*****Attention Front Mount Turbo Header Builders*****

[rx1 fern]

i can vouch for dave at powderlites,i had my front mount header crack at 2000 miles and i phoned dave and he told me to send it to him and he repaired it at no charge ,this is on one of his first turbo kits he made and i am still using that header on my sled right now with no issues .dave will always stand by his products and is a nice guy to deal with.always answers my phone calls also when i need some help.

 

[travism]

ill say this about Jeff simon i sent him his header back for repair he sent it back still cracked. thats what i call service.

 

[Need for Speed 2]

I cant beleive what Im reading , manifolds that dont crack and are warrantied? Time does make people forget. Guys manifolds will crack they dont flow period, heat backs up lack of performance. The older headers held up well for the day but now there is more knowledge andother key things to header cracking. This has been beat to death.

 

[hlmrx1]

Guys let’s try and stick to the subject here, and let’s hear from the horse’s mouths themselves!!!!! So far in that sense it’s pretty quite.

Hurricane, I’ve had a couple of Dave’s and they both cracked, the second one was repaired in the spring of 06 and I sold the sled that fall. Dave didn’t replace the original header but we worked something out, it did fail and he did repair it. The 2nd one was better than the first but still failed. I started this post to see if any of these guys will give a offer a replacement warranty within a certain timeframe or mileage, and thus far have not had much luck I would say, although there seems to be a lot of interest in this subject, gee wonder why?

Bounty, the only question of yours that I feel I can answer honestly and expect to be pulling it out to replace of repair it eventually. I can’t speak for Ted’s manifold as I have not had experience with that, maybe someone that has can for you. On the reason for the cracking, heat, weight of the turbo, not letting it cool down by idling after a hard pull, poor install will contribute to the problem, but being aware and taking precautions should make them last more than 800 miles as far as I’m concerned and should be replaced and not repair at that level as either the manufacturing process or material is faulty.

RX1 Fern, I have not had a problem with either Powderlites or Simons in offering to repair cracked headers at all, I could vouch for them too in that sense. The problem I see is the premature failure, the down time while it’s being repaired, the fact that you have to remove/install of have someone do that for you.

Travism, that’s interesting to say the least!!!!!!!!!

Need for Speed 2, Yep this subject has been beat to death, and the intent is not about who builds the best or why they crack or how long they will last before cracking, which makes the most power, etc. It’s about warranty’s on these. You’re building headers are you not? Do you offer any kind of warranty? What kind of warranty to you back yours with, repair or replace, length of your warranty etc.?

 

[BOUNTYHUNTER]

Bounty, the only question of yours that I feel I can answer honestly and expect to be pulling it out to replace of repair it eventually. I can’t speak for Ted’s manifold as I have not had experience with that, maybe someone that has can for you. On the reason for the cracking, heat, weight of the turbo, not letting it cool down by idling after a hard pull, poor install will contribute to the problem, but being aware and taking precautions should make them last more than 800 miles as far as I’m concerned and should be replaced and not repair at that level as either the manufacturing process or material is faulty.

TK's Don, I'll give you a call later on this as I have some questions and thoughts on this. If you need any tpye of welding done......I'll glady do it here for you.

 

[Need for Speed 2]

Ill put a lifetime warranty on one if the guy or gal is running meth on the system, other than that I cant warranty do to to many variables that canaid in the deteriation of the heat affected zones of the tig welding process. If solution annealing was able to be done it would definitely help or stop the cracking, but the cost is out of touch, be about the same as building out of inconel. I had a price of 5000.00 to do 2 headers that is not possible when you get 1200.00 for a coated header. I do beleive though with the correct match-up of parts and tune a header will last way beyond what most would expect. I have one here that went 7500 miles and still no cracking made from 321 ss. There are many variables to the cracking but the biggest one is heat.

 

[powderlites]

Header Builders warranty

I have built more headers then anyone on here! That being said I have also built headers for Northeast Turbos, Alpine Motor sport, CPR guys replacement, and few custom headers etc.
Manifolds will also crack if there is another problem.
Turbo's too small, Too high back pressure, Too lean, Engine not balanced or clutches, NO DOUBLE DOWN PIPE,
I have even seen a few crack turbo exhaust housings!! Yes there is no warranty on it either!
Don I have stepped up to the plate for a lot of guys with header problems.
I told Ted that there is more to this header business then just welding up some tubes and flanges. I have helped Kevin and given out a lot of knowledge for free.
Don fly right at it and make your own header and have your own warranty program.
I am tick off with a customer not listening and getting the rest of a turbo kit setup right.
Oh it runs fine!! Yeah then the motor will go down one day and can't blame that on header when it was detonation because too lean or too much back pressure in header.
Go throw 3 boost gauges on header, Intercooler, motor and see how good your sled is running.
I told Dave from hurricane that there is no warranty on twisted up bunch of tubes he is using but with proper tuning that header is still working i think.
Thats all I got to say about headers and better pay attention to other things when a header cracks.

 

[hlmrx1]

 

[MEAT]

I have had a lot of helpfrom Dave at PL and he stands behind his work and so does Alpine. What I have wondered was if Paul's Header with the rubber support a is standing up to high boost etc . My problem with my header is not the headers fault . It as an 04 header and has a small turbo with no double down and I have ran up to 19 lbs boost that way so that is my fault. I will now run about 16lbs max and now I have a double down. If it does not stand up I will upgrade to a new header and turbo.

