Today I got the chance to ride numerous 2011 Apex's along with various 2010 models to compare to. I don't bleed blue and have done my share of bitching about the 5 Yamaha's I currently own.
I started off like probably ever other demo rider did by just looking at the machines and taking pictures. Sitting on them, picking them up, etc. There were about 8 2011 regular Apex's there along with a XTX (did not get to ride this one.. bummer) and a SE (man that one looks sweet). For the 2010 models to compare to, they had a Nytro SE, Nytro XTX, Apex LTX, Vector and a Phazer. I sat on all of them, switching back and forth mainly between the LXT and the 2011 Apex as the LTX is about what my Attak is. I'm 6'4" and there is a significant difference in sitting on the 2 sleds. I really don't have any issues with my Attak.. or at least I didn't think I did until I sat on the 2011. It's not totally Nytro'ish way up high style, nor is it down lower like a 2010 or older Apex. It's a perfect balance between the 2. As everyone is standing around I start to really inspect the sleds. I can see they've been ridden in some marginal conditions by the lack of carbides left so I look at hyfax wear. My Attak eats them up about directly below my butt in between the from front idlers and the 2 inside idlers. I notice on the Apex LTX they moved the rear inside idlers up and well what is this.. the hyfax isn't smoked in that spot anymore! Nice even wear. I look at the 128's. Look real similar to a 121 layout but looks like pretty even wear on those also. I look at how the zerks on the front arms work and how grease gets distributed along the bolts and bushings. Nice job there. I look up under the tunnel to see how much snow/ice is up there as these sleds just came back in from a demo ride. Looks good.
So they ask us to pick a sled, everyone wanders around selecting something to ride and I make a b-line to the Apex XTX. After everyone gets seated I notice the Phazer in front of me is empty and we're all lined up. Damn.. so I move up to the Phazer and somebody moves up one behind me and gets on the XTX. Never rode a Phazer before, not my kind of sled so I was pretty bummed at 1st. I fire the Phazer up.. um.. hmm.. sounds like a John Deere tractor. Man I'm going to hate this. We take off and I'm not liking how this sled vibrates through the bars. Travel down a field to get to the trail, I'm punching the throttle on the thing. Hmm.. torquey little misfit. Gets into some corners.. wow.. this thing is actually pretty neat. Get on a straight section and I put the hammer down. Damn.. this thing is SLOW. Eventually we stop and I get off with the impression of the Phazer that its a great sled for goofing off and stuff, but not my idea of a trail sled. If there were no trails around me, I'd actually think of buying one.
Next for me was a regular 2011 Apex. Got on it, it was already running from the previous rider. Hmm.. this thing sounds different than my Attak. We've all heard about how they worked on the throttle response and everything so I start whacking the flipper. Damn! HUGE improvement in response. No lag, no delay, no nothing. So I'm sitting there waiting to move and figured I see what EPS is all about at a total stop. Crank the bars.. skis move. Wow.. REAL hard to do that on my Attak. So we take off at a pretty decent clip.. still way too slow for me. I'm moving the bars to the left and to the right. Like butter. Amazing. I actually start to giggle like a school girl and good thing I'm wearing a helmet so nobody can hear me. This is cool as hell! Now I see where "OMG" comes from. All of the previous demo riders, all the propaganda you've seen on the net about how EPS affects a sled is true but there is no way in hell you can fully appreciate what any of us are saying until you experience it. I really thought I was on something light like a 500cc Rev XP. I knew that they didn't take 100+ lbs out of the sled that's obvious, but man o man does it feel like they did. Unbelievable difference. Night and Day, black and white, whatever you want to call it.. EPS is the #*$&@ for trail sleds. I'm going around corners effortlessly and guess what.. this thing sticks in the corners. The new geometry along with EPS and the new ski design just plain works. I am one of those super aggressive trail riders that most people would call "asshole". This 2011 Apex is SOOOO much better at that it's plain stupid. The front ends were not dropped to the ground to make them handle like we all did to our 2010 and older sleds, they didn't have big carbides on them, 13mm sway bars, none of that gook. They didn't have anything but box stock Yamaha parts and they plain handle. I also have a SRX with a wide front end kit, C&A's and all that mess so I know what handling is. I tried to get it to lift the inside ski but never could. Of course we're usually only doing 40-50 MPH and I tend to ride at least double those speeds but if your actually trying to get it to lift a ski you normally can. I just couldn't on the 2011. So I'm having a blast and then realize somebody has the handwarmers on holocaust mode. WTF my hands are on fire! Whatever they did to the new warmers works too
Trails open up a bit so I start seeing how hard this thing will pull. All these sleds are not studded, which in IMO is freakin dangerous but I was impressed at how hard it accelerated. The 128" is definitely doing something along with that big bump in torque. It pulled much better then my Attak did when it wasn't studded yet. The "out of the corner" and the "doing 30 and hammer it" pull of the thing is very very nice. The torque they added is definitely noticeable. The EXUP really smooths out the power delivery even better than the previous engines. We were riding like a bunch of girl scouts (probably for liability reasons and rider capability besides me) so I wasn't able to really pin it like I do my Attak but it does pull alot harder than a 2010. I got one up to 90 or so before I about ran over the dude in front of me and it got there pretty darn quick.
