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WHO'LL HAVE EFI CHIP FIRST ???

I don't know why I waste time getting involved in these discussions but 2 things have been said that are retarded. Jtssrx, you know damm well 2 strokes make different hp with different jetting. You can gain a couple with a 4 stroke but it's not even close. And who the heck can compare a turbo diesel to a regular 4 stroke??? Well JDKRXW answered that already. You guys can get all giddy all you want. Fact remains a chip will only add a few hp, unless extensive mods are made with it... Good example, on a stock Mustang 5.0 with just a chip and nothing else you gain less than 5 hp.
 

fstblkwarrior: I'm confused by your post. Again Your not addressing Timing in your post. In my last post I pointed out the F7 and the gains made in Timing and fuel increases.

I don't really care what the apex does, I'm not geting one. I was just repeating what i was told by a reliable source.

I know for a fact you cangain about 20 on the F7 with the same changes I talked about. So tell me why couldn't you gain the same on the apex?
 
The F7 is run in a fat, conservative, reliable tune(i.e. no warranty claims). On 2 stokes you can jet them to the edge with your beloved timing and create way more power than jetting them safe. A stock efi F7 takes into account bad, old, nasty gas to make sure the average consumer does not blow his engine. A 4 stroke once jetted properly will not be nearly as affected by anything. Hence if Yamaha has efi on it, it is already calibrated properly and even changing the fuel rate will not create significant hp. Your timing is fine, run on premium. But advancing timing on a fourstroke will only gain you 5 or less hp with premium gas in addition to your fuel rate change. Don't you think if there was so much hp to be made by fuel and timing adjustments that smart guys like cpr/speedshop/ecp would have been offering kits to change it on the rx1's??? The fact is you will need extensive mods in addition to a chip to get something worthwhile. Look at sportbikes. On the average r1 on the DYNO(not manufactuer claims) a exhaust and requisite power comander will net you 3 hp. You would need to do intake/exhaust/valvetrain etc. to get 20hp. I'm done with this post, it's like argueing with someone and I don't come here to do that. Good luck with your chips fellas.
 
fstblkwarrior said:
The F7 is run in a fat, conservative, reliable tune(i.e. no warranty claims). On 2 stokes you can jet them to the edge with your beloved timing and create way more power than jetting them safe. A stock efi F7 takes into account bad, old, nasty gas to make sure the average consumer does not blow his engine. A 4 stroke once jetted properly will not be nearly as affected by anything. Hence if Yamaha has efi on it, it is already calibrated properly and even changing the fuel rate will not create significant hp. Your timing is fine, run on premium. But advancing timing on a fourstroke will only gain you 5 or less hp with premium gas in addition to your fuel rate change. Don't you think if there was so much hp to be made by fuel and timing adjustments that smart guys like cpr/speedshop/ecp would have been offering kits to change it on the rx1's??? The fact is you will need extensive mods in addition to a chip to get something worthwhile. Look at sportbikes. On the average r1 on the DYNO(not manufactuer claims) a exhaust and requisite power comander will net you 3 hp. You would need to do intake/exhaust/valvetrain etc. to get 20hp. I'm done with this post, it's like argueing with someone and I don't come here to do that. Good luck with your chips fellas.
Click to expand...


Just for clarification. We are not a R&D company with the resourses to test/tune fuel delivery solutions for these motors. Guys like CPR/ECP are the experts here. It would be nice to hear something from them with regards to this subject...BBY
 
I can't beat 2 weeks as I don't have the FI system off an 06 sled yet. If it's anything like the Yamaha bike stuff then it won't be a problem.
I have already done some Yamaha EFI work along with Kawasaki (bikes and jetskis) and alot of people are asking me to take a shot at the blown SeaDoos.

Makign chips and stuff is what I do everyday. I'm not just a 'tuner', I also design and manufacture the software and hardware to make 'chips' and 'programmers'. So when I saw the 06's come with EFI.. damn was I a happy guy.
I highly doubt the 06 sleds will come with a removeable chip.. will be FLASH based so you will need a programmer.

I started to crack the CDI box on my 2000 SRX.. was able to suck the brains out of the thing and started reverse engineering the code but gave up and started to design a new programmable box for it. I may do that with the 03-05 RX-1 CDI box but I need to get a spare I can hack apart 1st. Too much fun stuff to do, too little time.

I'm still going to make a EFI kit for my 05 as I think that sled can be improved upon over the carbs.. especially in turbo applications (which I want to do to my 05).

As for what U will see out of re-mapping the PCM on an 06... depends greatly on the calibration they put in it to start with. Manufactuers cannot put a calibration in that is the best it's gonna be.. no way, no how. They do not know the enviornment the machine will be operated in, the fuel type used, many variables. They have to be somewhat conservative. This is why chips and things work on the majority of vehicles out there. Some vehicles are closer to optimum (say a new Z06 'Vette) than others, but I have yet to find a vehicle I can't make more power on.

So what we will see from the 06's depends on how close Yamaha pushed them to the edge of being optimized. Knowing them, there is room to play so to speak :)
 
fstblkwarrior: You couldn't make the power gains on carbed F7's you could with teh Fuel injected ones.


Lets let this play out. I say it will happen you sya it won't. One of us is right. I'm betting everyone on this site hopes it's me.

If your right and you'll only see 5 hp then your back to the orginal mods to make more power. But if you can get 165 out of the apex with the addition of a box that will be cool
 
Gains on the very similar bike motors with no other changes are usually around 3-4 HP if you change filter and exhaust timing and fuel curve maybe 10 -12 My busa with air box mod Power commander 4-2-1 Two Brothers Exhaust and a BMC race air filter gained about 8 HP on top but it did clean up the power curve.
 
fstblkwarrior is correct! cept I don't think you will even see 5 hp from a chip The two stroke can be tweeked harder, that is the 20 hp seen on the f7. The four stroke will not gain if tweeked like that. Been there, done that! Only way to extract big power is pressure charging. 165 is NEVER going to happen! Anyone claiming 5 hp, I would beware. I'll go as far as to say 3hp! Buyer beware! Mike Knapp #17
 
No series, my Mom is very ill. Wouldn't even be on here now, but waiting for a guy to pick up a sled.
 
Mike Knapp is 100% right. jtssrx, if you could get that kind of power out of a chip, then why can you not take the current R1, chip it, and get 200hp out of it? The R1 bike engine underwent serious changes and modifications for Yamaha to go from 160hp to the current 180hp. What you saying is they could have simply remapped the computer and WA-LA...20 more hp. Not going to happen. I am with Mike on this one, if they tell you 3hp gain, don't bet any money on a dyno pull.

We ran several F-150s and Mustangs head to head when I was in the automobile industry. Stock vs. chipped. The gains were minimal, and in the case of a few F150's with certain brand programmers, the stock trucks were faster than the programmed ones. The biggest gain we saw was with the mustangs but required premium gas, yet it was less than a car length.

Sorry to hear about your mom Mike, I hope she gets well soon!
 
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