Sell me on a Viper

[alexm2816]

Coming from a 10 yo BRP 2 stroke, after only 400 miles on the 4 stroke machine (I bought in March this year so I only had one weekend with it) I already feel liberated by not having to think about oil. I think this is something you'll take for granted if you go back from your status quo now where the only consumable part you need to worry about is a belt.

Beyond the cost associated with $50 a gallon oil, you're looking at $8 plugs, way more expensive belts. It adds up quick.

 

[alexm2816]

You can pick up a new left over viper for $7,500 plus tax, that's leaves 2 grand for clutch kit, header, intake, can, and fuel programmer or flash to make your viper a 100 mph+ sled all day, I had a 13' nytro xtx and I know exactly what you mean, viper is an awesome sled especially in the bumps, I loved my nytro but it was like a mechanical bull.

Man, wish I had found that deal this year. Ended up at 11.5k w/ a mpi trail turbo installed, a cover, a 5 year YES, and a belt and I was feeling pretty damned good about it! LOL

 

[DelgatyXTX]

I had 2 sleds in mind when I was shopping this spring. A Viper or a Renegade 1200. I rode a 1200 last season and although the chassis suits me a bit better, the engine didn't compare to the Genesis 130. The Yamaha motor is downright violent compared to the 4tec. The Cat chassis is set up very well and although it's bulkier than an XS chassis it's still very well built. More so than the XS I'd say. I had a Nytro too and if you like yours, you'll love the Viper. Handles way better, rides way better. Same great motor.

 

[RTX]

I basically have the sport package from hygear, TRS on front, Dual rate on rear, hy/lo valves and their revalve and their spring spacer. AS far as skis I have upgraded to the tuners and I have no issue with turning the sled. My issue is the rear skid feels like I am on a pogo stick. I feel every hard hit. I've tried so many adjustments buy cant seem to find the sweet spot. That said... the sled puts a smile on my face each time I ride it. It just comes down to feeling like I rode a bull all day long. It just isn't very forgiving on the rough trails.

Im probably going to be in the minority here, but in my opinion i would keep the nytro and spend some money on a skid.
I have seen brand new takeoff skids from a 129 viper/zr7000 on ebay for 600 bucks.
With shipping and shock revalving and you can put the same skid in my viper into your nytro for under a grand.
In my opinion now you have the best of both worlds.
The yamaha electronics. Clutching and drivetrain and a modern working skid.
I think you could probably sell your skid from your nytro and use that money on the EVO powersports reflash for the nytro which gives you more hp and fixes the handwarmers. BOOM problem sloved for a grand and a little work!!

On ebay search procross skid, theres a dozen available

 

[Sevey]

Love this thread. Been watching the Viper for awhile and have spent some time on them. I have many upgrades to my Nytro so I have a bit of an affinity towards it.
The procross chassis has some really good handling characteristics right of the box. Its a great handling sled, way better than the nytro. But with some tweeking the Nytro can be close. When dragging my friend, my Nytro is only marginally faster.

I am still eerie about the electronic problems the Vipers present and have watched friends fumble with them and loose riding days.
I also think the Nytro is a much easier sled to work on than the Procross.

If I got a viper I would look to raising the bar about 2", somehow get a stiffer seat, I find it too soft (or try raising it a bit with a mountain seat) and investigate ski options.
And pray the ecu problem doesn't haunt you....lol
MS

 

[RTX]

Im probably going to be in the minority here, but in my opinion i would keep the nytro and spend some money on a skid.
I have seen brand new takeoff skids from a 129 viper/zr7000 on ebay for 600 bucks.
With shipping and shock revalving and you can put the same skid in my viper into your nytro for under a grand.
In my opinion now you have the best of both worlds.
The yamaha electronics. Clutching and drivetrain and a modern working skid.
I think you could probably sell your skid from your nytro and use that money on the EVO powersports reflash for the nytro which gives you more hp and fixes the handwarmers. BOOM problem sloved for a grand and a little work!!

On ebay search procross skid, theres a dozen available

Sorry i forgot,
Your gonna need new drivers and a track too
Starting to add up a little more, but it can be done for around 1500-1600
Thats still way cheaper than what a viper is gonna cost you.

You could also look for a used skid the same size as yours, like an m10 or one of those plastic ad biovine skids.
Or even a polaris or skidoo skid that will allow you to keep your existing track and drivers, keping the cost low.
I know bjowett on here runs a mono skid in his nytro along with a heavily modified ohlins shock with pds.
You could even pm him and see if he can set you up with some info on the mono.
Mono skids ride great. The weakness with them is bottoming but the pds shock mod really helps with that.
You really have a million options that are not too expensive.

 

[jsslye]

Nytrorider28, I went from an '09 Nytro RTX-SE with 9200 miles to a '16 Viper LTX-LE and I have ZERO regrets. I loved my Nytro and I was afraid I would lose some of the torque/arm-socket-pull, and GROWL of the Nytro but within 2 miles on the Viper and those doubts and thoughts were gone, plus it is SO easy to steer (yeah, for a 4 stroke, blah blah blah) but it really is easier to ride - just point it and pin it.

 

[nytrorider28]

All great input guys! Really appreciate the feedback. I was leaning the Polaris way but the more I read and think about it I fear I will regret it. I sure do not miss $46-$54 gallon of oil.
Can anyone confirm have any 2016's have the starter issue. Was that a 14/15 year problem or is it still an issue?

