Dual carbides or shaper bars on your Apex?

[Z06 FAN]

Looking into buying a set of dual carbides after recently purchasing 2 2006 apexes. The one I drive had dual carbides and my sons had single. After switching sleds i noticed how much better mine was with no darting so I told my son we needed a set on the apex he drove, but he refused. So I had switched carbides and now his sled handles much better and he agrees that I was right. So im looking for a new set for my sled now and have noticed shaper bars aswell which I no nothing about. So whats better to reduce darting? Whats different with shaper bars than the dual carbides?

 

[chris189]

Shaper bars will grab snow in the corners and bite in well. They will improve handling in tight corners.
I run them.

Dual carbides are going to reduce darting. My opinion is that they are a bandaid fix. I have never run them.
I recommend letting your limiter strap out one hole to take some weight off of the skis.
I say this because I run shaper bars and don't have a lot of issues with darting. The only time is when I let off into a stop.

I think the best option would be tuner skis from Yamaha. They are actually pretty reasonable to buy.

 

[Mooseman]

I bought a set of Shapers at the end of the season last year for my SlyDogs. They darted badly compared to the Bergstrom regular Good n' Uglys. But what got me was that one piece of carbide fell out in the middle. Not impressed with the quality, especially at that price.

 

[Winderallday!]

IMO, for the stock Apex skis, Snow Trackers or Cobraheads, avoid dual carbides, they scrub fuel economy, top end, and push in the twisties. Tried them all, others will chime in on this I'm sure.

 

[chris189]

Do you guys think that because of the price of snow trackers and cobras that it makes sense to just buy tuner skis at $300 or so?

 

[steiner]

Snowtrackers work well on stock skis and all types of driving conditions and riding styles.
Bergstroms Triple Point work well on stock skis when used with the Ski Saver and Shim.
Dual carbides cut down the darting but will push in the hard pack twisties if you drive aggressive.
Any single carbide will dart less if you shim the rear of the ski bumper.

 

[wkeggenhoff]

Buy snow trackkers on stock skies and be done with it. Not and ski or carbide combo compares. Aggressive snowtrackers should last a min of 2 years even driving on lots of dirt and gravel

 

[Z06 FAN]

Thanks guys, I will try adjusting limiter strap and shimming rear of skis.

 

[steiner]

Do you guys think that because of the price of snow trackers and cobras that it makes sense to just buy tuner skis at $300 or so?

Snowtrackers are around $240 and require no "tuning". Simple bolt on and drive and they flat out work.
Tuners require double the amount of carbides and time to tune in for your driving style and trail conditions.
Your choice.

 

[Cummins6.7pwr]

Buy snow trackkers on stock skies and be done with it. Not and ski or carbide combo compares. Aggressive snowtrackers should last a min of 2 years even driving on lots of dirt and gravel

X2!

 

[FRANK]

Just switched to Tuners with 6" in & out carbides. Have been running Semi Agressive Snowtrackers for 15,000kms on my 2011SE and have been very happy. So far Tuners are "Almost" as good at everything. Certain conditions will have them darting a little, nothing to complain about. Turning seems to be on par with Semi Agressive Trackers but Agressive ones do turn better. However Agressive Trackers can grab deep snow and turn the skiis at speed, had to change my shorts a couple of times...SO take your pick. Semi Agressive Trackers are guaranteed to put a smile on your face and last usually 2 seasons (7-8000kms-5000miles) but Tuners seem to work well also.

 

[chris189]

Thanks for the great input guys!

 

[nate007]

Dual bars like the Dooly's will kill your fuel mileage. The space between the bars will pack fill of ice and snow and it's like you're pushing a 2x4 through the snow. Shapers work good to help reduce darting, but alignment and shims on the stock skis will help tremendously in addition to any bar.
I went to Bergstroms on all my sleds years ago and have never looked back.
As far as tuning your skis- there's no substitute for making sure your sled is set up correctly. Alignment is critical, and there's no bar or ski out there that will band-aid any problems with alignment or set up. Most dealers do not take the time to ready set up a sled correctly for any given rider, so it's only obvious that tweaks need to be made.
Bergstroms are expensive, but I've only bought them for each sled once if that says anything. They're with every penny and last a very long time.

 

[icebreaker]

Snowtrackers work well on stock skis and all types of driving conditions and riding styles.
Bergstroms Triple Point work well on stock skis when used with the Ski Saver and Shim.
Dual carbides cut down the darting but will push in the hard pack twisties if you drive aggressive.
Any single carbide will dart less if you shim the rear of the ski bumper.

X2!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Exactly

 

[Q. Arrius]

Scott at Bergstrom will not sell me Triple points for my stock skis. ('12 Apex SE.). He stated the '11 were bad skis but fixable....but the '12 skis are set so incorrectly, he has no fix. He recommended I go back to pre '10 skis if I went OEM.

That said, it's just as easy to switch to aftermarket. I've seen mention of Slydogs or another brand. I ride mostly trails in norther IN or the icy trails of MI.

I would like to try the Triple Points. Any suggestions on which ski to switch to?

Are Shapers the same as SnowTrackers? If I went to aftermarket skis and I didn't like the Triplepoints, and wanted to try SnowTrackers.....I would need to remove the Triplepoints and install a single carbide, correct? I am guessing SnowTrackers are NOT used with Duellys?

(After a trip to the UP with my stock ski, (which I'm lucky to have survived, they were so dangerous,) I switched to the tuner ski. I did 6" out, 4" in. I understand the yamaha bars wear extremely quickly, and so far the tuners seem just "ok." with lots of pushing. That said, I'm still tweaking my suspension.)

I love this Apex....but geez it's killing me getting it dialed in so it doesn't kill me!

Q. Arrius