wide band sensor test

[boostedmayhem]

I need some help with wide band sensor, I know its been talked about alot on here and how to test has been shown, heres what the test results were when I tested mine, the tests I saw show the sensor out and plugged in, power up and let it warm up and it should go to full lean, then put it in a rag soaked with carb cleaner or gas and it should go full rich, however when I tested mine it stays at the same reading either way, might change a point or two. So my question is is the sensor bad or do I have some other issue?

 

[mbarryracing]

Sensor is dead. The progression goes from responding slower and slower to not responding at all.
I killed a few Bosch sensors for my AEM gauge in a hurry running leaded race fuel. Then running straight pump gas still seemed to kill a sensor once every season, thought maybe it was the heat. Switched to a replacement NTK sensor (by NGK) and that has been lasting more than 2 seasons now on pump gas... fingers crossed.

 

[boostedmayhem]

Sensor is dead. The progression goes from responding slower and slower to not responding at all.
I killed a few Bosch sensors for my AEM gauge in a hurry running leaded race fuel. Then running straight pump gas still seemed to kill a sensor once every season, thought maybe it was the heat. Switched to a replacement NTK sensor (by NGK) and that has been lasting more than 2 seasons now on pump gas... fingers crossed.

Ok, I kept wondering why I couldnt get the afr at idle right, it kept wanting to hang around 15-16. The weird thing is under load up to half throttle it would show 13-14 and wot it was anywhere from 9-12. I usually run 50/50 premium and sunoco 112. Sometimes straight sunoco if im running boost up high, but I rarely do that. The sensor is mounted a little low on the pipe, I have a side mount Garrett 2871 and the sensor is about 2" up from the end of the pipe, I am concerned about it effecting the readings being that close to the end of the pipe.

 

[mbarryracing]

The Sunoco 112 is what poisoned the sensor, the lead coats it like a glazed donut...
Some times they seem to last awhile with race fuel, I had one that did what yours is doing after only a few passes at a local snow drag.

Is it 2" from the outlet to the open air, or 2" from end of pipe before a muffler?
2" before open air is definitely too close. Thats not what killed the sensor, its just likely sensing the oxygen from the open air sucking back in with exhaust pulses and falsely reading lean. That will just cause you to chase your tail trying to richen the AFR and making the machine run worse.

 

[boostedmayhem]

The Sunoco 112 is what poisoned the sensor, the lead coats it like a glazed donut...
Some times they seem to last awhile with race fuel, I had one that did what yours is doing after only a few passes at a local snow drag.

Is it 2" from the outlet to the open air, or 2" from end of pipe before a muffler?
2" before open air is definitely too close. Thats not what killed the sensor, its just likely sensing the oxygen from the open air sucking back in with exhaust pulses and falsely reading lean. That will just cause you to chase your tail trying to richen the AFR and making the machine run worse.

I kind of thought the race fuel had something to do with it. Ive thought about putting the sensor in just to tune it then pulling it out and putting a plug in after. Just have it in for tuning purposes and plug the rest of the time. But I dont like the idea of not being able to monitor at all times. And ya its 2" from the end of pipe, open air. I just bought the sled last November and am slowly changing certain things that I dont like, and the sensor being that close to the end of the pipe and open air is one of those things. Its not a very long section of pipe, just dumps right off the turbo, its about and 8" down pipe, so moving it up will be putting it close to the turbo but figure its probably better than where it is now.

 

[mbarryracing]

My sensor boss is mounted 2" from the turbo outlet flange, it wont hurt it as long as it's after the turbine wheel so it's not in the back pressure...

Another thing that helps prolong the life is powering up the sensor up before starting the engine, so the heating element is up to temp before all the start-up condensation peppers it. I have mine on the key-on power, so it powers up and allows it to warm up a few seconds (sweeps and climbs to full lean open air AFR) before I pull the kill switch up and start the sled.

 

[boostedmayhem]

My sensor boss is mounted 2" from the turbo outlet flange, it wont hurt it as long as it's after the turbine wheel so it's not in the back pressure...

