Mighty
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Yellowknife said:
That is the one engine in cats lineup that isn't a Suzuki.
Yellowknife
TY 4 Stroke Master
MightyWarrior said:
Really? So this dealer lied to me too? Or they likely have no idea what they are talking about...I can see that. It is normal in the North!
Mighty
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I remember reading about that engine. The company that makes it supplies it for a few different asian companies for their mini cars. It seems that I read that there are more of that particular engines produced then any other in the world.
Ski-Dog
Expert
JDKRXW - In response to your questions
A REV Renegade has lots of storage. Perhaps you are not familiar with the sled. It has a rack on the back (standard equip), has a rather large storage in the seat, comes from the factory with a nifty gas can for the back and Skidoo offers luggage that fits over the seat (saddlebags) plus a huge storage bag that fits on the rack on the tunnel. Take a look at one some time. It appears that Yellowknife who owns one agrees.
Out of the box performance - Read the 1000 or so reports on this site of people trying to get clutching right for example. Numerous people on this site cannot get more than 102 miles per hour out of their stock Warrior. Must tweak for what it should be from the factory. Deny if you like but I believe this to be true.
Depreciation is a factor for me. From an economic perspective trade in and upgrade are important as I change sleds every 1 to 2 years. It is a fact in my area that these sleds depreciate faster than the Ski-doo. Example my Yamaha dealer has a 2003 RX1 - $7700 cdn. He has a 2003 REV 600 - $8600 cdn. This is a Yamaha dealer and even he knows he will get more money for the REV. Amazing isn't it when a Yamaha dealer has to do this. The Rx has upgrades and fewer miles. The REV is stock.
Cold starting. This is the first sled I have this level of trouble with cold starting in the last 20 years. From my personal experience. The two stroke even with electric start still have a cord to start them. As you know there is no backup for the RX. My 1985 Ski-doo MX, Arctic Cats, Polaris's and up all started fine in this temp .
I simply offer unbiased opinions from my own experiences. As I said I am not hung up on brand loyalty in any way shape or form and simply report my findings.
A REV Renegade has lots of storage. Perhaps you are not familiar with the sled. It has a rack on the back (standard equip), has a rather large storage in the seat, comes from the factory with a nifty gas can for the back and Skidoo offers luggage that fits over the seat (saddlebags) plus a huge storage bag that fits on the rack on the tunnel. Take a look at one some time. It appears that Yellowknife who owns one agrees.
Out of the box performance - Read the 1000 or so reports on this site of people trying to get clutching right for example. Numerous people on this site cannot get more than 102 miles per hour out of their stock Warrior. Must tweak for what it should be from the factory. Deny if you like but I believe this to be true.
Depreciation is a factor for me. From an economic perspective trade in and upgrade are important as I change sleds every 1 to 2 years. It is a fact in my area that these sleds depreciate faster than the Ski-doo. Example my Yamaha dealer has a 2003 RX1 - $7700 cdn. He has a 2003 REV 600 - $8600 cdn. This is a Yamaha dealer and even he knows he will get more money for the REV. Amazing isn't it when a Yamaha dealer has to do this. The Rx has upgrades and fewer miles. The REV is stock.
Cold starting. This is the first sled I have this level of trouble with cold starting in the last 20 years. From my personal experience. The two stroke even with electric start still have a cord to start them. As you know there is no backup for the RX. My 1985 Ski-doo MX, Arctic Cats, Polaris's and up all started fine in this temp .
I simply offer unbiased opinions from my own experiences. As I said I am not hung up on brand loyalty in any way shape or form and simply report my findings.
Yellowknife
TY 4 Stroke Master
Nice reply. I agree. And I have the same thinking...I don't care what brand it is, I just want it to suit my needs.
Yamaha dealer called me today, they approved me on a Warrior. I'm going to go in tomorrow and talk numbers, just to see what the bottom line is. I'll be taking all of your comments with me, it will be interesting to hear how he gets 25 MPG on the same conditions that most of you are only getting 12 MPG. I'll talk about the stock settings as well, and see what they are willing to do for me for storage/towing capabilities.
FYI - My SDI died yesterday - cause unknown. It is in the doo dealership right now.
The next 24 hours should be interesting...