We stop again and I get on a Vector. Sitting there it feels pretty much like my Attak, which now I am not liking as much as I used to after getting off a 2011. The Vector is running and holy hell does that clutch make a racket at idle. So we take off.. interesting. This steering does feel different from my Attak. I guess Gen II front geometry does work. So I hammer the throttle. Wow! I was expecting an underwhelming acceleration but this thing actually moves out pretty good. Don't know where it stops as I really didn't have the chance to open it all the way up due to slow riders in front of me. So I ride the Vector around for awhile..nice, feels like my Attak with a bit better steering. Handles about the same. Nice sled.
Next is another 2011 Apex. I get on it, we take off. THANK YOU! I am so happy to be back on a EPS equipped sled. It's identical to the 1st 2011 I rode so skip to the stop again.
Next in line is a Nytro XTX. Now I really wanted one of these but had never got the chance to ride one until now. We take off.. hmm.. this steering is weird. Get the the 1st corner, hmm.. this steering is awful! I felt it handled like crap. Didn't want to corner like the Apex did which now I had gotten real used to. It pushed in the corners and I had to work at the bars to get the front to do what I wanted it to. It was kind of upsetting that the 2011 Apex totally ruined my opinion of the Nytro XTX as I really did like them before today. Setup could maybe fix it for me.
We stop again and I get the 2011 Apex SE. We take off.. man I could just stay on this one all day.. well.. all week long. The trails are choppy with some bigger whoops and this machine sucked it all up. I really love my Attak for the choppy stuff, but the SE is much better at it. And.. I highly doubt it's even close to set up for me. Oh.. EBRS.. forgot about that. The 2011 Apex's have it.. engine braking reduction system. I got really used to the engine braking on my Attak/RX-1 and how to use it for cornering to my advantage. 1st corner I went into with the 2011 it was instantly apparent the 2011's don't' do it. After 2 or 3 corners I didn't miss how I used engine braking one bit. Glad it's gone Hand warmers are on "nuclear meltdown" on this machine so I turn them down to 1 bar. I have about 3 fat cells in my entire body and I get cold watching snow on TV. My hands used to freeze and totally piss me off on my Attak. These redesigned warmers on the 2011 Apex are awsome! Speaking of freezing, the new windshield works really well also. I didn't' get buffeted with wind, nor was the snow dust swirling around between my chest and the dash. Whatever they did really make the airflow go over you.. and I'm tall and stick up pretty high.
Next is the Apex LTX. Ahh.. this one is like an old familiar friend.. one who now has cheated on me with my wife and I really don't like them as much anymore. So I put a bunch of miles on this one.. feels like my Attak. I don't like sitting on it anymore, which is really going to irritate me on my next trip with my sled as I got so used to the 2011's seating position and that new seat foam. Speaking of that.. it's nice, nice like boobs on a 18 year old girl. Firm but supple too. While on the LTX I can notice my arms getting a bit fatigued from muscling this thing around the corners. Real familiar for sure.