Another thing that helps prolong the life is powering up the sensor up before starting the engine, so the heating element is up to temp before all the start-up condensation peppers it. I have mine on the key-on power, so it powers up and allows it to warm up a few seconds (sweeps and climbs to full lean open air AFR) before I pull the kill switch up and start the sled.

Ok I will definitely do that from now on, mine is also hooked in with the key on. Thank you for replying and all the help. Where im new to the 4stroke snowmobile, and new to the sport for that matter its been a learning thing, ive ridden and raced streetbikes years and although very similar motors the apex being basically an r1 engine they are still different as far as tuning goes. So I really appreciate all the help, it makes it so much easier than trial and error.

 

[mbarryracing]

No sweat, this site is huge with knowledge and experience. I think you'll find almost all the answers to most any questions you come across. Here is where I learned alot when I first started out, and still learning. LOL.

I recommend keeping the AFR gauge operational 100% of the time, not just during initial tuning... It's an invaluable tool for diagnostics, as well as a warning of something starting to go wrong. Things change on these high HP sleds all the time, boost leaks, exhaust leaks, fuel pressure fading off, etc...
My AFR gauge trumps my boost gauge for priority, it's the one in my face when riding.

 

[boostedmayhem]

No sweat, this site is huge with knowledge and experience. I think you'll find almost all the answers to most any questions you come across. Here is where I learned alot when I first started out, and still learning. LOL.

I recommend keeping the AFR gauge operational 100% of the time, not just during initial tuning... It's an invaluable tool for diagnostics, as well as a warning of something starting to go wrong. Things change on these high HP sleds all the time, boost leaks, exhaust leaks, fuel pressure fading off, etc...
My AFR gauge trumps my boost gauge for priority, it's the one in my face when riding.

Ya thats why I didnt want to go that route, im sure it far less expensive to replace the sensor once a season or every two seasons than the damage that could be done because of not using it 100% of the time.

 

[boostedmayhem]

No sweat, this site is huge with knowledge and experience. I think you'll find almost all the answers to most any questions you come across. Here is where I learned alot when I first started out, and still learning. LOL.

I recommend keeping the AFR gauge operational 100% of the time, not just during initial tuning... It's an invaluable tool for diagnostics, as well as a warning of something starting to go wrong. Things change on these high HP sleds all the time, boost leaks, exhaust leaks, fuel pressure fading off, etc...
My AFR gauge trumps my boost gauge for priority, it's the one in my face when riding.

When I bought the sled I was nervous because ive heard of the storys of ones that were put together by someone who didnt have the proper knowledge to be doing it and it costing a ton of money just to make it right. But I feel I got a decent deal on it, I was told it has corillo rods, je pistons and arp studs, along with some head work. It has the upgraded 2871 turbo and msd fuel pump. The sled has 1300 miles on it. Of course all except the turbo and fuel pump is one of those things of supposedly, who knows if its actually whats in it and been done. It also has a ve inc. Tunnel, well partial anyways, not the complete ve tunnel. And has an ezride skid. I picked it up for $4600.00

 

[mbarryracing]

Smoking deal.
What's it have for a fuel controller?

 

[boostedmayhem]

Smoking deal.
What's it have for a fuel controller?

It has a boondocker box, im not sure how I feel about it, my brother also bought a turbo apex and his has a pure logic, it seems like the pure logic is more simple to use, more user friendly. But that just could be because im still learning the boondocker. Someday id love to go with the motech m-400. Its on my wish list Lol

 

[mysledblows]

Ive had much better luck keeping o2 sensors alive with race fuel after I started using this stuff.

http://decalinchemicals.com/products/decalin-runup-fuel-additive/

 

[boostedmayhem]

Ive had much better luck keeping o2 sensors alive with race fuel after I started using this stuff.

http://decalinchemicals.com/products/decalin-runup-fuel-additive/

What does it do?

 

[boostedmayhem]

Ive had much better luck keeping o2 sensors alive with race fuel after I started using this stuff.

http://decalinchemicals.com/products/decalin-runup-fuel-additive/

Sorry just saw the link, where do you purchase it?