he could not get it to run any leaner. Then by the fifth run it was spraying out antifreeze. And he never took responsibility for the gauge reading false readings. Even after the Viper was fixed with 3 new pistons and two head gaskets put back on the gauge was reading the same. They still would not take responsibility for the gauge. Now me and Tom had tons of conversations about this gauge and it's In proper readings. So I ran mine rich on purpose. But again I never said anything bad about the MPI turbo, in fact I always say how great I think the kit is and how helpful the guys at MPI are!!
I agree with Steve(YamaDog) on this and that is that on 4.5 pounds it just doesn't seam to have an extra 45 HP. Even at 6 pounds it's fast, but not almost 50% more HP fast. Now I didn't have the clutches perfect, but it was close. And Matt at MPI helped me with my clutching. But for 2 years of warranty and 2200 dollars for 45 hp is going to be fun on any of the Vipers. The RTX should be fun with some extra movement in the suspension. For anyone extra HP is a good thing!! And I hope these kits provide you with what you are looking for! But the MPI kit is a great kit and I would buy it again.
I just think the Viper itself needs to be improved, not the turbo! When they do get the bugs ironed out I will be buying another one. And it would be another LTX. Good luck to anyone that buys this kit or any of the kits MPI provides! Just BE CAREFUL who puts it in!! Cause that was my major mistake!
YamahaTim
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I know you will be happy with MPI's kit, and there customer service! They are awesome! Like I always say. Just make sure to account for the 8DN belt and the work that Allen does to get the clutching done right. It seems he has the set up spot on. So there is more to look at besides the 3200 dollar price of the turbo trail kit. I don't think you have to worry about gauges with 4.5 pounds. Just use good fuel. 91 non oxy or 92, 91. Anything less I would ride with a little less throttle.