Yamaha dealer called me today, they approved me on a Warrior. I'm going to go in tomorrow and talk numbers, just to see what the bottom line is. I'll be taking all of your comments with me, it will be interesting to hear how he gets 25 MPG on the same conditions that most of you are only getting 12 MPG. I'll talk about the stock settings as well, and see what they are willing to do for me for storage/towing capabilities.
FYI - My SDI died yesterday - cause unknown. It is in the doo dealership right now.
The next 24 hours should be interesting...
Mighty
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Sit on the warrior and look it over really close then do the same thing with the REV. You tell me what is the better sled. This past week end I started my Warrior at -22 without a hiccup. 2 of the 2-smokes I was with wouldn't. So much for a starter rope.
The resale on that 600 REV may be better ski-dog but how quickly will you recoup your money with no injecter oil, the use of regular gas, the non trips back and forth to the dealer for re-mapping (oops, that's the sdi) and the first ring job that 2-smoke will need at what, 5-7000 miles (or less if the rings flake like all the other 600's)?
Change the oil and filter at 500 miles on the warrior then annually. $3.50 a quart US needing 3 and a $10.00 oil filter. You do the math, one oil change per season is less than 1 gallon of most injecter oils and that's all you need to do
The resale on that 600 REV may be better ski-dog but how quickly will you recoup your money with no injecter oil, the use of regular gas, the non trips back and forth to the dealer for re-mapping (oops, that's the sdi) and the first ring job that 2-smoke will need at what, 5-7000 miles (or less if the rings flake like all the other 600's)?
Change the oil and filter at 500 miles on the warrior then annually. $3.50 a quart US needing 3 and a $10.00 oil filter. You do the math, one oil change per season is less than 1 gallon of most injecter oils and that's all you need to do
nhrxrider
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Hi
A response to your response (with quotes...this thread is getting long. ;-)
"I don't like that I'll have to fiddle with the sled to get it running the way I want, mostly because I'm not technically inclined, especially on an RX."
It will RUN perfectly the day you buy it. Only the suspension setup takes a little trial and error, and thats very easy with this forum. I don't deal with suspensions well, but by ready a few posts on this forum and making a couple tweaks during a one day trail ride, I'm very happy with what I have. The engine is typical 4 stroke...turn the key and go. It will perform very well bone stock. Some will fiddle with jetting, clutching, etc. to gain a hair more, but I can say, bone stock you WILL be very happy with the power.
"Gas mileage, well thanks for being honest. I was told 25 MPG by the dealer here. Not even close. The RX-1 seems to get what my SDI does. Less the fact I don't have to burn oil in the RX, which is a plus."
25 is about what the non turbo cats get (I have no idea about the turbos). They also have half the power we do. As for operating cost, I figured the cost of running my RX vs. my old ZRT, and just counting gas, oil, and plugs, I saved $600 last season. Thats running 87 octane vs. 93 (my RX runs perfectly on 87...its all I've ever run in it), no oil injection, and no plugs needing to be changed on a regular basis.
"The way the engine will last is a huge plus for me. I can't put that one into words."
Have you read an RX owner's manual yet? Change the engine and chain case oil every 2000 miles. Change the oil filter at 12,000 miles. Adjust the valve clearance every 25,000 miles. Plan to own it long enough to adjust the valves???
"By the way, I went into the cat dealer, slick bastards, they are trying to sell me the 2005 Turbo 660cc, that red and white thing. It is too expensive, not to mention no deals on it, and it's a short track...I love suzuki and I bet the engine is amazing, but I can't stand the way that thing looks, and I've always hated Cats. hehehehe"
Yea, its funny the Cats cost as much as the RX, have FAR less power (even the turbos are said to be about like an average 600 2-smoker), while the RX is on par with 800s. And yea, I hate the looks. I hate to say it, but I actually think I like last year's non turbos better than the looks of the new turbos.
Jim
A response to your response (with quotes...this thread is getting long. ;-)
"I don't like that I'll have to fiddle with the sled to get it running the way I want, mostly because I'm not technically inclined, especially on an RX."
It will RUN perfectly the day you buy it. Only the suspension setup takes a little trial and error, and thats very easy with this forum. I don't deal with suspensions well, but by ready a few posts on this forum and making a couple tweaks during a one day trail ride, I'm very happy with what I have. The engine is typical 4 stroke...turn the key and go. It will perform very well bone stock. Some will fiddle with jetting, clutching, etc. to gain a hair more, but I can say, bone stock you WILL be very happy with the power.
