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I hate how all guys complain about yammy's being heavy..look

I agree that Yamaha has done an excellent job of shedding pounds. It is a great trail sled coupled with its reliability is hard to beat. The other 3 are not using their engine technology to gain back a weight advantage. Next year's REV is supposed to be 40 pounds lighter and the 600 engines will be at 130 HP since Snowcross is switching to 600 cc engines. The 600 engines will benefit from the racing usage just like the 600 cc bikes have progressed. Here is a little better look at the Maximum Sled weight challenge. Sure wish there was some snow to use any brand snowmobile.
 

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While Yamaha is doing a great job at shedding pounds it has come at the cost of some reliability (idler wheels, chaincase, 05 monoshock suspension, etc.). Before someone jumps down my throat saying "no chaincases fail" just remember that we pretty much never heard of anyone with a failed Yamaha chaincase back when they were aluminum.

Also, if you look at the chart and compare power/weight to power/weight (Apex/Attak = 700/800 cc competition; Vector/Rage = 600 cc competition; Phazer = 550 fan) you'll see there still is a significant gap between Yamaha 4-strokes to the 2-stroke competition.

Personally I'll take a clean, smooth running 4-stroke anyday over a stinky, vibrating, misfiring 2-stroke. It's like comparing a modern BMW to an old beat up, but souped up muscle car. The extra 50 or so lbs is well worth it to me. Sure the old muscle car can be fun, but if I want to put some real hours and miles on it I'd rather take the BMW.

I'll also happily ride a heavier snowmobile (heavier than they are currently) if that means improved reliability. Give me some heavy, durable idler wheels, a stiff headlight pod mount, a cool running aluminum chaincase and I can simply enjoy sledding every chance I get.
 
For you DOOTalk members; here is a little amo http://www.snowest.com/fusetalk/message ... erthread=y to use for rebutal to this comment by Harrison
Engine longevity might be a slight advantage now but as the 2-stroke electronic controls continue to advance, I think that advantage is virtually null.
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If Doo can't make cranks last for more then 100-300 miles in their new Mono Block 800 without failure. How can they even focus on 2-stroke electronic controls to improve longevity? There's also several threads about clutch failures, running boards bending from rider weight, bent bulkeads etc all on the latest/greatest BRP Summit 800. I think with issues like these; I'll stick to my '03 Tank and LMAO as I'm riding past the broken down lightweight, technological marvels those guys rave so much about.

Jim
 
Hmmm

Now don't forget about the 03 rx-1's that went up in a ball of flames in their first year. Every new chassis/motor will have some kind of issues. Case in point....How many wheels have gone bad in the 06 apexs? how many plugs fouled in the 05 machs? How many firecats had that cooling issue? All manufactures have their issues from time to time. Remember that
 
RX-Eskimo said:
I second that...Anything that tends to breakdown up here is left at the stores...Lots of old doos that have engine problems, so no one bought those models. We are starting to get more 4S models up here even though they are heavier, but engine reliability is awesome...Still no issues with my old 03 RX-1ton...5th year coming...

RX-E
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I'll agree with RX-Eskimo, riding too far out into nowhere (home to me) you do not want to risk breaking down. Walking around in the arctic in desember or january is not too much fun with the polar night all around the clock. My 2003 RX-1 is not a light sled but it has never ever let me down. It's in its second season as a turboed sled, no problems so far. I'll wote for reliability.

BTW how's it going Eskimo? Is the sea frozen? Any hunting....I'll guess not, you barely have any daylight yet.
 
Re: Hmmm

CrazyBill said:
Now don't forget about the 03 rx-1's that went up in a ball of flames in their first year. Every new chassis/motor will have some kind of issues. Case in point....How many wheels have gone bad in the 06 apexs? how many plugs fouled in the 05 machs? How many firecats had that cooling issue? All manufactures have their issues from time to time. Remember that
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???
 
Re: Hmmm

rxrider said:
CrazyBill said:
Now don't forget about the 03 rx-1's that went up in a ball of flames in their first year. Every new chassis/motor will have some kind of issues. Case in point....How many wheels have gone bad in the 06 apexs? how many plugs fouled in the 05 machs? How many firecats had that cooling issue? All manufactures have their issues from time to time. Remember that
Click to expand...

???
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I have heard of only one RX-1 that caught fire. The other thing you listed are just minor inconviniences which can be fixed rather quickly with minimal down time (if any). Having you entire engine freighted to BRP's plant; then wait for them to look at it and send a new motor because of a design flaw in the casting of the block caused your new sled to seize a crank shaft bearing would sidline a rider for alot longer.

Jim
 
I'll get you pictures of 3 different rx-1s that i personally witnessed go up in shame. i mean flames. may take me a few days. It is nice to see that this site is just as biased as dootalk
 
Back to the original topic of this thread..... A 2 stroke and a 4 stroke of equal HP, that is what we should compare right, the 2 stroke will be considerably heavier every time. So compare apples to apples and not apples to lead blocks
 
What comparable 150 hp 2 stroke sled is heavier than an apex? Name a 600 short tracker heavier than a vector or nitro.
 
I got an 03 RX-1 that will pretty much kick the s^*t out of any stock 2 joker and I've had no flaming issues to date






:die ==========================================




:yam: :4STroke: :moon:
 
An rx-1 that'll kick the s#$$ out of any 2 stroke? Buddy, better turn the boost off! It's putting scary thoughts in ur head.
 
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