Blue Marble Oil Products UPDATE

[Mikecam]

My dealer told me the same thing about full synthetic oil. That it would cause the clutch starter to slip and not engage to turn the motor over. From what I'm reading here that is a bunch of hogwash.

 

[rxrider]

HAHA - it's a piece of info from the Yamaha YFZ R1 motorbike manuals that should not have been in the RX-1 sled manuals. The R1 bike has a starter clutch, the sled doesn't.

 

[Grunter]

Here's what I have experienced:

I don't know what pins the director of Blue Marble speaks of quite honestly! What Yamaha is using is a sprag clutch type set-up. In the industrial field we call them overunning clutches or backstops.

These devices are very sensitive to oil type and viscosity...
I have not seen clutches in there anywhere - but did see the sprags..

When you engage the starter motor the sprags bite into the hub of the crank(these are bearing type surfaces and are hardened & ground to work this way.) The inertia of the sprags make them penetrate through the oil film for an instant to "grab" the shaft. As soon as your motor starts
the speed causes the sprags to lift off the surface and the oil film protects the surfaces till you need to repeat this procedure again(start your motor).

Now what I have found is that on colder days - the viscosity of the oil can increase past what it is supposed to.(combine this with the added friction modifiers and you are starting to look for trouble to set in) When this happens you will not get starter engagement. It will just spin and make a whinning noise! It's happened to me(I just immediately changed the oil and evrything reverted back to the way it was). As long as your oil does not have teflon or a molecular level coating process which "microplates or attaches itself to the steel" you should be able to revert back. If you did use such friction reducing stuff like Z-max, slick 50 or similar - you will have to totally dissasemble the parts, clean them with some serious cleaners or just buy new parts!

Only because I've been selling these devices for 20 years - I understand how they work. I have had to help people who crossed the same line wondering why their backstops or overrunning clutches did not work!
This can cause death in industry and is a serious matter..
Similarly, what if you were out fishing somewhere alone and then all of a sudden your sled does not start, temperature dips to -40 and you must stay in the bush or whatever! Yamaha doesn't want to risk you not being able to not start your sled out there on a cold day! So all I'll say is this - you will get away with better oils many times - but just not necessarily all the time! If you experience a whinning sound while trying to start your motor - don't prolong the effort to try to start your sled - rather warm up the starter area with a blow dryer or warm water. This will create the oil viscosity to thin up. This should help!

Remember - you don't have a recoil on these sleds - so I don't blame Yamaha for taking the stand it does and printing what they did in their manual..

I have cheated with better oils(friction reducing etc.), got caught a few times - and decided to stick with conventional oils for starter reliability..

What Yamaha says is true, there are no clutches, but there are sprags they behave very similarly to better oils!

I'll offer this as a guide only - do the better oils at your own risk - knowing that your starter motor may not engage one day. If your cool with that - then the better oils are for you..I did personally get away with it till about -20 or so - but why risk your sled not starting?

If you leave from a warm garage, return to warm garage, and don't let your sled cool down overnight outside - then better oils could work for you. Good luck...

Grunter

 

[Grunter]

I must add - that Blue Marble is a very good oil! It does what it says in my opinion, I use it in all my two strokes, wish I could use it in my 4 strokes, it's just that we get caught in -30*C->-40*C weather at times and this is were we got caught!

I was simply sharing my own personal experience along with my knowledge of starter devices(backstops, over running clutches, sprags etc. which I have gained in my life) along with their possible reactions to recent and improved lubricants etc.

In industry - I have experienced this many times first hand. I've spoken directly with many better lubricant manufacturers, and many run of the mill manufacturers.

Here's what they had to say:

Run of the mill lubricants: We try to satisfy 90% of the applications out there..With that you take a base stock, add friction modifiers, add anti-corrosion inhibitors, add tackafiers(make oil stick), add heat or cold weather modifiers and at one point the beaker is full(no room for more additives)

Specialty lubricants: We try to satisfy 10% of the applications were people are having trouble..could be heat, could be cold, could be friction, could be emulsification(water issues). What these people do is they will identify a problem - based on that problem offer a better lubricant which satisfies the cause of the problem - and presto you have a better lubricant. But consider in this scenario if friction is the problem - they will simply add more friction modifyers at the sacrifice of water or rust inhibitors or something else etc.

Many of us simply are looking at friction(us performance guys) to the point of sacrificing pretty much anything else. An oil has many job requirements..often we overlook this or simply don't realise what an oil has to do and how it does it. So what I'm saying is you must weight your options then decide what is best....

 

[SledHedz]

I have run Blue Marble in my 2 stroke race sleds for the past 5 years with Excellent Results.. Much better results than any other 2 stroke oil we have tested.

I also have used Rev-er-up in all my vehicles for the past 5 years.. When you change your oil, drive the vehicle for a couple of minutes to heat the engine and then add Rev-er-up. After I had done this and after a couple of tanks of fuel, I noticed the oil pressure was higher and fuel mileage increased, In Every Vehicle we have tried it in..

Blue Marble also produces a fantastic 4 stroke oil, which I have used in my car, but I have not run it in the RX-1, but I will on my next oil change.

If you can't find it, here is where I buy mine and Otis will ship..

http://www.bluemarbleofmi.com/?Display=home

Distributor: Otis Cowles
Rose City, Michigan 48654
Home Phone: (989) 685-3304
Work Phone: (989) 934-5064

 

[rxrider]

Grunter - great info