Suspension Thoughts

[sxmatt]

I am undecided which apex to get and have had way too much time to think about it since there are a couple things that I don't understand.

I am MOST interested in the RTX but I don't understand Yamaha's selection of shocks and suspension for this model. First the floats were choosen probably because of the weight savings. My problem with the floats is that when you increase the air springs you can't control the rebound because there is no rebound adjustment. Increasing your spring rate increases your rate of rebound when the shock unloads. The remote res with clicker compression and rebound ,I think, would be a better choice.

Second, why choose the mono over the torsion spring rising rate rear skid. For the riders (Rough Trail) who the sled was marketed for why have a different skid in it than the nytro which is also marketed for rough trail riding. Plus the mono rear with its remote adjuster is mainly a rebound adjustment with SOME compression adjustment. I can't understand how adjusting rebound make the sled handle the rough trials better. A detailed explaination would be REALLY helpful.

Thanks
Matt

 

[sk-rx1]

I don't know enough to answer much of your questions but I will make one comment. With my 02 Viper the rear had a very agressive rebound, when you pushed it down it came back very slowly. This was confirmed when riding it, if you hit one bump it took it well, when there was another bump right after it it didn't do so well. In stutter bumps it seemed like it would pound itself to the bottom, the suspension did not recover fast enough to absorb repeated bumps, it was still compressed from the first one. I heard that the new shocks that Yamaha offered had much less rebound control. Rebound control is tricky, there is a lot to be gained there but it's not always obviuos how to get there, especially to the novice like many of us are in this area.

 

[Silverbullet]

It's my understanding and experiance that the mono shock controlls mostly compressiom with SOME rebound....I think the air shocks main value is their resistance to bottoming which is why it's on the RTX

 

[Roadrunner]

It's my understanding and experiance that the mono shock controlls mostly compressiom with SOME rebound....I think the air shocks main value is their resistance to bottoming which is why it's on the RTX

I agree Silverbullet, plus the weight savings.

 

[jimmie d]

I honestly don't think Yamaha expects anybody to pound the RTX like they would the Nytro. How is the RTX more of a rough trail than the GT/ER just the Floats. I don't think so, maybe theoretically but not in the real world. It is all markrting!

Jim

 

[sxmatt]

I know for sure that the mono shock in the rear with its remote adjuster is mainly REBOUND with some compression adjustment. In addition I think people WILL pound the RTX. I look at it as this is the equivalent to an 800, in a X package or sno -pro type of sled. If I get the RTX I for one will ride the sled as hard as I ride my REV. I agree the floats are for weight savings but if you think of it as you increase spring force, either by a coil or air it will rebound faster since there is no additional valving change to slow the rebound. So I don't know how this will feel on the trail. In reference to the mono I again don't know how it will react on the trails when ridden really hard over the really rough trails we will see on a saturday afternoon here in the states, when you make adjustments to the dial adjustment because you are making MAINLY rebound adjustments. It may be just like someone who made a post that the mono will feel like it is "stacking" and not able to rebound fully.

Thanks
Matt

 

[ReX]

Few things I might be able to add:

- The remote adjuster controls a bypass valve. This means that if the shock is valved for lots of compression damping, it will have a large effect on compression damping. Stock in the 05's they were valved for much more rebound than compression damping so there was more control of rebound. 06's have new valving so who knows...(also the valving can always be customized as these are rebuildable shocks).

- If you look at the literature for the 06 sleds you'll see the mono-shock spring is now a variable rate spring - meaning rising rate. This should help to control bottoming as well as provide a nice cruising ride. Hopefully the shock will have the right lower speed vs higher speed rebound damping to work work well with the spring.

- The 05 RX-1 spring was too soft for aggressive riding, especially if you weigh 200 or more. If you install the heavy spring (50% higher spring rate) the sled really rides well when ridden aggressively. I love the ride, but I'm always holding myself back (compared to how I rode my Polaris) because I'm aftraid the suspension will break (again).

- The way my 05 RX-1 rides (with the heavy spring and stock shock setup), it "feels" like it can handle anything. It gives a great ride at high speeds over moguls, landings are smooth and controlled without bottoming. Basically it's everything an aggressive rider wants in a suspension as far as performance is concerned (it's also a great cruising suspension - load up the saddle bags, turn down the RA a little and 600 kms per day is no problem).

- I have a number of buddies that ride their Cat, Rev, and Polaris sleds very hard (without breaking suspensions...). The guys riding the high powered sleds are seriously considering the RTX, the guys riding the lower powered sleds are considering the Nitro. Both the RTX and Nitro's will be ridden just as hard with this group. The only thing holding them back is concern about the suspensions not handling the task. We'll be looking at the suspensions very carefully this weekend at the show.

 

[Silverbullet]

Yamaha claims that the Fox shocks are specifically valved for the RTX I assume this means valving for hi air preasure operations......If you are really concerned about shock valving I would get the GT as the compression is electronically controlled and the rebound is manually controlled on the mono...