We stop and next for me is a Nytro SE. I really like how this sleds looks. Aggressive looking. Get on it and we take off. Man.. there's that goofy steering again. I don't know if it's just how the linkages are or if EPS has totally ruined me. Much easier than the 2010 Apex LTX but still. It corners much better than the Nyro XTX IMO. We get into some choppy stuff. Ugh. Front end is bounching, rear end is bouncing, I am bouncing. Annoying to say the least. Here comes some big whoops. Ok.. this is where this sled shines. Sucked them right up. Now I got a bit of a smile as I'm pounding the whoops as hard as I can given the riders in front of me are slugs. Trail smooths out and we go for awhile.. hmm.. I'm feeling it in my arms again.
We stop and I'm back on 2 more 2011's. SWEET! I start really testing EPS, the new geometry and the new skis. I start taking some pretty serious corners with one hand. Effortless. Never experienced anything like this before. Not a ton of snow so I'm always looking for snow to stick a ski in to see how far I can push the cornering. When I do find enough, EPS, geometry and the new skis just laugh.. that's all you got??!! Might as well have auto pilot on it as it does exactly what I ask it to do without effort. After being on these 2 for quite awhile I notice hmm.. my arms feel great, legs feel great, back feels great, I could do this for 500 miles non stop for days on end.
This is exactly what they set the 2011 Apex up to do. Ride long and hard for miles and miles and be able to do it day after day. They got it right.
I still can't get over the feeling EPS gives and I highly doubt I can find the words to totally describe it. Your butt needs to be on a 2011 Apex to really understand. Is it for everybody? No. Probably useless for an off trail rider or powder rider as you would not get the benefits it provides. But for trail riders like me.. it's the shizznit for sure. The rest of the OEM's will have it soon I think. They have to. If I can already bust your #*$&@ in the trails on your new Cat or Doo with my old school Attak, and now I have what the 2011 Apex does?? It's not Game Changer.. it's Game Over.
The only negative thing I could find that bothered me was maybe track noise or something howling. I really never ride this slow (30-50MPH) on my RX-1 or Attak so I really never understood some of the complaints I've seen on here. Whenever I was able to pick the speed up it went away. Don't know if it's actually there, or it was the lack of snow, speed or what.
All the way home all I could think of was I just got to ride a sled I was totally impressed with that wasn't set up for me, wasn't studded, had worn out minuscule carbides on it, wasn't clutched, didn't have new plugs, airbox mods, crank trigger mods (or tuning), none of the things I usually do and I really really really liked it. I can just imagine getting ahold of one and tweaking it to my liking and then seeing what the thing can do.
I'm buying one for sure.
I started off like probably ever other demo rider did by just looking at the machines and taking pictures. Sitting on them, picking them up, etc. There were about 8 2011 regular Apex's there along with a XTX (did not get to ride this one.. bummer) and a SE (man that one looks sweet). For the 2010 models to compare to, they had a Nytro SE, Nytro XTX, Apex LTX, Vector and a Phazer. I sat on all of them, switching back and forth mainly between the LXT and the 2011 Apex as the LTX is about what my Attak is. I'm 6'4" and there is a significant difference in sitting on the 2 sleds. I really don't have any issues with my Attak.. or at least I didn't think I did until I sat on the 2011. It's not totally Nytro'ish way up high style, nor is it down lower like a 2010 or older Apex. It's a perfect balance between the 2. As everyone is standing around I start to really inspect the sleds. I can see they've been ridden in some marginal conditions by the lack of carbides left so I look at hyfax wear. My Attak eats them up about directly below my butt in between the from front idlers and the 2 inside idlers. I notice on the Apex LTX they moved the rear inside idlers up and well what is this.. the hyfax isn't smoked in that spot anymore! Nice even wear. I look at the 128's. Look real similar to a 121 layout but looks like pretty even wear on those also. I look at how the zerks on the front arms work and how grease gets distributed along the bolts and bushings. Nice job there. I look up under the tunnel to see how much snow/ice is up there as these sleds just came back in from a demo ride. Looks good.
