lost rpm

[max rolph]

how would you knpow if rpm info is wrong? and i will try deactivating closed loop

 

[max rolph]

this is baffling me... just waiting for new 3 bar or 4 bar map sensor to try, TD is sending, have disconected GAP closed loop also am going to try today. have even switched clutchs to stock and same .. nothing over 8800 just a spike on take off hard , with any tune. clutchs are perfect, NO leaks anywhere even with 40psi in whole system, dash shows 20psi boost, afr 11.9-12.1 WOT, correction factor on closed loop was only 3%. intake temp cool, water temp at 165 ... only has ever gotten to 174 on trail. always starts first crank when cold... only takes alot more cranks when hot or shut off after a long blast. did have one hiccup... when slamed on brake in corner sled almost stalled, n barked a bit when i was at 1/4 tank.
#*$&@ this frustrating... im hoping KNAPP was right that the MAP sensor could cause this. sled runs perfect other that cant rev over 8600.

 

[tsiceman]

Could it be bad bearings causing drag. Can you turn secondary with belt off.
I would assume belt would be smoking hot if this was the case

 

[Sledroll]

this is baffling me... just waiting for new 3 bar or 4 bar map sensor to try, TD is sending, have disconected GAP closed loop also am going to try today. have even switched clutchs to stock and same .. nothing over 8800 just a spike on take off hard , with any tune. clutchs are perfect, NO leaks anywhere even with 40psi in whole system, dash shows 20psi boost, afr 11.9-12.1 WOT, correction factor on closed loop was only 3%. intake temp cool, water temp at 165 ... only has ever gotten to 174 on trail. always starts first crank when cold... only takes alot more cranks when hot or shut off after a long blast. did have one hiccup... when slamed on brake in corner sled almost stalled, n barked a bit when i was at 1/4 tank.
#*$&@ this frustrating... im hoping KNAPP was right that the MAP sensor could cause this. sled runs perfect other that cant rev over 8600.

Rolph I used to be based in HS valley , and know those trails . But before I owned a Sidewinder .
Maybe it is for your own protection that you can't rev higher !
Although the first 8600 will easily put you in the trees , and the last 3-400 is just deeper in the trees ! If not careful !
I am sure you will figure it out with all the help available on this site .

 

[max rolph]

Rolph I used to be based in HS valley , and know those trails . But before I owned a Sidewinder .
Maybe it is for your own protection that you can't rev higher !
Although the first 8600 will easily put you in the trees , and the last 3-400 is just deeper in the trees ! If not careful !
I am sure you will figure it out with all the help available on this site .

LMAO... i rarely ride here let alone ontario... we all go to Quebec every week or two, i put 7000miles on last year there and cant get enough of trails that are marked perfect with no un expexted corners.

 

[max rolph]

Could it be bad bearings causing drag. Can you turn secondary with belt off.
I would assume belt would be smoking hot if this was the case

track spins smooth and free.. now its a little harder as its tighter and i just studded.... so a little more drag. drive bearings wont effect engine rpm thou... might effect speed.

 

[1nc 2000]

track spins smooth and free.. now its a little harder as its tighter and i just studded.... so a little more drag. drive bearings wont effect engine rpm thou... might effect speed.

Belt slipping and pulling rpm's down after you studded track. Add more tip weight.

 

[max rolph]

Belt slipping and pulling rpm's down after you studded track. Add more tip weight.

it was doing same before i studded... even on roll on will not pull rpm

 

