xtx suspension settings

[**sj**]

trying to help others out who might be frustrated with the out of the box handling and ride of their xtx...
the information I have provided others has helped them

http://www.ty4stroke.com/viewtopic.php?p=730025#730025

although the info is somewhat skewed as my shocks have been revalved from zero miles...here goes..

observations..

the front shocks have too much spring and spring rate and the shock feels valved too stiff...the a arms should be much closer to level with the ground....lots of ski pressure ...I imagine darting and unpredictable..

the center shock/spring setting is somewhat too weak (weight of rider has tremendous impact here)
this causes the shock to blow through its stroke too soon and a heavy steering and I imagine a darting machine

too much compression and rebound...

solution (avg rider assumed)

loosen front shock springs ...with the front of the sled lifted....loosen til spring just about rattles loose...then slightly retighten...should be right around 3"...the problem is there is not enough to let out. as a low cost tuning option...pioneer performance offers a 2.3kg/mm vs the stockers 2.5kg/mm which should give more tuning range...

tighten the center shock spring a good amount...again this is very rider weight and ski choice dependant...even after revalving I tightened mine half again as much as stock! small changes will make a big difference...going too far will not allow the shock to stroke(ride on) and make the sled push in the corners and "high side"
for heavier riders or if someone wants to experiment..I believe pioneer offers a 3.0 vs a 2.5 kg shock spring here ?

I recommend after making some spring adjustments doing the following...

if you are unhappy with "sitting on" vs "sitting in" your suspension...you will like this....it goes against some other suggestions of setting ride height...but I like sitting in...and assuming you are around 200-210 try your torsion spring in the soft setting without compression....after a run over some terrain...add in a some compression ...you can always increase torsion and compression...but start here IMHO

also adjust your transfer to about 50% making sure they are adjusted evenly...I believe the transfer adjustment affects more than transfer....so the more transfer reduce the coupling affect but lightens the machine up...again..start here...add to taste after the rest of the adjustments...

I also recommend taking all the compression and rebound out of the front shocks and then adding to taste later......

lastly...I feel the skis to be totally inadequate for the amount of weight carried on them (not saying you cant do things to make them preform better...just not what the aftermarket skis do) I personally run simmons...and have for yrs...other good choices are doo pilots...c&a xtx's ...maybe powderhounds and powder pros... even the yam mountain skis... need a ski with more width IMHO

the way the sled feels from the factory to me is high and long...pushing and not using the suspension...with the changes I made it made the sled turn well and felt 50lbs and a foot shorter lol hope this helps some!

 

[bbrunick]

Thank you! Can't wait to give this a try!

 

[Mtnviper]

Thanks sj,

Although I ride the mountains, sometimes the trail getting there can be rough. I'm finding that I get the best results going the same direction you are.
Tightening up the center shock spring, and loosening the fronts up some.
I also had Pioneer re-valve my rear shocks, which helped out with the ride.
For the fellow off-trail/mountain riders out there. I found that pulling up the front limiter straps a couple holes, helps with deep snow performance. By reducing the track approach angle.

 

[**sj**]

maybe this should be stickied to help?

 

[XTX Kory]

SJ are you saying 3" of thread showing on front shocks? I am pretty happy with the handeling of my XTX but there is room for improvement.I am 6'04 225 and I too set the torsion springs in the low setting as that is where my sit in was, of course with a brand new sled it may loosen up some with some more miles. I am also runing Pilots with 6" triple points. My struggle so far has been a slight push and a totally unpedictible inside ski lift. I am not super familiar with the transfer rods and what the effect ( mine are stock setting) How will these effect the handling (Whuch way does what?) I appreciate any input you can give me. Thanks

 

[**sj**]

if you want more ski pressure / less transfer remove some of the transfer and slightly lessen the center spring....

Im fairly sure it was 3" from the jam nut to the top of the threads....but again loosening the front shock springs gives less ski pressure...but takes away the ski lift...

try this...take away transfer...and take 1/2 inch of center spring pressure away...ride it...then report back lol

 

[htlo1r]

This thing really works much much better now. I was going to sell it before I made these changes. Do what he said.... lift the sled up so the skis are hanging. Loosen the springs up till they rattle then tighten the jam nut... dial all clicker to soft both rebound and comp.... This WORKS. This sled rails now... We used the 5.7 pilots the wider 5.9s I thing would be even better.

 

[SledFreak]

This thing really works much much better now. I was going to sell it before I made these changes. Do what he said.... lift the sled up so the skis are hanging. Loosen the springs up till they rattle then tighten the jam nut... dial all clicker to soft both rebound and comp.... This WORKS. This sled rails now... We used the 5.7 pilots the wider 5.9s I thing would be even better.