So they ask us to pick a sled, everyone wanders around selecting something to ride and I make a b-line to the Apex XTX. After everyone gets seated I notice the Phazer in front of me is empty and we're all lined up. Damn.. so I move up to the Phazer and somebody moves up one behind me and gets on the XTX. Never rode a Phazer before, not my kind of sled so I was pretty bummed at 1st. I fire the Phazer up.. um.. hmm.. sounds like a John Deere tractor. Man I'm going to hate this. We take off and I'm not liking how this sled vibrates through the bars. Travel down a field to get to the trail, I'm punching the throttle on the thing. Hmm.. torquey little misfit. Gets into some corners.. wow.. this thing is actually pretty neat. Get on a straight section and I put the hammer down. Damn.. this thing is SLOW. Eventually we stop and I get off with the impression of the Phazer that its a great sled for goofing off and stuff, but not my idea of a trail sled. If there were no trails around me, I'd actually think of buying one.
Next for me was a regular 2011 Apex. Got on it, it was already running from the previous rider. Hmm.. this thing sounds different than my Attak. We've all heard about how they worked on the throttle response and everything so I start whacking the flipper. Damn! HUGE improvement in response. No lag, no delay, no nothing. So I'm sitting there waiting to move and figured I see what EPS is all about at a total stop. Crank the bars.. skis move. Wow.. REAL hard to do that on my Attak. So we take off at a pretty decent clip.. still way too slow for me. I'm moving the bars to the left and to the right. Like butter. Amazing. I actually start to giggle like a school girl and good thing I'm wearing a helmet so nobody can hear me. This is cool as hell! Now I see where "OMG" comes from. All of the previous demo riders, all the propaganda you've seen on the net about how EPS affects a sled is true but there is no way in hell you can fully appreciate what any of us are saying until you experience it. I really thought I was on something light like a 500cc Rev XP. I knew that they didn't take 100+ lbs out of the sled that's obvious, but man o man does it feel like they did. Unbelievable difference. Night and Day, black and white, whatever you want to call it.. EPS is the #*$&@ for trail sleds. I'm going around corners effortlessly and guess what.. this thing sticks in the corners. The new geometry along with EPS and the new ski design just plain works. I am one of those super aggressive trail riders that most people would call "asshole". This 2011 Apex is SOOOO much better at that it's plain stupid. The front ends were not dropped to the ground to make them handle like we all did to our 2010 and older sleds, they didn't have big carbides on them, 13mm sway bars, none of that gook. They didn't have anything but box stock Yamaha parts and they plain handle. I also have a SRX with a wide front end kit, C&A's and all that mess so I know what handling is. I tried to get it to lift the inside ski but never could. Of course we're usually only doing 40-50 MPH and I tend to ride at least double those speeds but if your actually trying to get it to lift a ski you normally can. I just couldn't on the 2011. So I'm having a blast and then realize somebody has the handwarmers on holocaust mode. WTF my hands are on fire! Whatever they did to the new warmers works too
Trails open up a bit so I start seeing how hard this thing will pull. All these sleds are not studded, which in IMO is freakin dangerous but I was impressed at how hard it accelerated. The 128" is definitely doing something along with that big bump in torque. It pulled much better then my Attak did when it wasn't studded yet. The "out of the corner" and the "doing 30 and hammer it" pull of the thing is very very nice. The torque they added is definitely noticeable. The EXUP really smooths out the power delivery even better than the previous engines. We were riding like a bunch of girl scouts (probably for liability reasons and rider capability besides me) so I wasn't able to really pin it like I do my Attak but it does pull alot harder than a 2010. I got one up to 90 or so before I about ran over the dude in front of me and it got there pretty darn quick.We stop again and I get on a Vector. Sitting there it feels pretty much like my Attak, which now I am not liking as much as I used to after getting off a 2011. The Vector is running and holy hell does that clutch make a racket at idle. So we take off.. interesting. This steering does feel different from my Attak. I guess Gen II front geometry does work. So I hammer the throttle. Wow! I was expecting an underwhelming acceleration but this thing actually moves out pretty good. Don't know where it stops as I really didn't have the chance to open it all the way up due to slow riders in front of me. So I ride the Vector around for awhile..nice, feels like my Attak with a bit better steering. Handles about the same. Nice sled.