[max rolph]

sooo heres the latest.... changed belt to cat 112 and pressurized WHOLE intake system from turbo through.. as i stated before... pressurized up to 40 psi found a squeel at one of the tubes connected to aftermarket intercooler... tightened all clamps soo it held 40 psi cold. also got a 46/34 helix overnight from Dalton and put spring in 4th hole as Ben at TD wants it. had clickers on #6... took out at 7am this morning at -18c, fresh 4" of powder on hard groomed set in trail.... out of hole went to 9700!! and boost spooled instantly to 20.3 psi.... let off and did roll on and hit it...went to 9300 till got traction then dropped to 8800 and climbed over 9000. boost kept rising to 23psi.... came home and put clickers back to #4 and added a set screw to each arm(10.4grms tot) went out for long ride spooled out of hole to over 9200 on trail then dropped to 8700 and pulled up to 89-9000.... but boost kept climbing up to 25psi didnt matter where i hit it the boost would shoot up to 23-25psi and id let off just in case. i definately need a@ 50/36 or at least a 48/34 helix. on my data logger the revs an boost go way up out of hole long before track speed... so im assuming there was belt slip out of hole on primary as sec is at 4th hole. but when doing 70 mph at 6500 rpm and hit it track and bost and rpm shoot up instantly.

 

[fatchance]

track spins smooth and free.. now its a little harder as its tighter and i just studded.... so a little more drag. drive bearings wont effect engine rpm thou... might effect speed.

 

[STAIN]

sooo heres the latest.... changed belt to cat 112 and pressurized WHOLE intake system from turbo through.. as i stated before... pressurized up to 40 psi found a squeel at one of the tubes connected to aftermarket intercooler... tightened all clamps soo it held 40 psi cold. also got a 46/34 helix overnight from Dalton and put spring in 4th hole as Ben at TD wants it. had clickers on #6... took out at 7am this morning at -18c, fresh 4" of powder on hard groomed set in trail.... out of hole went to 9700!! and boost spooled instantly to 20.3 psi.... let off and did roll on and hit it...went to 9300 till got traction then dropped to 8800 and climbed over 9000. boost kept rising to 23psi.... came home and put clickers back to #4 and added a set screw to each arm(10.4grms tot) went out for long ride spooled out of hole to over 9200 on trail then dropped to 8700 and pulled up to 89-9000.... but boost kept climbing up to 25psi didnt matter where i hit it the boost would shoot up to 23-25psi and id let off just in case. i definately need a@ 50/36 or at least a 48/34 helix. on my data logger the revs an boost go way up out of hole long before track speed... so im assuming there was belt slip out of hole on primary as sec is at 4th hole. but when doing 70 mph at 6500 rpm and hit it track and bost and rpm shoot up instantly.

So are you attributing it to the belt or secondary spring pressure?

 

[max rolph]

So are you attributing it to the belt or secondary spring pressure?

UGH... good question, i had already done the spring up to 4 before and soo did TD when i was there on tuesday,and they did Wast Gate upgrade, when i got back tuesday night i did a pressure test as they didnt have time when i had to leave due to curfue and drive 5 hours back. the pressure test showed i had a leek at the intercooler hose, soo i fixed that and i changed belt to cat belt... the 2' diff in helix wouldnt have done anything and i coppied angles onto paper and they were only 2'off from one another even thou there have been reports of STM being 8' off from Daltons. other than that... i do not know.... my boost now is through roof instantly... soo i dont know if they had to set wastegate up to what i was getting as boost with the leek... or something else is causing boost... MAP sensor?? im trying a brand new XS827 belt today to see if thats where change came from then ill put old one back on and see if i loose rpm.... ust soo i can have piece of mind as to what changed it.

 

[KnappAttack]

So boost is out of control in the cold air it sounds like I'm hearing you say? I'm not sure the ECU can control the boost in this cold no mater the brand or level of tune. What is your tune supposed to run, got a target boost range? I thought you said 20-22 lbs.

Glad you have the RPM back, but what is with the out of control boost on these machines in the cold? Its yet another problem all together and for the unsuspecting it's an engine failure or head gasket failure waiting to happen if not right on top of the current boost and A/F ratio. Without logging and A/F module it's a real risk, unless one can watch the boost and A/F gauge the operator is left clueless as to what is really happening for the average Joe. He just thinks his machine is really fast in the cold weather, and it is, but not knowing the boost is thru the roof and its lean if out of injectors.

I don't know the exact specifics on how the ECU is supposed to control the boost, but to me it's clear to see it can't do it consistently from warm to cold within a specified range as much as I hate to say it.

