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Great news from Dynojet!

I believe I speak for most of us 150 genesis dudes when I say..."we anxiously await the development and results on this"
 

The power commander is not going to make a huge difference in a stock fuel injected Apex. The devices are made more for the owner that is going to modify a stock sled that require changes to the stock fuel mapping. They may also include ignition timing changes with this new power commander which will be great for the forced induction crowd.
 
I've heard the fuel mapping profiles on the stock machine are pretty rough...maybe not a huge difference but I'd bet better throttle response and fuel economy could be had...?
 
mrance111 said:
SUPERTUNER

I was wondering if I could pick your brain. Does the Commander attach and stay on the sled or do you reprogram the factory settings with it? How do you change the mapping with the Commander? Is it done by connecting it to a cable attached to a computer or are there controls on the Commander to make the adjustments. Does each sled have to be dialed in to each Controller or will a certain map be good on every sled? Any info you could supply would be greatly appreciated.
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The PC3 stays connected to the sled. It influences the stock ECU. It does not replace it however. Being that every engine is it's own separate entity and things like break in procedures vary from owner to owner, oil used and what exhaust system in on each sled, it is unlikely that 1 map will work for all engines. Way too many variables!
 
BlueMax said:
The power commander is not going to make a huge difference in a stock fuel injected Apex. The devices are made more for the owner that is going to modify a stock sled that require changes to the stock fuel mapping. They may also include ignition timing changes with this new power commander which will be great for the forced induction crowd.
Click to expand...



I am afraid that you are very wrong BlueMax! We dyno fuel injected motorcycles pretty much everyday at ECP. I will tell you what I do with my customers, they bring their bike in to us to dynotune and if we do not have favorable results, the session is free. I can say this with conviction and lay my head on my pillow tonight and sleep very welll... we have a 100% success rate with mapping motorycles. I see no reason why a snowmobile would be any different. Now messing around with the other FI controllers available on the market today, I realize that there is a lot that can be done to the FI Yamahas. Zero is the leanest you could go with the other FI controllers. The PC3's allow you to tune negative numbers on the maps. With our newly purchased air/fuel ration meter, we will be able to exatcly pinpoint the lean and rich areas and make adjustments accordingly.

Freddie
 
SUPERTUNER said:
BlueMax said:
The power commander is not going to make a huge difference in a stock fuel injected Apex. The devices are made more for the owner that is going to modify a stock sled that require changes to the stock fuel mapping. They may also include ignition timing changes with this new power commander which will be great for the forced induction crowd.
Click to expand...



I am afraid that you are very wrong BlueMax! We dyno fuel injected motorcycles pretty much everyday at ECP. I will tell you what I do with my customers, they bring their bike in to us to dynotune and if we do not have favorable results, the session is free. I can say this with conviction and lay my head on my pillow tonight and sleep very welll... we have a 100% success rate with mapping motorycles. I see no reason why a snowmobile would be any different. Now messing around with the other FI controllers available on the market today, I realize that there is a lot that can be done to the FI Yamahas. Zero is the leanest you could go with the other FI controllers. The PC3's allow you to tune negative numbers on the maps. With our newly purchased air/fuel ration meter, we will be able to exatcly pinpoint the lean and rich areas and make adjustments accordingly.

Freddie
Click to expand...

I stated in my post that the owner of a stock snowmobile would not see a huge increase. I guess your idea of huge and mine are very different. There is no doubt in my mind that you can improve the performance of a motorcycle or snowmobile with a power commander and some dyno time. This is a fairly expensive endeavor after you add the dyno time on top of the power commander cost. What kind of performance (HP) increases are you seeing on a typical stock motorcycle you tune? How are you going to duplicate the snowmobile fuel map on the dyno that an owner would see at 10 to 15 below zero f?
 
Could a person noticibly increase their miles per tank of gas with one of these controllers? (% increase in MPGs)

I would be intrested in being able to ride farther w/o carrying the extra weight of a gas can and gas on the rear rack of my mtn apex.


tk
 
Freddie

I reread my posts and I am not trying to get into a internet battle over the merits of a power commander. I applaud you for taking the time to share your vast knowledge on this forum. I am just curious what maginitude of horsepower increase you would expect from adding a power commander to an Apex. I know you have done some testing already on a stock Apex and were not able to get the results you wanted with the current controllers available.

Another off topic question. In general, do you see more power increase on FI motorcycles from the power commander timing changes or fuel mapping? Which brand of motorcycles seem to have the poorest as delivered fuel mapping?

Once again, thanks for sharing!
 
If this thing can lean the rich spots down so that I can get more than 11 mpg, than its worth it. Maybe it can even eliminate that lean accel spot when throttle is spiked at idle, causing that annoying hesitation.
 
Wouldnt Yamaha already of done extensive research on mapping the fuel before finalizing it? Or is every engine different in very slight ways?
 
Sled Dog said:
Wouldnt Yamaha already of done extensive research on mapping the fuel before finalizing it? Or is every engine different in very slight ways?
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I bet the 07 is calibrated better. We won't know of all of the extensive changes done to the Apex, untill probably August. Hopefully we can update the 06's to match the 07's calibration in every aspect.
 
Yamaha did do extensive research on the fuel mapping and ignition timing, but that doesn't mean they didn't leave extra HP on the table. Yamaha isn't going to set a sled to run at 100% maximum HP because they don't want to deal with the warranty and liability involved. The 2007's will be set the exact same way as the 2006's.
 
Srxspec said:
Yamaha did do extensive research on the fuel mapping and ignition timing, but that doesn't mean they didn't leave extra HP on the table. Yamaha isn't going to set a sled to run at 100% maximum HP because they don't want to deal with the warranty and liability involved. The 2007's will be set the exact same way as the 2006's.
Click to expand...

That makes perfect sense! I would think they would set them the same way also. Go Fredie Go!
 
Sled Dog said:
Wouldnt Yamaha already of done extensive research on mapping the fuel before finalizing it? Or is every engine different in very slight ways?
Click to expand...

I am sure they did a great deal of testing. Sometimes final production changes are made to pass noise and pollution requirements or component suppliers are changed due to availablity. The ignition timing, cam timing, sensor readings and fuel pressure also vary slightly from machine to machine.
 
Power Commander

I will tell you what I have learned from the Harley forums. No two motors are the same. Slight changes in production tolerances from machine to machine change the behavior and HP of each motor. Modifications only make the situation more complicated. No self respecting Harley owner would ever think of using canned maps after modifying their bike. Take a look in the dyno section at Harley Tech Talk and you will see dramatic changes after a dyno tune if done by a good dyno guy. With fuel injection it seems that maximum power and maximum fuel economy with good driveability are obtainable all at the same time. The rub is that not all dyno tuners are created equal. The Power Commander is very popular and there are many certified tuning centers throughout the USA. Talk to the sport bike or Harley guys in your area. On a final note, I am sure that stock sleds will benefit from a Power Commander and dyno tune. Whether the cost will be justifiable is up to each indivdual .
 
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