Next is another 2011 Apex. I get on it, we take off. THANK YOU! I am so happy to be back on a EPS equipped sled. It's identical to the 1st 2011 I rode so skip to the stop again.
Next in line is a Nytro XTX. Now I really wanted one of these but had never got the chance to ride one until now. We take off.. hmm.. this steering is weird. Get the the 1st corner, hmm.. this steering is awful! I felt it handled like crap. Didn't want to corner like the Apex did which now I had gotten real used to. It pushed in the corners and I had to work at the bars to get the front to do what I wanted it to. It was kind of upsetting that the 2011 Apex totally ruined my opinion of the Nytro XTX as I really did like them before today. Setup could maybe fix it for me.
We stop again and I get the 2011 Apex SE. We take off.. man I could just stay on this one all day.. well.. all week long. The trails are choppy with some bigger whoops and this machine sucked it all up. I really love my Attak for the choppy stuff, but the SE is much better at it. And.. I highly doubt it's even close to set up for me. Oh.. EBRS.. forgot about that. The 2011 Apex's have it.. engine braking reduction system. I got really used to the engine braking on my Attak/RX-1 and how to use it for cornering to my advantage. 1st corner I went into with the 2011 it was instantly apparent the 2011's don't' do it. After 2 or 3 corners I didn't miss how I used engine braking one bit. Glad it's gone
Hand warmers are on "nuclear meltdown" on this machine so I turn them down to 1 bar. I have about 3 fat cells in my entire body and I get cold watching snow on TV. My hands used to freeze and totally piss me off on my Attak. These redesigned warmers on the 2011 Apex are awsome! Speaking of freezing, the new windshield works really well also. I didn't' get buffeted with wind, nor was the snow dust swirling around between my chest and the dash. Whatever they did really make the airflow go over you.. and I'm tall and stick up pretty high. Next is the Apex LTX. Ahh.. this one is like an old familiar friend.. one who now has cheated on me with my wife and I really don't like them as much anymore. So I put a bunch of miles on this one.. feels like my Attak. I don't like sitting on it anymore, which is really going to irritate me on my next trip with my sled as I got so used to the 2011's seating position and that new seat foam. Speaking of that.. it's nice, nice like boobs on a 18 year old girl. Firm but supple too. While on the LTX I can notice my arms getting a bit fatigued from muscling this thing around the corners. Real familiar for sure.
We stop and next for me is a Nytro SE. I really like how this sleds looks. Aggressive looking. Get on it and we take off. Man.. there's that goofy steering again. I don't know if it's just how the linkages are or if EPS has totally ruined me. Much easier than the 2010 Apex LTX but still. It corners much better than the Nyro XTX IMO. We get into some choppy stuff. Ugh. Front end is bounching, rear end is bouncing, I am bouncing. Annoying to say the least. Here comes some big whoops. Ok.. this is where this sled shines. Sucked them right up. Now I got a bit of a smile as I'm pounding the whoops as hard as I can given the riders in front of me are slugs. Trail smooths out and we go for awhile.. hmm.. I'm feeling it in my arms again.
We stop and I'm back on 2 more 2011's. SWEET! I start really testing EPS, the new geometry and the new skis. I start taking some pretty serious corners with one hand. Effortless. Never experienced anything like this before. Not a ton of snow so I'm always looking for snow to stick a ski in to see how far I can push the cornering. When I do find enough, EPS, geometry and the new skis just laugh.. that's all you got??!! Might as well have auto pilot on it as it does exactly what I ask it to do without effort. After being on these 2 for quite awhile I notice hmm.. my arms feel great, legs feel great, back feels great, I could do this for 500 miles non stop for days on end.
This is exactly what they set the 2011 Apex up to do. Ride long and hard for miles and miles and be able to do it day after day. They got it right.
I still can't get over the feeling EPS gives and I highly doubt I can find the words to totally describe it. Your butt needs to be on a 2011 Apex to really understand. Is it for everybody? No. Probably useless for an off trail rider or powder rider as you would not get the benefits it provides. But for trail riders like me.. it's the shizznit for sure. The rest of the OEM's will have it soon I think. They have to. If I can already bust your #*$&@ in the trails on your new Cat or Doo with my old school Attak, and now I have what the 2011 Apex does?? It's not Game Changer.. it's Game Over.
