Huge increase in oil consumption & rod through case?

[ReX]

I always check it at the end of the ride as follows:

- ride up my driveway and press the garage door opener
- park the sled in the garage (flat concrete floor) and let it idle for 1 minute
- turn it off and pull the dipstick
- wipe it off and reinstall it (without screwing it in)
- check the level

I've found any other method seems to produce false lower levels. This method is extremely consistent.

 

[donbarb]

oil burning

Don't forget about the clutch kit you have now, steve, maybe you are puking oil when you are winding on the throttle, like I think you must. This might explain the oil in the filter area and so on. There is no way that unit should be using or burning oil at that rate already..

 

[LazyBastard]

???? is It possible the rings are lining up and the thing starts munching oil.....

It is not possible for the rings to line up unless the pin in the groove that keeps them from turning falls out. If that happens, you'll get cylinder damage way before the rings start spinning, and that cylinder damage will let a LOT more oil past than rings that are lined up. Ring end gap is very small and would cause barely more than negligible increase in oil consumption.

When oil consumption goes higher than normal, it is generally caused by stuck rings. This has been addressed with the new rings in 05 and the improved crankcase breather (which keeps less oil from going back through the intake to burn and stick the rings on the top) in 06. Regular use of seafoam/ringfree is proven to keep these engines in top condition, but on a really badly gummed up engine, the rate of carbon buildup could exceed the cleaning power of such things.

There are exceptional cases where abrasive damage is the root of the poor ring seal, but these are extremely rare.

 

[givemeaboost]

There are no pins in the ring grooves to keep the rings from spinning. That is only on two strokes to keep them in one position so they don't get lined up in the wrong place and catch on the ports, Ken.

 

[ReX]

Hey guys I've been searching the TY forums for almost an hour trying to find out how much Sea Foam people are running and the details on what they did to fix the oil consumption. I can't seem to find the answers.

The Sea Foam web site says (converted to ml):

- to pour 160-240 ml into the carbs while running, let sit 5 minutes and then start back up
- then pour 160-240 ml into the crankcase
- then pour 160-480 ml into the fuel tank (but doesn't say anything about the size of the fuel tank)

Personally I don't really like the idea of pouring it into the running engine and definitely don't like the idea of pouring it into the crankcase.

Most of the threads I've read say:
- put it in the gas and run it (how much?)
- one post says 2 oz per gallon (which would work out to 20 oz per tank or about 600 ml for a full tank.

One or two posts talk about pouring 1-2 fl oz into the spark plug holes and leave it overnight (rear of sled elevated).

I'm thinking of doing this:
- change the plugs to cheap CR9E's (keeping the CR10EK's for after treatment)
- pour a 478 ml can (1 pint/16 fl oz) into the gas tank and fill it will fuel.
- drive it normally

Any real world experience on what worked for you?

 

[ReX]

I just re-read the Sea Foam instructions and noticed at the bottom it states

"When Added to Fuel Tank:

-Cleans fuel injectors and carburetor jets
-Cleans carbon as you drive
-Lubricates upper cylinders
-De-ices and removes moisture
-Diesel full conditioner and anti gel
-Stabilizes fuel

One pint treats 8-25 gallons of fuel (average 1 ounce per gallon)."

One can per 10 gallon tank sounds like a reasonable dose.

I'd still like to hear some real word experiences...

LB, have you tried it in your sled?

 

[LazyBastard]

I had a little bit of oil consumption in year 2, so I treated it with seafoam. Hasn't burned a drop since.

 

[ReX]

How much? In the gas? Did you change the oil shortly afterwards?

 

[LazyBastard]

Gas and oil. I think I put half a can in the gas and half a can in the oil.

 

[nhrxrider]

When mine was burning 1 qt. in 100 miles last season, I tried Seafoam, but it didn't do any good. I tried it in the tank with no luck. Then I tried doing a compression test, letting seafoam soak in the cylinders, running it a while to clean it out, and did another compression test. The compression came up, but i think I was getting a false reading, most likely because some seafoam was still in the gunk around the rings. When the dealer did a leakdown test soon after, they got 25-35% across the cylinders. Upon teardown, the pistons and rings looked very gunked up.

Jim

 

[LazyBastard]

Yeah, but yours was really screwed up.

 

[Roadrunner]

One or two posts talk about pouring 1-2 fl oz into the spark plug holes and leave it overnight (rear of sled elevated).

Any real world experience on what worked for you?

I personally like to pour it in the plug holes, leave it set overnight, then put the rest in the tank, drive it 200 miles and change the oil.
If it doesn't stop burning oil after this, you've got a problem.

 

[ReX]

I was thinking of trying this, but have a few concerns/questions.

1. To get the seafoam to access the entire way around the rings you really need to raise the rear of the sled by about 30°. This is far enough that the fuel in the floatbowls might pour into the engine. With the gas tank up so high, it might refill the bowls and this might keep on going until the motor is hydro locked and the oil is full of gas.

2. The amount of seafoam that leaks past the rings will significant dillute the oil. I kow you're supposed to be able to pour it into the oil, but reading the MSDS it contains 50% "pale oil", 30% naptha, and 20% isopropyl alcohol (IPA). The naptha and IPA would breakdown the oil a fair bit I would think.

One option might be to keep the engine oil drain plug out overnight and let the sea foam and/or gas drain into a catch pan. I don't have any fuel shutoffs.

How much did you pour into each cylinder when you did it?

 

[nhrxrider]

I did just what you mentioned, at least as far as lifting the rear of the sled. I used a couple tablespoons of seafoam in each cylinder. After soaking, I cranked it over with the plugs out, then installed them and ran the sled long enough to warm up and clean out the cylinders. Then I shut it off and changed the oil and filter. Many people have had good luck with this method.

Jim

 

[Roadrunner]

1. To lift the sled 30 degrees requires the rear bumper to be about 5 feet in the air, if any fuel gets past the carb needle and seat it will pour into the air cleaner not the engine. If you're worried, disconnect the fuel lines at the fuel pump and plug them.

2. Don't worry about the seafoam that gets by the rings into the crankcase. 1 oz. is plenty, especially if you raised the back of the sled. Turn the primary back and forth occasionally to help the seafoam work into the ring grooves.