Fox Float reservoir kits

[ralger]

I just spoke with Fett Bros. and they told me they are currently manufacturing a new can that will increase the volume by 300% over their current one. The current can only increases the volume by about 4%. They will be available in Sept. and sell for $120/pair. I plan to wait for the new ones before ordering.

 

[ahicks]

I just spoke with Fett Bros. and they told me they are currently manufacturing a new can that will increase the volume by 300% over their current one. The current can only increases the volume by about 4%. They will be available in Sept. and sell for $120/pair. I plan to wait for the new ones before ordering.

I don't know anything about the Fett design, but if the volume they've chosen is fixed, and doesn't suit your application well, they would be of questionable value?

What I'm thinking, and maybe somebody will correct me if wrong, but too much volume might affect the bottoming resistance a lot of guys are looking for? In other words, stock Floats can be pretty harsh when coming up on full compression stroke (especially for the guys running 40-50 psi). The idea behind the resi's, they're supposed to help that by increasing the volume of that air chamber. Here's the big rub though. If the chamber is TOO big, that bottoming resistance won't work properly because you'll never achieve enough compression to be effective? The correct resi volume will depend on what pressure you're running, will change quite a bit between guys currently running 60-70 psi vs. those running 40. I think a decent resi should be adjustable to compensate for any pressure (within reason) that I want to run. FWIW

 

[Turtle]

[quote="ahicks]I don't know anything about the Fett design, but if the volume they've chosen is fixed, and doesn't suit your application well, they would be of questionable value?

What I'm thinking, and maybe somebody will correct me if wrong, but too much volume might affect the bottoming resistance a lot of guys are looking for? In other words, stock Floats can be pretty harsh when coming up on full compression stroke (especially for the guys running 40-50 psi). The idea behind the resi's, they're supposed to help that by increasing the volume of that air chamber. Here's the big rub though. If the chamber is TOO big, that bottoming resistance won't work properly because you'll never achieve enough compression to be effective? The correct resi volume will depend on what pressure you're running, will change quite a bit between guys currently running 60-70 psi vs. those running 40. I think a decent resi should be adjustable to compensate for any pressure (within reason) that I want to run. FWIW[/quote]

You're right. We found this out through the testing and development of our design. We tried bigger air chamber designs and found that if you go too big, you can bottom out more.

The way the Float works is as the shock compresses, the air pressure inside increases exponentially. In theory this works great because you can essentially have an infinite resistance to bottoming. However, the volume of air and the pressure you have affect the rate at which the pressure increases as the shock compresses. Too little volume makes the pressure increase at a very rapid rate making the ride very stiff, and in some cases, won't allow you to use the full travel available.

By adding air volume you are slowing the rate at which the pressure increase ... making it act more like a spring which increases at a constant rate. If the volume gets too big, the pressure will increase too slow and you can bottom out the shock before the pressure has built up enough to stop the compression of the shock.

We've done extensive testing around our design and feel we have come up with the best size of air resevoir to accomodate a wide range of riding types and conditions.

 

[ahicks]

<<<We've done extensive testing around our design and feel we have come up with the best size of air resevoir to accomodate a wide range of riding types and conditions.>>>

Look, not to be mean, but I'm sorry. This sounds a lot like Fox telling everyone their standard chamber size will work well for everybody (60-70+ psi or 40) - and we know that's not true for reasons agreed on earlier. For now, I'll stay with the thought that the adjustable volume resi is the better buy, even if it is more expensive. I KNOW it can be set up to run with the pressure I prefer to run at any given time, AND be capable of changing if/when the need arises. IMHO, a fixed volume resi is going to be a compromise (at best) on all but a very narrow range of shock pressures. If your favorite setup doesn't happen to fall into that range, you'll have gained little or nothing.

 

[Turtle]

Look, not to be mean

I completely understand where you are coming from. I was merely agreeing with you that the amount of extra volume added can be too much. I agree that having a fixed amount of additional volume does limit the capabilities of the system.

But for the majority of our customers, the extra adjustability isn't something they need or want. Adding adjustability to our design drives up cost and price. So we are doing our best to provide a great product at a reasonable price for the majority of customers.

If you fall into that category of rider that still needs more out of the product - that's great! It's because of those customers that keep the aftermarket companies (like us) striving to make our products better.

 

[ahicks]

Look, not to be mean

I completely understand where you are coming from. I was merely agreeing with you that the amount of extra volume added can be too much. I agree that having a fixed amount of additional volume does limit the capabilities of the system.

But for the majority of our customers, the extra adjustability isn't something they need or want. Adding adjustability to our design drives up cost and price. So we are doing our best to provide a great product at a reasonable price for the majority of customers.

If you fall into that category of rider that still needs more out of the product - that's great! It's because of those customers that keep the aftermarket companies (like us) striving to make our products better.

Fair enough. Just one more thought. I know there are people who have purchased economical resi's - and are less than enchanted with their added performance level - leaving justifiable doubt regarding the benefits a resi might be capable of. Does your product include a suggested/recommended pressure, one that the chamber volume is tuned to? This at least would give a heads up to a potential customer who could then compare that pressure to the one he has been using? Thanks for being straight! -Al

 

[Turtle]

Good suggestion ... We certainly could provide some info with our kits.

FWIW - I run an '06 Nytro, obviously with our kit installed. I run the pressure at 85psi. Because of the added volume, you can run the pressure higher without it feeling too stiff. However, there may be some differences to what pressure one might run on the FX Nytro because of the different chassis, rider position, and weight on the skis.

 

[mnman309]

Good suggestion ... We certainly could provide some info with our kits.

FWIW - I run an '06 Nytro, obviously with our kit installed. I run the pressure at 85psi. Because of the added volume, you can run the pressure higher without it feeling too stiff. However, there may be some differences to what pressure one might run on the FX Nytro because of the different chassis, rider position, and weight on the skis.

Have you guys decided if your going to be selling any of your products at Hay Days?? I could use a set of the Resi's.

 

[Turtle]

We will probably be at the Hay Days ... but as spectators. We'll be sure to swing by the TY tent. And we'll be at the Yamaha tent for the annual TY photo.

 

[copo427ss]

I plan on just doing a revlaving on the floats for my sled. I spoke to Bruce at pioneer performance and he claimed I would be surprised how good these shocks actually are. He claims he can take the harshness out and create a more progressive feel to the shock.

he revalves the nytro floats to the apex float spec.

 

[ahicks]

I plan on just doing a revlaving on the floats for my sled. I spoke to Bruce at pioneer performance and he claimed I would be surprised how good these shocks actually are. He claims he can take the harshness out and create a more progressive feel to the shock.

he revalves the nytro floats to the apex float spec.

Hope not. Apex OEM valve stack sucks too. I agree 100% that they can be improved to the point where they work pretty darn good though!

 

[jewill4]

What about the ski lift situation here? I found that I was battleing flat handling, ski lift and harshness in the little stuff and they are to progressive.

 

[ahicks]

What about the ski lift situation here? I found that I was battleing flat handling, ski lift and harshness in the little stuff and they are to progressive.

The resi's will let you run a little more air without the harshness you would expect, or raising the front ride height as much. Difference will be mostly noticed/felt in the upper parts of the suspension travel.

It may let you run the front end a little lower prior bottoming - but that's going to depend on your riding style?

Resi's will not help the harshness through the stutters/little high speed stuff - that's a valving issue. That made me crazy on my sled - enough where I dealt with it first, prior to going with the resi's.... FWIW