Suspension tips

[Doc Harley]

I found myself needing to suck my limiter straps in all the way. The positive effect is a more manageable sled during acceleration. The negative side effect is I'm not strong enough to wrestle it in the trails. Power steering is on my very short list to correct this. Is there anything I can do prior to power steering that will give a noticeable benefit.
2017 SE w/6" shaper bars & Cat 160/260 frt skid spring. Should I ditch the shaper bars in favor of?!?! Loosen preload on ski shocks?

 

[Doc Harley]

A buddy turned me on to this adj. Limiter strap. Which helps for a quick transition. But I'm sure it's not the answer.

 

[Fords4life]

Get the gse power steering kit and done, you have come this far already put the cherry on top! I say gse because i have both cat factory power and gse, i like the constant power assist, i dont like my cats steering getting "heavy" after getting up to my type of trail speeds, just my 2 cents.

 

[Doc Harley]

Get the gse power steering kit and done, you have come this far already put the cherry on top! I say gse because i have both cat factory power and gse, i like the constant power assist, i dont like my cats steering getting "heavy" after getting up to my type of trail speeds, just my 2 cents.

I know you're an advocate for the GSE PS. Cuz of you're comments I'm giving it a serious look. But it's not going to be during the season. So I'm just looking for one or two ideas to Band-Aid this wildebeast.
So I'm thinking replace those shapers with a 4-in hard bar and trying to figure out what I can do with the front shock preload, if that would even help

 

[Turboflash]

I know you're an advocate for the GSE PS. Cuz of you're comments I'm giving it a serious look. But it's not going to be during the season. So I'm just looking for one or two ideas to Band-Aid this wildebeast.
So I'm thinking replace those shapers with a 4-in hard bar and trying to figure out what I can do with the front shock preload, if that would even help

Where are your rear springs set? Same question for rear shock? Soft rear spring will cause rear to collapse upon weight transfer. Same for rear shock. If too soft it will allow rear to collapse on hard throttle.
You pulled your limiters up to keep skis closer to snow but could rear settings be part of issue? Ie too much weight transfer, too soft rear settings? Pulling limiters up adds allot of pressure to skis increasing steering effort.
I have BOP mechanical steering arms that increase leverage to make steering easier. I run 9" shapers. They make quite a difference. I have bad shoulders so reducing steering effort is nice.

 

[Fords4life]

I know you're an advocate for the GSE PS. Cuz of you're comments I'm giving it a serious look. But it's not going to be during the season. So I'm just looking for one or two ideas to Band-Aid this wildebeast.
So I'm thinking replace those shapers with a 4-in hard bar and trying to figure out what I can do with the front shock preload, if that would even help

When i set up for radar runs i get the sled low, pull the limit strap up short, rear torsion springs light postion, back off front ski shock springs to NO preload after setting the rear suspension first, then add one round into the ski shocks just to hold everything in place, plus i simulate my wieght on sled with suitcase wieghts from tractors and lead bars wear i am seated on sled, then a regular round wearbar with 4 inch carbide, lightest way to make steering effort i have found with decent speed, once again just my 2 cents.

 

[Doc Harley]

Where are your rear springs set? Same question for rear shock? Soft rear spring will cause rear to collapse upon weight transfer. Same for rear shock. If too soft it will allow rear to collapse on hard throttle.
You pulled your limiters up to keep skis closer to snow but could rear settings be part of issue? Ie too much weight transfer, too soft rear settings? Pulling limiters up adds allot of pressure to skis increasing steering effort.

View attachment 177315

When i set up for radar runs i get the sled low, pull the limit strap up short, rear torsion springs light postion, back off front ski shock springs to NO preload after setting the rear suspension first, then add one round into the ski shocks just to hold everything in place, plus i simulate my wieght on sled with suitcase wieghts from tractors and lead bars wear i am seated on sled, then a regular round wearbar with 4 inch carbide, lightest way to make steering effort i have found with decent speed, once again just my 2 cents.

Guys, the whole thing seems reciprocal. Lol. I've got the frt skid spring on three turns in from full loose, no transfer rod, with the rear on full soft. That worked great. But perhaps it's working against me now. I am by no means an aggressive rider.
I'll investigate the bop mps piece and order 4" bars.