"Gas mileage, well thanks for being honest. I was told 25 MPG by the dealer here. Not even close. The RX-1 seems to get what my SDI does. Less the fact I don't have to burn oil in the RX, which is a plus."
25 is about what the non turbo cats get (I have no idea about the turbos). They also have half the power we do. As for operating cost, I figured the cost of running my RX vs. my old ZRT, and just counting gas, oil, and plugs, I saved $600 last season. Thats running 87 octane vs. 93 (my RX runs perfectly on 87...its all I've ever run in it), no oil injection, and no plugs needing to be changed on a regular basis.
"The way the engine will last is a huge plus for me. I can't put that one into words."
Have you read an RX owner's manual yet? Change the engine and chain case oil every 2000 miles. Change the oil filter at 12,000 miles. Adjust the valve clearance every 25,000 miles. Plan to own it long enough to adjust the valves???
"By the way, I went into the cat dealer, slick bastards, they are trying to sell me the 2005 Turbo 660cc, that red and white thing. It is too expensive, not to mention no deals on it, and it's a short track...I love suzuki and I bet the engine is amazing, but I can't stand the way that thing looks, and I've always hated Cats. hehehehe"
Yea, its funny the Cats cost as much as the RX, have FAR less power (even the turbos are said to be about like an average 600 2-smoker), while the RX is on par with 800s. And yea, I hate the looks. I hate to say it, but I actually think I like last year's non turbos better than the looks of the new turbos.
Jim
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Yellowknife,
I think you may be a little off on the 12 MPG you are assuming.
First off there are Americans and Canadians both here on this site. [As well as other countries as well]
I assume you and your dealer are Canadian, therefore our Mpg is 20 % higher because our Gallon is 20 % larger.
I got 17.5 MPG on the weekend with a Brand new 0 KM Warrior with
70% trail and 30% powder riding. [Imperial Gallon]
Most of the Canadians are getting around 20 MPG after break in and I think most of the Americans are getting around 16 to their 132 oz gallon.
Still not 25 but not 12 either. Hope this clears the mud some.
Dave
I think you may be a little off on the 12 MPG you are assuming.
First off there are Americans and Canadians both here on this site. [As well as other countries as well]
I assume you and your dealer are Canadian, therefore our Mpg is 20 % higher because our Gallon is 20 % larger.
I got 17.5 MPG on the weekend with a Brand new 0 KM Warrior with
70% trail and 30% powder riding. [Imperial Gallon]
Most of the Canadians are getting around 20 MPG after break in and I think most of the Americans are getting around 16 to their 132 oz gallon.
Still not 25 but not 12 either. Hope this clears the mud some.
Dave
Yellowknife
TY 4 Stroke Master
Actually, I measure everything in US Gallons. So 12 does sound right in powder conditions. If I baught this sled and found out it gets the same mileage as my SDI after being told by the dealer it was 25 MPG, I'd explode after what I'm been though with Ski-doo.
We'll see how the meeting goes with the Yamaha guy Tuesday morning.
We'll see how the meeting goes with the Yamaha guy Tuesday morning.
Yamahnator
TY 4 Stroke Guru
The warrior will crush a 600 SDI in the power department.
It's ready to ride out of the box, but like others said suspension often needs to be tweaked with.
It's ready to ride out of the box, but like others said suspension often needs to be tweaked with.
JDKRXW
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Ski Dog, you are correct, the Rev comes standard with a nice rack on the back, and I guess we can debate the size of the underseat vs. underhood storage. The gas tank, storage bag and saddle bags are all Ski-Doo accesories though, and don't come from the factory "with" the sled. They are all from the accesory catalog (I have a Ski-Doo and they mail me this very nice book every year). I think we would probably agree on the quality of some of the Yamaha accesories. I see from another post that your rear bag wasn't too good. I think my Yamaha Deluxe tarp (material) is crap.
Do you really think that a higher number of new RX owners than new Rev (or ANY other brand for that matter) "tweak" their sleds when new from the factory. This is a dedicated RX site so what do you expect? Go to Snowmobile World or SnoWest where all brands are lumped together and see for yourself where the most tweaking is going on.
