nhrxrider
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
How much does an engineer have to be paid before he knows the words "center of gravity"? With a taller seat and taller bars, rider weight will be higher. Revs are tippy in the corners because of the higher CG. They work well in deep moguls, but I have never, ever been passed by one on a twisty, groomed trail. Handling definately goes to the '03-'05 RXs.
As some of you who have posted said, I also bought my sled for comfort. I know, not everyone bought for the same reason, but many of us did. I feel enough that a share of the market should be devoted to a high-mile trail performance sled thats built with comfort in mind. The first weekend I owned my sled we did 3 days of 250-300 miles each. I felt absolutely no pain, even at 6'4". The suspension sucked, but I was still comfortable. The first time I tried a Rev, I made it about a mile and a half before I began cramping between my shoulder blades at the base of my neck. I had to ask for my sled back because I couldn't ride much further. I also kept getting the feeling that I was going to fall over the bars. I know thats just a feeling and has no basis to it, but it was still there, and I didn't like it. Along with that, my legs hit the plastic, so it was very uncomfortable for those as well.
The low windshield bothers me as well. At 6'4" I already have to deal with more wind than most. Combine an even lower windshield with a taller seat and bars, and I might as well be riding on the hood for all the protection I'm going to get!
If Yamaha wants to get into the boy racer market along with the Revs and Firecats (both of which I have ridden and didn't like), fine. But at least leave a comfortable trail model in there!
To me, when someone mentions "rider forward", it just means my legs won't fit, I'll have less wind protection, and the sled will be more tippy.
Jim
As some of you who have posted said, I also bought my sled for comfort. I know, not everyone bought for the same reason, but many of us did. I feel enough that a share of the market should be devoted to a high-mile trail performance sled thats built with comfort in mind. The first weekend I owned my sled we did 3 days of 250-300 miles each. I felt absolutely no pain, even at 6'4". The suspension sucked, but I was still comfortable. The first time I tried a Rev, I made it about a mile and a half before I began cramping between my shoulder blades at the base of my neck. I had to ask for my sled back because I couldn't ride much further. I also kept getting the feeling that I was going to fall over the bars. I know thats just a feeling and has no basis to it, but it was still there, and I didn't like it. Along with that, my legs hit the plastic, so it was very uncomfortable for those as well.
The low windshield bothers me as well. At 6'4" I already have to deal with more wind than most. Combine an even lower windshield with a taller seat and bars, and I might as well be riding on the hood for all the protection I'm going to get!
If Yamaha wants to get into the boy racer market along with the Revs and Firecats (both of which I have ridden and didn't like), fine. But at least leave a comfortable trail model in there!
To me, when someone mentions "rider forward", it just means my legs won't fit, I'll have less wind protection, and the sled will be more tippy.
Jim
QCRider
TY 4 Stroke Master
Jim, you nailed it.
QC I will let you know how they sit and wind protection are on them today . I want to know if the handlebars will hit if you put a taller windsheild on it. I really agree with you , but I have a feeling that they have addressed the cruiser sled owners too. Ibeing a polaris convert for the last 3 yrs. think the 4 stroke is the only way to go. I'm going to the show guys. Taking the camera and take pictures of this machine. And yes I'm old and don't need any aftermarket body parts.
sledheadgeorge said:
I have, both on my REV 600 and my 05 RX1. "Rider forward", or at least Yamaha's version is better than my 05, whether you're young or old.
Re: Rider forward is the way to go!
You're both right and wrong. The product has to stand on its own merits, and the REV has done that. Accept that.
sledheadgeorge said:Rollingwiththepflow said:
Seating position does not sell sleds.
Marketing does
You're both right and wrong. The product has to stand on its own merits, and the REV has done that. Accept that.
QCRider said:
Ever the cynic......I think Yamaha has too many models next year because they bent over backwards trying to accomodate guys like you. I think the 06, on paper will handle better, including flatter. The Vector front end counters any slight increase in rider height. The rider is closer to the center of the sled, and a sled that often landed on its #*$&@ off jumps will now fly straighter because the rider is more forward. Windshields are always changeable, non issue for me. As far as stretching out, on a REV you can not stretch out. On this new Yamaha, it's obvious you can still stretch out. What many of you still don't understand from a comfort standpoint, is it's simply better to have your hips higher than your knees, not level, or knees about the hips. The new seating position is a huge improvement and closely resembles a Fusion riding position. I've ridden the Fusion, and while I think it's a vibrating pile, the riding position is superior to a REV or my 05 RX1.
