ADAPT clutching

[STAIN]

I am starting to try to dial in my clutching on my 20204 RIOT 9000
The factory clutching is out to lunch, RPM's are @400 RPM low
I installed a 240 SM tune and my RPM's went to @ 8750-8800 from @ 8600
I have already changed the primary spring from a 105/225 to an 85/225 to make engagement less harsh.
I also changed the stock helix from a 58-49 compound to a straight 48.
I am changing my weights today from 66 to 65 when I Iooked at my secondary and was surprised to see this

Is this belt slip OR is the straight 48 crushing the belt? It almost looks like belt smear. I am surprised a straight 48 would do that.
I did use a 2 stroke 48 degree helix, I dont think it makes a difference.
I wanted to use a 58-49.15 from the older ZR9000's but Cat discontinued it. I have seen that helix work well on a pair of 2020 T-cats with SM 240ss tunes. If that 49 finish didn't slip/smear I find it hard to believe the straight 48 would.
stock 155/220 secondary spring
I guess I need to reinstall the stock 58-49 and see what happens.

 

[See n blue]

Have you checked your alignment?

 

[STAIN]

I will when I reassemble it.
The procedure in the manual is a little vague.
There aren’t any shims behind the inner sheev. The only way to go with it would be outward.

 

[KnappAttack]

I'd be be putting the stock helix back in. If the stock is progressive, it would not be into the 49 portion of the helix anyway, probably more like a 53-51 degree portion of the helix. Not to mention you will always get some discoloration on the hotter engine side of the clutches too, but you are over pinching the secondary with a lesser angle like that I'm certain. Slow on top speed I bet too.

How many miles on machine? They will pickup RPM with miles. Don't be changing clutching till its well broken in.

 

[number1kyster]

PM Justinator. I think he has spent some time clutching these Riot’s.

 

[STAIN]

I'd be be putting the stock helix back in. If the stock is progressive, it would not be into the 49 portion of the helix anyway, probably more like a 53-51 degree portion of the helix. Not to mention you will always get some discoloration on the hotter engine side of the clutches too, but you are over pinching the secondary with a lesser angle like that I'm certain. Slow on top speed I bet too.

How many miles on machine? They will pickup RPM with miles. Don't be changing clutching till its well broken in.

I have @850 miles on the sled.

I agree it looks like it is over pinching the belt. What kind of confuses me is that I have had good success with a 58-49.15 helix in the past on this combo which is basically a straight 49. I thought the 48 would be pretty close. I guess I was wrong.

 

[STAIN]

I guess I should say good success with the 58-49.15 with a Team primary.
We did run a stock secondary on a 2020 T-Cat ,SM 240ss tune, with and Adapt and 66 gram weights and it seemed really close. Sled got traded shortly after......

 

[justinator]

If thats the cat belt it will never stop doing that. It will clean itself up some days on rock hard conditions and be back the next day. You can go ridiculously light on spring and steeper helixs etc and it wont go away, it actually got the best average appearance with 44 finish on helix. Sleds were bone stock and I had razorback gauge and stock 22-48 gear hard conditions. Belt temp never exceeded 140 that day and averaged around 125 and got home to clutches that looked like that. Switched to 829 ultimax and perfectly clean clutches every time. 827 works good too but for whatever reason the 829 felt better and was consistently quicker on the dragy

 

[justinator]

The alignment is adjusted with different size shims or multiple shims between the sheaves. Nothing goes behind the clutch on these like the tss04 or tied clutch. They usually come with a .090 shim, you can get .060,.030 and .015 from cat to go in if you need too but their method as crude as it is will get you were you need to be.

 

[STAIN]

I did check alignment and it seemed to be perfect.
I changed the weights to A/C 64’s, which actually weighed 65g.
I put the stock helix back in for the next two days.
The only reason I haven’t put the ultimate on yet is the fear of loss of RPM.
Is a torsion secondary more consistent?
I am at camp for two days and don’t have parts with me to test except an ultimax belt

 

[justinator]

On hardpack and good conditions their isnt much difference between compression and torsional. When conditions are loose and or softer out the torsional shows its advantages. Ill go through whatever stuff I have left and PM you. Pretty sure I still have a bunch of odds and ends for clutching and Ill make you a package deal irresistible bargain of a lifetime.

 

[STAIN]

Ha! Give a list on what you got
I put 140 miles On today with the ultimax belt 65 g weights ,stock helix stock secondary spring, 85-225 primary spring
Rpm are at 8850. Sometimes getting a bit of an overflash on rpm but not always. I can’t see the lower portion of the secondary but the top half seems clean and the primary is clean. It seemed to run well today, a little soft @30-40 but I am really nitpicking. Maybe a 53-49 would clean that up.
The cat belt really makes a mess I guess.
It still makes me wonder why that 48 would do what it did to the secondary. It is only 1 degree of the stock finish angle. Is it just that the stock belt is that bad?

 

[justinator]

It’s the belt it just discolors the sheaves pretty bad even though belt and clutch temperature is good. I had tried stock, the compound cut, Ron’s torsional kit and someone had given me a reverse helix that was a 48-54 or something like that and it never changed a thing on the appearance of the clutch faces. never continue trying to get to the root cause of it because the Ultimax worked so well