Depreciation..... buy the sled you can afford to ride. Nobody said this sport was inexpensive (take the $100+ for that 9 litre gas tank for example).
You have had better starting two strokes than I have....... and as you can see by where I live, I have quite a bit of experience.
These are also my unbiased obsevations of what I've seen. I guess we'll have to disagree on a few things.
Do you really think that a higher number of new RX owners than new Rev (or ANY other brand for that matter) "tweak" their sleds when new from the factory. This is a dedicated RX site so what do you expect? Go to Snowmobile World or SnoWest where all brands are lumped together and see for yourself where the most tweaking is going on.
Depreciation..... buy the sled you can afford to ride. Nobody said this sport was inexpensive (take the $100+ for that 9 litre gas tank for example).
You have had better starting two strokes than I have....... and as you can see by where I live, I have quite a bit of experience.
These are also my unbiased obsevations of what I've seen. I guess we'll have to disagree on a few things.
Yellowknife
TY 4 Stroke Master
Had my meeting with the dealer this morning. Here's the deal;
He says Regular Price is $13,125 Canadian
He will give it to me (he says at cost to him) $11,650
He will add the coolant circulator heater for $100
He will reinforce the tunnel for a heavy duty hitch for $200
Add $175 for an Administration fee, then 7% tax.
What do you guys think? I have to make a decision soon. I'm going to test ride it tomorrow morning. Apparantly the deal he is giving me (no payment, no interest, no down payment for 1 year) is only offered until the end of January.
Comments on the prices??????
Thanks a million!
He says Regular Price is $13,125 Canadian
He will give it to me (he says at cost to him) $11,650
He will add the coolant circulator heater for $100
He will reinforce the tunnel for a heavy duty hitch for $200
Add $175 for an Administration fee, then 7% tax.
What do you guys think? I have to make a decision soon. I'm going to test ride it tomorrow morning. Apparantly the deal he is giving me (no payment, no interest, no down payment for 1 year) is only offered until the end of January.
Comments on the prices??????
Thanks a million!
Mighty
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What's that figure out to in US funds?
Snorover
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That works out to $8962. us Not sure of that price, but other guys on here are more up to date on priceing than I am.
I think the dealers price is more like $10250.cnd :?: :?:
I think the dealers price is more like $10250.cnd :?: :?:
tundra
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
the price he made to you his high.
I bought mine on pre-order, his a limited edition 04 rx-1 mountain and i paid 12000$ with a free cooler(with installation, a pair of mirror and an oil change)
And here my opinion on the sled.
-37°c monday night, and i have to start it to go at the dealer. He start better than any two-stroke i ever see. and the battery is really strong, you will be tired of start before the sled. The motor made almost 5 or 6 turn and start. Very very good. Gaz and go, put the key, turn it, sit down, wait for the light to shut off and go. :wink:
Gas consumption. And is a mountain, 11 or 12 mpg in powder, lot of WOT
15mpg on trail. :wink:
the low...
Heavy(but i've seen heavier remember a Mach z LT, or a t-cat mountain), bad ski, no storage except for two can of beer(only when i dont drive after, beer remove fear) or V8 cocktail juice :lol:
high for me.
look good, torqueeeeeeeee, i really love the sound,confort, no stink, no smoke,fit and finish. It's my sled
Try to get the cooler free and go for it. :wink:
I bought mine on pre-order, his a limited edition 04 rx-1 mountain and i paid 12000$ with a free cooler(with installation, a pair of mirror and an oil change)
And here my opinion on the sled.
-37°c monday night, and i have to start it to go at the dealer. He start better than any two-stroke i ever see. and the battery is really strong, you will be tired of start before the sled. The motor made almost 5 or 6 turn and start. Very very good. Gaz and go, put the key, turn it, sit down, wait for the light to shut off and go. :wink:
Gas consumption. And is a mountain, 11 or 12 mpg in powder, lot of WOT
15mpg on trail. :wink:
the low...
Heavy(but i've seen heavier remember a Mach z LT, or a t-cat mountain), bad ski, no storage except for two can of beer(only when i dont drive after, beer remove fear) or V8 cocktail juice :lol:
high for me.
look good, torqueeeeeeeee, i really love the sound,confort, no stink, no smoke,fit and finish. It's my sled
Try to get the cooler free and go for it. :wink:
