Nytro darting issue fix!!

[yooper1]

Okay guy's here the deal on my RTX mods that have been done.
I will try to outline it as best I can for our "darting" issues..

1) I had a friend machine my upper ball joints 2.5 mills, or .100. This was a quick fix issue that worked well as far as I can see.

2) I put on MTX ski's and turned the rubber around, then added a 1/4 inch wedge that look like a angle. This was made out of plastic and is about 1" long and goes from 1/4 to 0"
(hopefully you get the picture) and is as wide as the rubber piece on the bottom. Drilled and counter sunk a wood screw to hold it in place.

3) Next I checked the ski toe-in. This was WAY OFF! So I used a 8' piece of box tubing to have the track sq. and took the measurement of the SQ. track to the passenger side ski. Once this was right, I took off both tie-rods and made sure the handle bars were straight and then but masking tap on the the back and front of the ski's. Made sure to find the center and aliened the ski's. Once it was within 1/8" of toe-out I then adjusted the tie-rods so they could be put back together while checking the alignment along the way. I FEEL THIS WAS ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUE TO THE DARTING FIX!

End result, the darting is gone. Before going down a groomed trail or road, once your going 60mph or so and you let go of the throttle the sled would be all over the place. A real handful.. As of today I have rode both trail and the roads with no issues.

If you follow these steps I feel you can end this darting issue and enjoy your sled as intended.

If anyone has any questions, please pm me and I'll call you and give you any information I have that fixed this issue.

Last, Yamaha, Shame on you! You know there's a problem and have done nothing to help your customers fix this. To buy a $10,000.00 sled and dread riding is a shame. My dealer bent over backwards to try to fix this, but is unaware as to how..

Ike, thanks for your input on this!


Best of luck!
Mike (Yooper1)

 

[Ike]

Great news!

Ike

 

[SledderSteve]

Okay guy's here the deal on my RTX mods that have been done.
I will try to outline it as best I can for our "darting" issues..

1) I had a friend machine my upper ball joints 2.5 mills, or .100. This was a quick fix issue that worked well as far as I can see.

2) I put on MTX ski's and turned the rubber around, then added a 1/4 inch wedge that look like a angle. This was made out of plastic and is about 1" long and goes from 1/4 to 0"
(hopefully you get the picture) and is as wide as the rubber piece on the bottom. Drilled and counter sunk a wood screw to hold it in place.

3) Next I checked the ski toe-in. This was WAY OFF! So I used a 8' piece of box tubing to have the track sq. and took the measurement of the SQ. track to the passenger side ski. Once this was right, I took off both tie-rods and made sure the handle bars were straight and then but masking tap on the the back and front of the ski's. Made sure to find the center and aliened the ski's. Once it was within 1/8" of toe-out I then adjusted the tie-rods so they could be put back together while checking the alignment along the way. I FEEL THIS WAS ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUE TO THE DARTING FIX!

End result, the darting is gone. Before going down a groomed trail or road, once your going 60mph or so and you let go of the throttle the sled would be all over the place. A real handful.. As of today I have rode both trail and the roads with no issues.

If you follow these steps I feel you can end this darting issue and enjoy your sled as intended.

If anyone has any questions, please pm me and I'll call you and give you any information I have that fixed this issue.

Last, Yamaha, Shame on you! You know there's a problem and have done nothing to help your customers fix this. To buy a $10,000.00 sled and dread riding is a shame. My dealer bent over backwards to try to fix this, but is unaware as to how..

Ike, thanks for your input on this!


Best of luck!
Mike (Yooper1)

I'll preface this by saying I have witnessed and agree with most everything written here.

Now let's give credit or discredit as the case may be where it's due.

You list the ski toe-in as way off and felt it to be the biggest issue with the darting. I've seen this one and would have to agree but I also have to stop short of saying shame on Yamaha. The dealer who bent over backwards to fix the issue has the responsibility to set up your sled according to the instructions provided by Yamaha. 'Nuff said.

Regarding the ski rubber and shim fix, Mr. Sled and I had the opportunity discuss and compare this to the factory stock setup on the trails with some high placed individuals from Yamaha proper. While it was acknowledged that the reverse rubber and shim trick did address the 'darting' issue in groomed trail conditions, it will cause some less than desirable characteristics in other conditions. We only had groomed trails to ride that day so we took their word for it. (These guys really know their stuff!)

Bottom line, validate your stock settings and work from there. The ski rubber and shim trick will additionally help in groomed trail conditions but know that it may cause some less than desirable characteristics in other conditions.

The other thing we got from the meeting is that the factory guys do in fact read this forum and they do in fact care. The problem is that a LOT of what's written here or any internet forum for that matter is simply noise that must be filtered to get to the facts.

