Indy
TY 4 Stroke God
I am just wondering how many people with hyfax problems had actually inspected or even changed their boogie wheels. Mine were all new at the beginning of last season. After my 3rd set of hyfaxs for this season, I finally checked my wheels with a caliper, I replaced every single one, plus added a set of marginal snow wheels on my M10. This has to be a contributing factor in all of the hyfaxs we've gone through this season. Plus the crappy snow. I haven't ridden on a trail with a base on it all season, it's been all LES.
So check your wheels.
A question for the riders who have been at it for a long time and LB's input, why don't sleds have more wheels on the rails? Like tanks do? I don't want to hear about the weight issue, because I am a trail rider. I am asking because I see 2 additional areas I could install another set of wheels and I ask myself why all sleds don't have more wheels. So please tell me why not? It would also help with the track freezing to the skid while in the tralier at night.
Thanks
So check your wheels.
A question for the riders who have been at it for a long time and LB's input, why don't sleds have more wheels on the rails? Like tanks do? I don't want to hear about the weight issue, because I am a trail rider. I am asking because I see 2 additional areas I could install another set of wheels and I ask myself why all sleds don't have more wheels. So please tell me why not? It would also help with the track freezing to the skid while in the tralier at night.
Thanks
Grimm
TY 4 Stroke God
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I won't tell you that the reason that sleds don't have more wheels is due to the weight savings.
I will tell you that it has to do with $ savings on the part of the manufacturer.
I don't know what sled you ride, but I do know that my brother's 07 Venture comes with at least 4 more idler wheels than the 05 Ventures did.
I will tell you that it has to do with $ savings on the part of the manufacturer.
I don't know what sled you ride, but I do know that my brother's 07 Venture comes with at least 4 more idler wheels than the 05 Ventures did.
LazyBastard
TY 4 Stroke God
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I remember my old '69 doo 368.
This is NOT mine, but is the same model;
A better picture of the type of suspension here;
These sleds had a whole bunch of wheels under them. Each set of 4 wheels was on its own suspension, and had a travel no greater than 2" and no shock absorbers at all. They were really horrible machines with a high center of gravity and extremely narrow ski stance. The engines also didn't work at all (but are said to be the most reliable thing doo ever made...). I completely gave up on the engine and replaced it with a Honda 4-stroke, making that machine into my first ATV and/or the first Honda snowmobile and one of the earliest 4-stroke snowmobiles. The Honda engine weighed WAY less than the doo 2-smoke it replaced and used a TINY TINY TINY fraction of the fuel.
Now the fun part is the transformation into more modern suspensions... this started in the 70's. Now imagine landing that sucker with all the wheels on a small lump, where the force is directed at only ONE SET of wheels - it would obviously bottom out easily in such circumstances, so it was determined that the suspension would behave more consistently with the whole suspension acting as one, and the way to do this is to set everything on RAILS. It also allows a MUCH greater suspension travel.
So now we've got a more modern suspension concept - rails. Now with rails, you can improve traction GREATLY - you get an even pressure along the whole length of the rail instead of having pressure points where all the wheels are, so they ripped out the wheels and ran them on plastic sliders, which are VERY CHEAP extrusions. Since then, they've been choosing the number and placement of wheels based on a balance between wear and COST.
Now there is ONE good thing to be said about having fewer wheels.... fewer bearings to replace.
This is NOT mine, but is the same model;
A better picture of the type of suspension here;
These sleds had a whole bunch of wheels under them. Each set of 4 wheels was on its own suspension, and had a travel no greater than 2" and no shock absorbers at all. They were really horrible machines with a high center of gravity and extremely narrow ski stance. The engines also didn't work at all (but are said to be the most reliable thing doo ever made...). I completely gave up on the engine and replaced it with a Honda 4-stroke, making that machine into my first ATV and/or the first Honda snowmobile and one of the earliest 4-stroke snowmobiles. The Honda engine weighed WAY less than the doo 2-smoke it replaced and used a TINY TINY TINY fraction of the fuel.
Now the fun part is the transformation into more modern suspensions... this started in the 70's. Now imagine landing that sucker with all the wheels on a small lump, where the force is directed at only ONE SET of wheels - it would obviously bottom out easily in such circumstances, so it was determined that the suspension would behave more consistently with the whole suspension acting as one, and the way to do this is to set everything on RAILS. It also allows a MUCH greater suspension travel.
So now we've got a more modern suspension concept - rails. Now with rails, you can improve traction GREATLY - you get an even pressure along the whole length of the rail instead of having pressure points where all the wheels are, so they ripped out the wheels and ran them on plastic sliders, which are VERY CHEAP extrusions. Since then, they've been choosing the number and placement of wheels based on a balance between wear and COST.
Now there is ONE good thing to be said about having fewer wheels.... fewer bearings to replace.
Indy
TY 4 Stroke God
So to make it simple for me, it would be a worse ride? Expense-maybe I'm am being a little overcautious, but I change carbides every season, why not wheels too? At the first sign of unusual hyfax wear, new wheels. I really can't see how it would hurt though to have more wheels, since they are not independent now. Seems to simple though.
Idler wheels relief some of the weight away from the sliders thus, bring their temp down further of the melting point. Their locations are probably "strategicaly" placed at hotter spots but, due to suspention arms interference, compromises are taking place. This weight transfer from sliders to idler wheels is grossly a combination of the gap between the bottom of wheels & the bottom of the slides. As the slides wear down, then this gap increase, so the pressure point on each idlers increase as well. Most member here will agree that the last mm of the sliders will last at least 5 times than the first one. That is, the weight balance shift from the sliders to the wheels as they wear. I noticed that almost every case of idler damage (or rail) i ever had was while my slides were about done. Evidently, adding a peak of force (stone, icy bump) to a single point where already loaded wheel is may just pass the upper limit. I have a RS Venture 2005 & did replace the rail for the 2006 one with the 4 extra idler hook. So from the 6 pressure point i had, is now distributed on 10. And yes, i kept the same diameter even if i replaced them all (for rubber type w/ replaceable bearing) and thus not messing with the weight transfert balance as the slider wear. The thin plastic wheels with Romanian molded bearing, the partially opened & clipped track and just to the limit number of idlers is IMO, a cost saving thing... which is required BTW if you compare what you get in relation with other vendors.
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