Ruckus
TY 4 Stroke Master
dilligaf said:
I've always stated that Yamaha makes a great engine and they are excellent groomed trail machines. I've ridden one for 4 years and have spent thousands of dollars and hundreds of hours to make it into a slightly underpowered, acceptable handling, somewhat heavy snowmobile. I know where we ride here in western Newfoundland they have trouble. Off camber backcountry stuff in deep snow just doesn't bode well with this type of machine. My Phazer can kick the pants off any Nytro in the handling department (and I've ridden enough Nytros to know, my good friend managed the local dealership and always had demos) but my Phazer is downright scary to ride compared to any Cat or Poo, (I have no experience with Polaris) especially across the fall line. Besides skis, track (true of any brand, really) and suspension components that need upgrading, the single worst decision Yamaha made is the rear exiting exhaust. Looks cool, sounds cool, no doubt. Unfortunately you either have an ice factory going on back there, or no room for storage. Yes, I know, get a turnout and a heat shield, right? Throw some more weight at the problem. Anyways, the engine has to sit higher to allow the exhaust to exit, the fuel tank has to sit above the exhaust, further raising the center of gravity, and the fuel tank is small for the same reason. It just doesn't make sense on a snowmobile to have 3 feet hot exhaust pipe exposed to snow. For these reasons I had to move to another manufacturer. I still have the Phazer and will probably use it on the trails but it just doesn't cut it in the backcountry. I got out for roughly 45 day rides last winter (none of it on groomed trails) and I really experienced the limitations first hand. I love the 4 stroke motor but there's too many inherent design flaws to ever make it truly comparable to other brands. You true Blue guys can stick your heads in the sand (or snow) as much as you like. You can't argue with physics. If I had to drive 6 hours with my machine in a trailer to ride groomed trails for a weekend, I would definitely stick with Yamaha. Unfortunately, I like to ride hard in the open backcountry and need a machine that is lighter, has a lower COG, doesn't need a fuel can tied to the back and can operate in any plane of direction. Unfortunately the trade off is a smelly 2 stroke engine that won't last as long but still gets better fuel economy and burns oil at the same rate that I change it in the Phazer. I just don't see the advantage in my case. I apologize to anyone that is offended by this post. My intent is not to try to show Yamaha's "inferiority" to the other brands. I'm just tired of the die hards claiming they're all that and a bag of chips. I'm not some guy that rode one once and never set up the suspension. I rode the sh!t out of it and got to a point where it just isn't worth it any more. The only other machine I would be remotely interested in is the Nytro (I would love to have one actually) but I can't justify spending many more thousands of dollars and many more hours wrenching to make it something that it isn't. Sorry for the long winded post and again, apologies to the blue man group.
EDIT...And one more thing...The argument about 4 strokes in dirt bikes is moot. Comparing a 2 wheeled machine that relies on centrifugal force to stay upright to small tank with skis is like comparing a watercraft to an aircraft. Dirt bikes and snowmobiles are so completely different the only thing they share in common is the handlebars.
AKrider
TY 4 Stroke God
I remember reading about Yamaha's reasoning for the rear exit exhaust when the RX-1 came out and it made sense to me at the time. I didn't think much about it since motorcycles, ATV's and even automobiles have rear exit exhausts. But, now that we've got 4-strokes from all the other OEM's and they all run front exhaust, it really makes you wonder why Yamaha patented the design? The ice issue is no joke and makes a heavy sled even heavier.
Some of the last Yamaha sno-x sleds had the tank mounted on the back of the tunnel in an attempt to lessen the front heavy feel. Yamaha used to advertise the rear exist exhaust helped balance the sled. I wouldn't doubt it, the stock muffler on my Vector was heavy. Once I replaced it with a light weight White Knuckle exhaust and a Boss seat, the sled was not as well balanced and the front end felt heavier. Thinking about it, I generally noticed the unbalanced feel in spring conditions when the snow was not turning into ice under the tunnel.
I hope they've got a totally new chassis for their mod sled in USCC this season. Otherwise, I just don't see what more there is to learn about racing their present design? The race sled Nytros have had years of testing and development and I just don't see anywhere for them to go with it?
Some of the last Yamaha sno-x sleds had the tank mounted on the back of the tunnel in an attempt to lessen the front heavy feel. Yamaha used to advertise the rear exist exhaust helped balance the sled. I wouldn't doubt it, the stock muffler on my Vector was heavy. Once I replaced it with a light weight White Knuckle exhaust and a Boss seat, the sled was not as well balanced and the front end felt heavier. Thinking about it, I generally noticed the unbalanced feel in spring conditions when the snow was not turning into ice under the tunnel.
I hope they've got a totally new chassis for their mod sled in USCC this season. Otherwise, I just don't see what more there is to learn about racing their present design? The race sled Nytros have had years of testing and development and I just don't see anywhere for them to go with it?