This weekend running between -8F and -2F I had my 240 tune running a bit more boost than the 270 normally would!!! I attributed it to the 3" muffler I'm now running vs. the 2.5" trail muffler I went away from, but seeing my PM box lots of guys having overboost and lean A/F in this cold weather, so its not just me.

I spoke to a friend that is a dealer for another tune brand, and they had a 250 tune take out a center cylinder this week. I asked him if he was certain it was a 250 tune and not a 280, but he said it was a 250 tune. I couldn't hardly believe that one. So its very important to keep an eye on the boost and A/F levels. On another PM a fella had a head gasket let go.

Octane booster, boost and A/F gauge is your friend still even on these machines that the ECU is supposed to control the boost levels.

I know we are all in different figurations that the tunes were designed for, we all have different mufflers and all kinds of different bolt on goods on our machines in an effort to beat the neighbor, so the tuners have a hard time trying to nail down how it all works together in the different scenarios we are running in. It is really up to the operator to have a basic knowledge of how it's all gonna work together and keep his own machine safe from the damage that we can inflict upon them...

 

[Turboflash]

Being in MN subject to same below zero this weekend, running with 3Tcats on Stage 3 and 1 Sidewinder Max17, all over-boosting to 20-22 lbs. No datalogging but all survived by seriously limiting time at WFO with boost too high. All running 93 octane non-oxy gas fortunately.
The 3 TCats are PEFI Stage 3. PEFI told them stock fuel pump and injectors are maxed out at -10F which is close to where temp was.
I agree with KA. ECU seems to not be able to control boost in super cold temps. Why?

 

[0degC]

sooo heres the latest.... changed belt to cat 112 and pressurized WHOLE intake system from turbo through.. as i stated before... pressurized up to 40 psi found a squeel at one of the tubes connected to aftermarket intercooler... tightened all clamps soo it held 40 psi cold. also got a 46/34 helix overnight from Dalton and put spring in 4th hole as Ben at TD wants it. had clickers on #6... took out at 7am this morning at -18c, fresh 4" of powder on hard groomed set in trail.... out of hole went to 9700!! and boost spooled instantly to 20.3 psi.... let off and did roll on and hit it...went to 9300 till got traction then dropped to 8800 and climbed over 9000. boost kept rising to 23psi.... came home and put clickers back to #4 and added a set screw to each arm(10.4grms tot) went out for long ride spooled out of hole to over 9200 on trail then dropped to 8700 and pulled up to 89-9000.... but boost kept climbing up to 25psi didnt matter where i hit it the boost would shoot up to 23-25psi and id let off just in case. i definately need a@ 50/36 or at least a 48/34 helix. on my data logger the revs an boost go way up out of hole long before track speed... so im assuming there was belt slip out of hole on primary as sec is at 4th hole. but when doing 70 mph at 6500 rpm and hit it track and bost and rpm shoot up instantly.

What tune ar

UGH... good question, i had already done the spring up to 4 before and soo did TD when i was there on tuesday,and they did Wast Gate upgrade, when i got back tuesday night i did a pressure test as they didnt have time when i had to leave due to curfue and drive 5 hours back. the pressure test showed i had a leek at the intercooler hose, soo i fixed that and i changed belt to cat belt... the 2' diff in helix wouldnt have done anything and i coppied angles onto paper and they were only 2'off from one another even thou there have been reports of STM being 8' off from Daltons. other than that... i do not know.... my boost now is through roof instantly... soo i dont know if they had to set wastegate up to what i was getting as boost with the leek... or something else is causing boost... MAP sensor?? im trying a brand new XS827 belt today to see if thats where change came from then ill put old one back on and see if i loose rpm.... ust soo i can have piece of mind as to what changed it.

What tune are you running with the upgraded waistgate/4 port solenoid? If the 20lb tune and you have the boost increase “enabled” more boost will ramp in depending on how you have adjusted in the new flasher firmware.