Shim the bottom of the pilots with a 1/4" shim. Also, if you really want to solve the handling issues, change to the dual rate springs from high gear fro the front and center springs, then adjust shock valving from there...

 

[**sj**]

I keep telling you guys...(andy) you dont need double rate or triple rate springs...theres a softer one available cheaply done...if needed

 

[HeyBrownDog]

SJ:

Thanks for doing this....I originally suggested it in a different thread, and voting now for sticky on the subject. Seems like all kinds of information for the shorty nytro, but the XTX seems like uncharted territory for some of us. Can't wait to try these changes.

In addition, what's up with Pioneer's springs being almost a 1/3 of the cost of Hygear triple rates? Don't get me wrong Hygear stuff is definitely top notch, but the checkbook is a little light after Christmas.

 

[STAIN]

I'm not sure if softer springs are the answer. My expeirence is that at high speed corners the front end tends to "roll over" when the stock springs are at full soft--kind of like my RX1 did before I completly changed the front end. I have made some adjustment for this week and will report my findings. Also--who is running there ski stance at full width? Right now I am fighting some heavy low speed steering and roll over at high speed. No darting or ski lift to complain about.

 

[SledFreak]

I keep telling you guys...(andy) you dont need double rate or triple rate springs...theres a softer one available cheaply done...if needed

I keep telling you Steve.... You don't want a softer spring.... A softer spring is only going to make the sled roller over..... You need a stiffer spring for the fronts and center as well and have your valving control the rebound and compression to help keep the sled from rolling or high siding coming off the corner. Stiffning your stock centrer shock is only going to raise the sled in the center. Yes it will take the weight off the skis, but it will also make the sled roll or high side through the center of the corner more easily. It also allows for more push in the front end. Also, telling them to add more transfer only compounds the high siding especially when you want to get on the throttle coming off the Apex over the corner and now all your sled is going to do is push coming off the corner making the driver to get off the throttle. Reguardless, I know this sled needs to springs and valving to make it work. The stock componenets will not be enough. You can adjust it until the cows come home. It will help, but it's a bandaid... Theirs about 4 things that need to be done to this sled and 2 of them are out of most people's controls. The motor needs to pulled back and lowered into the chasiss to get the center of gravity down. The front geometry needs some fine tuning to help the sled stay better planted when rolling through the center better. It also needs new springs and valve calibration to help in both ride and handling to make this sled enter and exit through the corners without the sled high siding where the person is fighting for command of the ship... Once again the Yamaha shock calibration guy should be fired... It's pretty sad when the Canadian Yamaha product manager gets on a new RUSH and is pretty much blown away on the way it handles... Go read Chris Reids blog on his one line comment of the new RUSH when he switch rides with the Supertrax guys. He says flat out that, "Polaris just has that all figured out"... Maybe they should copy it...

 

[**sj**]

softer rate front spring ...stiffer center spring.......thats my call...and remove the compression you dont need for trail riding and add it in as needed...
we both agree the shock valving guy needs to be fired!

 

[sgilbert]

ok, I finally got the boys day out to do some trailside tuning and hard riding. have simmons skis on my xtx and alot of wheels. have had rear torsion springs on med., coupling rods to max lift and front shocks with 5 turns preload for 300 mi. steering a little heavy at low speed. rear susp a little soft at high speed. tried rear springs on high for first time. got on it a clamped it in usual fasion and almost lost it when it stood straight up. really confused how it changed. was happy to see it didn't seem to add ski pressure, but after 20mi rough ride, couldn't take how hard it road (like a shorty) and put back to medium. medium seems a bit soft even with compression clicker max., but set to high is way too hard. the bit soft I got used to sitting (in) the suspension, but did bottom few times at high speed. plan to turn coupling rods for 50% and see if that helps stiffen the last few inches of travel. at this time, the front springs are at 5 turns preload. any more I need power steering. less is easier, put sloppy handling. think maybe a stiffer sway bar like on my apex. was able to soften front with sacrificing handling. very happy with the xtx, but would say yamaha is full of it when they say it handles like a 121. after riding tight/rough stuff all day, arms are in rough shape

 

[htlo1r]

sgilbert... try these settings. I was going to sell my xtx because it was not what yamaha said it was.... Honestly, just try these settings you will be amazed at the changes. Mine handles like a lambo now, flat in the corners, very little ski lift, eats the bumps and stutters they just disappear under the sled. The faster I go in the bumped out turns the better it rides... it just sticks in the corners now. Steering is light with NO push in the corners, thats with 152 studs! Just try these settings.