Otherwise:

 

[yooper1]

Sledder Steve,
Very good points and call outs!
The Ski's were way off, this may be any ones fault, or a result from having
the ball joints machined??? I don't know, heck that's why I am reading everything
here and trying to post what I am finding..

I apologize if by saying Shame on Yamaha, I don't fell there product is junk, however there
seems to be some issue with a lot of people and there new Nytro.
When I wrote this post, it was after about 4 hours of working on this.. I tired, very frustrated and I think it may have come across that was in my last comments. Steve once again thank you for the call out as you are one of the moderators, however you said these gentlemen at Yamaha "factory guys do in fact read this forum and they do in fact care"
I agree, never stated they didn't..

So not to prolong this or think that I am trying to defend myself I was trying to pass a long the facts as to what I found and some emotion/passion came across.

Thanks!
Michaelm

 

[SledderSteve]

It's all good yooper1, please keep posting

I jumped in on your post as it clearly illustrates the frustration many users, including Mr. Sled himself, have been having with their Nytros. While we'd like to think the factory guys just wanted to stop by and be sociable because we're nice guys, it was to discuss the very things listed in your post. Thanks for being my straight man, I apologize for not asking first.

Back on topic, while the factory doesn't "Explicitly" approve, I believe many people, (UP, WI, etc.) will enjoy their sleds a whole lot more if they follow the steps you have listed.

Thanks again for posting

 

[MotoPsycho]

The Ski's were way off, this may be any ones fault, or a result from having the ball joints machined???

ANY changes effectuated to either caster, camber, or both, will indeed change toe settings. You changed the camber to a more negative angle, (if I understand your mod description correctly) which would cause more toe out.

BTW, my sled had 2" of toe-out from the dealer.

 

[BOZZMAN]

I machined my upper ball joints the 2.5 mm and can tell you guys that have it done you will have to reset your toe . My sled is now toed in with the machined ball joints and I know it wasnt before because I adjusted the toe when I brought the sled home from the dealer. I live in southeast Michigan and I know that when a dealer sets up a sled that they are suppose to check ski alignment but most of the dealers around my area put them together make sure they start and send them out the door . I always check my ski alignment when I buy a new sled . With that being said I have tried several adjustments to the alignment of my RTX to get it to handle better including shimming the skis . I am also running Pilot skis . I think I have come along way but it still darts around too much . I will try the modded ball joints next weekend and see what happens . I still love this sled and it puts a big smile on my face when I ride it but if I can eliminate the darting and get this sled to track better that would be great.

 

[Topgun]

Okay guy's here the deal on my RTX mods that have been done.
I will try to outline it as best I can for our "darting" issues..

1) I had a friend machine my upper ball joints 2.5 mills, or .100. This was a quick fix issue that worked well as far as I can see.

2) I put on MTX ski's and turned the rubber around, then added a 1/4 inch wedge that look like a angle. This was made out of plastic and is about 1" long and goes from 1/4 to 0"
(hopefully you get the picture) and is as wide as the rubber piece on the bottom. Drilled and counter sunk a wood screw to hold it in place.

3) Next I checked the ski toe-in. This was WAY OFF! So I used a 8' piece of box tubing to have the track sq. and took the measurement of the SQ. track to the passenger side ski. Once this was right, I took off both tie-rods and made sure the handle bars were straight and then but masking tap on the the back and front of the ski's. Made sure to find the center and aliened the ski's. Once it was within 1/8" of toe-out I then adjusted the tie-rods so they could be put back together while checking the alignment along the way. I FEEL THIS WAS ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUE TO THE DARTING FIX!

End result, the darting is gone. Before going down a groomed trail or road, once your going 60mph or so and you let go of the throttle the sled would be all over the place. A real handful.. As of today I have rode both trail and the roads with no issues.

If you follow these steps I feel you can end this darting issue and enjoy your sled as intended.

If anyone has any questions, please pm me and I'll call you and give you any information I have that fixed this issue.

Last, Yamaha, Shame on you! You know there's a problem and have done nothing to help your customers fix this. To buy a $10,000.00 sled and dread riding is a shame. My dealer bent over backwards to try to fix this, but is unaware as to how..

Ike, thanks for your input on this!


Best of luck!
Mike (Yooper1)

When you say you machined the ball joint, in what way so you machine it???

 

[yooper1]

Where the ball joint "rests" in the a-arm you cut it down 2.5mills or .095 to .100. (it's making the bolt part longer)
This will move the spindle in that amount aiding in the way your sled and ski's are on the snow. Much like your car/truck to track down the road.

The one big improvement I can really feel is the weight transfer when you hit the throttle.
It really feels like the front suspension is working well with these mods.
There is a picture on the other posts about this issue, but I could not fine it to link it for you.
Hope this helps.