 

[nytrorider28]

I can offer my friends experience and my purchase decision. My friend who is a master mechanic and an all out motorsports freak purchased three Nytros for his crew. He absolutely hated the handling. He added all kinds of mods and spent countless hours wrenching to fix the issues. In the end he gave up and purchased three new Cat 7000's (Viper). Now all he does is rave about his sleds. He will not put up with the 2 stroke motor reliability and the Nitro handling- solution was the Viper/ 7000. I recently purchased the STX-146-DX because I wanted 4 stroke solo performance with the ability to have a competent 2 up sled. With the long track, extra 5 gallons of fuel, and the amazing heated 2up seat that comes on/off in seconds, I have what for me is the perfect sled if I were to design one from scratch. I also own a 2012 Viking RS Professional which I will be selling to finance the Viper. Outside of the design of the 146 DX, I needed something that could accommodate my very messed up spine. I did everything I could to talk myself into the Axys Polaris 800 Switchback, but the 2 up seat was a joke and the motor was not going to compare to the Yamaha. I believe the Polaris would have been better for my back, but I will never know.

What 2 up seat you go with? The factory or aftermarket? I like the sounds of off and on in seconds! Any pics?

 

[jsslye]

I haven't had one issue with the starter on my '16, but Canondale would be a good person to ask about the starter issue overall - pretty sure it was with the '14's and '15's, but correctable by a flash.

 

[cannondale27]

Yes have not heard of any 16 starter/gear failures. I always tell people that if you want a long term sled with opportunity to add mods and make it your own definitely go 4stroke. The 4stroke starts to hugely show its value at 5000mi+ as long as chassis maintainence is done regularly. All my 2st buddies that hit around 5000 mi get new sleds. This means $ and starting over with mods if done all while I am just perfecting mods and saving $ for hotels and fuel to find snow! Also is a nice feeling at pump when they put more fuel in and have to spring for 2 st oil also. Eventually everyone wants a different sled for me it's around 10000 mi and then your 4st can confidently be sold to a good friend or given to a family member without worry about the sled causing someone you like trouble and lost ride time. That said if looking for ditch banging,jumping and huge whoops or even extreme off trail and you get a new sled every 3-5000 mi anyway the 2stroke sleds still have a slight advantage in wieght and performance out of the box and the Axis is top 2 or 3 2strokes for sure. Just don't buy it for long term.

 

[nytrorider28]

Yes have not heard of any 16 starter/gear failures. I always tell people that if you want a long term sled with opportunity to add mods and make it your own definitely go 4stroke. The 4stroke starts to hugely show its value at 5000mi+ as long as chassis maintainence is done regularly. All my 2st buddies that hit around 5000 mi get new sleds. This means $ and starting over with mods if done all while I am just perfecting mods and saving $ for hotels and fuel to find snow! Also is a nice feeling at pump when they put more fuel in and have to spring for 2 st oil also. Eventually everyone wants a different sled for me it's around 10000 mi and then your 4st can confidently be sold to a good friend or given to a family member without worry about the sled causing someone you like trouble and lost ride time. That said if looking for ditch banging,jumping and huge whoops or even extreme off trail and you get a new sled every 3-5000 mi anyway the 2stroke sleds still have a slight advantage in wieght and performance out of the box and the Axis is top 2 or 3 2strokes for sure. Just don't buy it for long term.

All very good points! My nytro seems to pull harder with each mile I put on it. No I don't plan to swap sleds every couple of years so yes again the 4 stroke makes most sense to me. 98% of my miles on my sled are from northern WI and the U.P. So a good trail sled is what I want. Option to throw on a 2 up is a bouns too for the occasional ride for the daughter.

 

[jsslye]

Yeah Canondale has a habit of making good points. Pretty sure he gets kickbacks from Yamaha. ;-) That was the amazing thing about the Nytro - the motor seemed to loosen up over time and pull harder and harder. I only got 699 miles on my new Viper this year because of the dismal winter we had here in WNY/Upstate NY, but I got into the throttle pretty hard for most of them. My Nytro was a 121" track and the Viper is a 137 - I was concerned about that change too, but the LTX really is a better overall handling sled, way more forgiving, and doesn't require any muscling around to get it to go where you want it to.

 

[nytrorider28]

Yeah Canondale has a habit of making good points. Pretty sure he gets kickbacks from Yamaha. ;-) That was the amazing thing about the Nytro - the motor seemed to loosen up over time and pull harder and harder. I only got 699 miles on my new Viper this year because of the dismal winter we had here in WNY/Upstate NY, but I got into the throttle pretty hard for most of them. My Nytro was a 121" track and the Viper is a 137 - I was concerned about that change too, but the LTX really is a better overall handling sled, way more forgiving, and doesn't require any muscling around to get it to go where you want it to.

Great to hear! That's what I will go with as well. A 137 LTX. The longer track will help bridge some of the moguls better then the short tracks. Years back I said I'd never go a long track and now I can't wait! Ha! Cannondale and everyone else that has chimed in has been very helpful. Pretty cool to have a forum with others that have the same passion and can give good information to each other. With that said the search is on for a leftover viper. Seems like I have some choices. This viper will be my 7th Yamaha (not all sleds) so it looks like I'll be staying in the Yamaha family. This could be a long summer....high 90's today.

 

[mtotguy]

I put 9000 miles on a Nytro and liked it. But it was heavy and tippy . I could go pretty fast in the tight stuff but it took a lot of work. So I went to the Viper. I was disappointed from the outset. The motor never pulled as well as the Nytro, it used more fuel and then came the starter issues. It rides and handles well but I just never warmed up to it. My wife rides it now. I bought a Rush Pro S 800 last year and put 2400 miles on it. I was never so sad to see winter come to an end! And as far as 2 stroke motors wearing out...I've never seen it happen to a modern 2 stroke. I put 8000 miles on a SX700 and I have a friend that had 14000 miles on an F7 before he did a top end. And if my battery ever dies or my starter quits I'll just pull the rope and go on my way.