 

[mr happy]

I dont do a lot of posting on here , but I have read a lot and spent / wasted a lot of money over the years on high performance endeavours.
Im really not sure: how much a guy can expect from the people who are truly pioneers, in a sport that 10 short years ago, would not have dreamed of 300 RELIABLE ,TRAIL FRIENDLY HP.
Having stated that; I can also say that the professional people on here, that help ALL of us out, need to be cut a little slack. If the service is crap say so...... but be darn sure youre not in a glass house ,when you pick up the rocks to throw. I have dealt with many on this forum and am planning on a lot more this summer. Asking for a warrenty, on a special, high performance, hand built part ,with the builder sending it out to some unknown user on a high perf application ,with no Idea of the end use /state of tune it will see; may be stretching the peramiters of warrenty a bit far.
Having said that, I have one of Ted J s manifolds that was replaced in advance without me missing a day of riding and I sent him back the (old)manifold when I got his new one. The old manifold was still working fine, but I asked him if he would update and he did. The only cost to me was shipping and he sent the new manifold without payment on faith. If service like that is not good enough, stick with factory built units on an assembly line and forget about high performance. Ted is not the only guy like that on here: as most of you have dealt with the likes of Hurricane, Powderlites and Alpine. Service makes the company, just ask Bruce at PSI how he is doing these days.

Mike

 

[mbarryracing]

 

[mmmkokanee]

I agree, I've had nothing but help and good service.
Thanks to all who help us go faster for longer than 1000 miles per motor!
Chris

 

[hlmrx1]

I dont do a lot of posting on here , but I have read a lot and spent / wasted a lot of money over the years on high performance endeavours.
Im really not sure: how much a guy can expect from the people who are truly pioneers, in a sport that 10 short years ago, would not have dreamed of 300 RELIABLE ,TRAIL FRIENDLY HP.
Having stated that; I can also say that the professional people on here, that help ALL of us out, need to be cut a little slack. If the service is crap say so...... but be darn sure youre not in a glass house ,when you pick up the rocks to throw. I have dealt with many on this forum and am planning on a lot more this summer. Asking for a warrenty, on a special, high performance, hand built part ,with the builder sending it out to some unknown user on a high perf application ,with no Idea of the end use /state of tune it will see; may be stretching the peramiters of warrenty a bit far.
Having said that, I have one of Ted J s manifolds that was replaced in advance without me missing a day of riding and I sent him back the (old)manifold when I got his new one. The old manifold was still working fine, but I asked him if he would update and he did. The only cost to me was shipping and he sent the new manifold without payment on faith. If service like that is not good enough, stick with factory built units on an assembly line and forget about high performance. Ted is not the only guy like that on here: as most of you have dealt with the likes of Hurricane, Powderlites and Alpine. Service makes the company, just ask Bruce at PSI how he is doing these days.

Mike

Hey I understand what you’re saying here and agree with you to a point. One of the reasons for this post is to make it publicly clear that this in not cut and dry when there are problems. For all the new guys wanting to get into this boost stuff and trail ride, well I just don’t recommend going with a turbo at this point unless you’re ready to buy two headers and be prepared to change it half way through the season, send the old one back to get it welded up and then go through the same thing all over again. The other reason for this post is to see what suppliers would be brave enough to answer this post publically and state what they would be prepared to do should these parts fail. This will make things a little more black and white for everyone here. So in a nutshell, not one supplier has stated that they will replace a defective header, they will only repair and possibly modify by adding gussets and stuff.

 

[aja636]

In the end, this is all some what new terriotory for every one making headers or kits for these turbos sleds that we run, what has it been 4-5 years? YES this has been done on bikes and cars, but either of them never seen extreme climates that we put these sleds through.

If you leave a stage 1 kit be at the 6-8 lbs boost it is meant for, I doubt you will have any header problems. Thats why Powderlites offers a couple different headers and intercoolers for what you think you might want to do!!

So Us as consumers, have to under stand that we are testers to some point. To get the power levels that we are seeing and do this every weekend is huge!!! Given there are few that have cracks and breaks and what have you, we only hear about the bad side. How many are still going strong, and not pushing the limits like some of us are?

I just bought a header from Need 4 Speed, a custom 4 into 1 tube design that he came up with the help from other guys. I made big gains with it... when it cracks, if it cracks, I will not hold him liable for it, it was a one off custom header..to get the gains I did, there will be costs for it. Hopefully with the right tune of engine and heat management, I can retard the breakage. But High performance stuff breaks..

You can't get warrenty on custom stuff in any other aspect. why in the snowmobile world would you expect the same??

YES Ted J is stepping up with replacements sight unseen on breakage on his manifold. He has a Trail Form manifold that will do close to what a header will with reliablitliy!!! and thank him for that.

Sure there was growing pains, all guys making this stuff seen that.

We all need to lighten up on the guys that supply our performance stuff to us, cause in the same light, they are learning more and more every year just like we are.... but they are making the $hit for us to buy instead of us selling the $hit for them to buy.

Just my 2 cents.....I am not bashing anyone here just trying to help with some reason...

 

[madsledder]

Well we can all think about how reliable a 2 sroke would be putiing out this kind of horse power