 

[Turboflash]

Guys, the whole thing seems reciprocal. Lol. I've got the frt skid spring on three turns in from full loose, no transfer rod, with the rear on full soft. That worked great. But perhaps it's working against me now. I am by no means an aggressive rider.
I'll investigate the bop mps piece and order 4" bars.

Seems full soft rear could be working against you? And, for sure no transfer rod. Both of those create lots of weight transfer and tend to want cause front to lift. Which is why you then pulled limiters tighter which then creates allot more ski pressure.
Seems like you'd want to put transfer rod back in, set to #1, set rear shock up some to try and prevent rear suspension from collapsing on hard throttle? Then you wouldn't have to have limiters so tight?
There's lots of guys on here that are way smarter than me on this so hopefully they can chime in and I can learn something.

 

[Turboflash]

When i set up for radar runs i get the sled low, pull the limit strap up short, rear torsion springs light postion, back off front ski shock springs to NO preload after setting the rear suspension first, then add one round into the ski shocks just to hold everything in place, plus i simulate my wieght on sled with suitcase wieghts from tractors and lead bars wear i am seated on sled, then a regular round wearbar with 4 inch carbide, lightest way to make steering effort i have found with decent speed, once again just my 2 cents.

Isn't a radar setup different than drag setup? Radar all that counts is speed through traps. Drag first one to line wins regardless of speed. IDK.
Speed run getting sled lower is important to reduce frontal area which reduces drag. Clutching/gearing setup different too. Highest speed setup isn't necessarily what gives best drag results

 

[fatchance]

Question is are we racing or riding? Two totally different things.

 

[Fords4life]

Isn't a radar setup different than drag setup? Radar all that counts is speed through traps. Drag first one to line wins regardless of speed. IDK.
Speed run getting sled lower is important to reduce frontal area which reduces drag. Clutching/gearing setup different too. Highest speed setup isn't necessarily what gives best drag results

All i was try'n to get across was, if you shorten the limiter straps you gotta adjust the front shock springs so all the wieght is'nt now sitting on the ski's making turn like there's 2 tons on the front ski's!

 

[STAIN]

if you shorten the limiter straps you gotta adjust the front shock springs

Also, when you shorten the straps you are changing the front skid spring preload....

Question is are we racing or riding? Two totally different things.

yup, hard to find a compromise between the 2.

 

[Doc Harley]

Seems full soft rear could be working against you? And, for sure no transfer rod. Both of those create lots of weight transfer and tend to want cause front to lift. Which is why you then pulled limiters tighter which then creates allot more ski pressure.
Seems like you'd want to put transfer rod back in, set to #1, set rear shock up some to try and prevent rear suspension from collapsing on hard throttle? Then you wouldn't have to have limiters so tight?
There's lots of guys on here that are way smarter than me on this so hopefully they can chime in and I can learn something.

Agree, rod should go back in??

Question is are we racing or riding? Two totally different things.

I think the question is compromise. A marriage of trail riding & drag racing.
Scenario: I'm out trail riding, minding my own business. I spill off onto a lake and there's four guys sitting there. Next thing you know we're going heads up for 1000' or more. That is life in my world.

All i was try'n to get across was, if you shorten the limiter straps you gotta adjust the front shock springs so all the wieght is'nt now sitting on the ski's making turn like there's 2 tons on the front ski's!

Exactly Brandon. Which way do you adjust the preload to help take the weight off those front skis?

 

[Fords4life]

Doc if you have acess to a set of electric stockcar scales get,em to use, "borrow" put a scale under each ski, one under front of rear skid as far forward as possible and one under rear of skid as far as possible, sit on sled or simulate your wieght, look at the #'s now you can make spring preload adjustments and FULLY understand what does what in a suspension, then you can confidently make changes, only way i know of to make it clear in my mind anyway.

 

[Doc Harley]

Doc if you have acess to a set of electric stockcar scales get,em to use, "borrow" put a scale under each ski, one under front of rear skid as far forward as possible and one under rear of skid as far as possible, sit on sled or simulate your wieght, look at the #'s now you can make spring preload adjustments and FULLY understand what does what in a suspension, then you can confidently make changes, only way i know of to make it clear in my mind anyway.

Thanks for the taking the time to clarify things, and helping me to move in the right direction