The only negative thing I could find that bothered me was maybe track noise or something howling. I really never ride this slow (30-50MPH) on my RX-1 or Attak so I really never understood some of the complaints I've seen on here. Whenever I was able to pick the speed up it went away. Don't know if it's actually there, or it was the lack of snow, speed or what.
All the way home all I could think of was I just got to ride a sled I was totally impressed with that wasn't set up for me, wasn't studded, had worn out minuscule carbides on it, wasn't clutched, didn't have new plugs, airbox mods, crank trigger mods (or tuning), none of the things I usually do and I really really really liked it. I can just imagine getting ahold of one and tweaking it to my liking and then seeing what the thing can do.
I'm buying one for sure.
RW06GT
Extreme
RunninRX1 said:
been a while but I think I remember what that feels like! lol
Good writeup, I hope to get to take a test ride this winter. If I am as impressed as you seem to be, there is definitely an xtx in my future. Was the SE that impressive with the floats? An se xtx sound like it would be the perfect version for me, if they made one.
Rash
Expert
Nice report,
I was supposed to go try them on sunday , but had a change of plan..
a guy i talked to that tried it on wednesday pretty much says the same as you: EPS changes everything,and he tried the XTX and wondered if he would go back to a short track (always had shorttracks) because of the eas
y handling and even more plush ride...
Excellent hand warmers, and acceleration and torque..
IT ALL SOUNDS GOOD..
I was supposed to go try them on sunday , but had a change of plan..
a guy i talked to that tried it on wednesday pretty much says the same as you: EPS changes everything,and he tried the XTX and wondered if he would go back to a short track (always had shorttracks) because of the eas
y handling and even more plush ride...
Excellent hand warmers, and acceleration and torque..
IT ALL SOUNDS GOOD..
jlemieu1
Lifetime Member
- Joined
- Feb 7, 2005
- Messages
- 388
- Location
- Rosemount, MN
- Country
- USA
- Snowmobile
- 14 Viper LTX SE, 14 Viper LTX
Wow, you were not kidding about being long.
All that aside, thanks for the write up.
All that aside, thanks for the write up.
It's a good thing I wasn't drinking coffee at the time. Would have ended up War and Peace length
That new seat foam sounds really comfortable! LMAO
good post,finally some positive about this sled,this is the kind of post i read with interest,not like some on here bashing every pcs on the sled before even seeing 1 in person
cat hunter
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Makes me want to try one !!! Great post!!!
You can go see one on display at Motor City Powersports in Bloomfield Hills MI tomorrow.
srvfan
Expert
- Joined
- Nov 9, 2004
- Messages
- 484
Makes me wonder what an EPS Vector would be like....
EPS Vector would be awesome too. I was actually impressed with the Vector. I had ridden older Vectors and they gave me a nice yawn. Good for lower speed long distance cruising which I guess alot of people like to do. Not me. I like fast and hard pull out of the corners. The new Vector has that. Typically new technology is a filter down method. Vector will get it I think as well as the utility sleds. Now there is another segment that it would rule on.
Chasx7
Pro
- Joined
- Dec 4, 2005
- Messages
- 135
- Location
- Hesperia, MI
- Country
- USA
- Snowmobile
- 1997 700SX, 2002 Viper, 2008 Apex GT, 2015 Polaris 800 Pro-R Switchback
I live an hour from Cadillac. You got me thinking about a trip over there to try em today. Nice report.
sad to hear yamaha still cant figure out the xtx's steering..I did in 15 minutes and its a different sled...its been said...but I think the shock person/people should be fired...
Yamaha Sled Talk Blog
VIP Member
RunninRX1 said:It's a good thing I wasn't drinking coffee at the time. Would have ended up War and Peace length
Thinking the boys should have sent you home with a box of Monster Energy under one arm and Red Bull under the other... that was very well written and you nailed every point I was hoping to see out of the demo ride program. You may have just changed the military drop test method we employ for measuring seat foam durometer... permanently. cheers cr
rxwhopper
TY 4 Stroke Guru
ok getting back to the breasts!!!