race24x
TY 4 Stroke Master
I will hold my opinion till I actually ride one
I sat on the appex and attack, I'm 6'3" and there is no problem for legs. Only problem is the lack of adjustability of the handldebars, wich forces me to sit square; if I want to sit further back on the seat, where there is plenty of space, my arms are streched and hi, wich is not confortable. With adjustable handlebars, it would be a winner.
nhrxrider
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Everybody is saying how comfortable these sleds will be for a long ride, but nobody has ridden one yet!!! I thought the Rev was comfortable when I sat on one in the showroom, and almost bought one. After trying one on the trail, I couldn't stand it! I just don't like the lean-forward position. I ride sportbikes and I can say, I would happily ride one around town, but when I want to do a 1000+ mile day, I'm happy to have my ST1100. I don't want to ride like a racer all day, I want the lay-z-boy position where I can lean back, stretch my legs, and enjoy a long ride. I never had any problems doing 300+ mile days on my RX, so what am I supposed to be upgrading to? Don't fix what ain't broken! And so far nobody has been able to counter the higher center of gravity. Right now I love to carve high speed corners. We all worked hard to get our RX's to corner flatter...now they went and raised the CG several inches higher! Cool for a snowcross track where you'll be standing, which effectively lowers the CG of the sled itself, but when sitting its going to be tippy like the Rev junks. My buddy already regrets hos 600SDI purchase, and takes his 700 2-up when he wants to run a fast, twisty trail. Come on, having to ride a 2-up to get better cornering??? He did say that when the trails are rough he loves the REV, but around here that doesn't happen very often.
Jim
Jim
race24x
TY 4 Stroke Master
Hey NH I havent had enough time on a rev to feel comfortable but I did try the Mach Z and thought that was nice and it handled good too. I hope that is about the same riding position the new ones are. Hard to say about the COG and I do understand cause I race a stock car. But alot of it is giving up one to get another. I really think they should have kept the RX 1 chassis for a couple of years with the new suspension upgrades but it aint gonna happen and they arent going to bring it back for me either LOL damn them. I will wait and see if I like it and then make my decesion but the guys on the board from New england might not let me get one. I bought my last one and we havent had a decent winter since. 
tshelver
Pro
There's always such a thing as moving your body in the corners to change the weight distribution...
I do it on my bikes, and I do it on my sleds when running hard. Gets a little old if you're riding 300 miles of twisties at 95%, but how often does that happen? More often where I ride you get miles and miles of bumps, especially late in the afternoon.
Even the ridng the vaunted Quebec trails , so far this year I would really have liked a sled that was easier to stand up on and with more centered riding position.
I've ridden my Kawaaki Concours 1200 miles / 19 hours, and that has a much more aggressive riding position than the Apex, if you look at photos of riders sitting on the machine. I've done 11 hour days on my ZX12R with only the addition of a 2" bar riser: felt very tight and aggressive when I first got it, but guess what: the old (I'm 50) body ends up adapting just fine.
After riding the Rev, I realized just how cruiserish most sleds are. P-u-l-l yourself up to stand up for holes and bumps, and again to lean off on either side. I'd guess that the new position will be far less strenuous to lean off a little more to counter the center of gravity thing.
At least, that's what I found with the Rev.
Just wish I'd waited 2 more years before buying the Warrior, I never realized Yamaha would be changing the riding position so soon...
I do it on my bikes, and I do it on my sleds when running hard. Gets a little old if you're riding 300 miles of twisties at 95%, but how often does that happen? More often where I ride you get miles and miles of bumps, especially late in the afternoon.
Even the ridng the vaunted Quebec trails , so far this year I would really have liked a sled that was easier to stand up on and with more centered riding position.
I've ridden my Kawaaki Concours 1200 miles / 19 hours, and that has a much more aggressive riding position than the Apex, if you look at photos of riders sitting on the machine. I've done 11 hour days on my ZX12R with only the addition of a 2" bar riser: felt very tight and aggressive when I first got it, but guess what: the old (I'm 50) body ends up adapting just fine.
After riding the Rev, I realized just how cruiserish most sleds are. P-u-l-l yourself up to stand up for holes and bumps, and again to lean off on either side. I'd guess that the new position will be far less strenuous to lean off a little more to counter the center of gravity thing.
At least, that's what I found with the Rev.
Just wish I'd waited 2 more years before buying the Warrior, I never realized Yamaha would be changing the riding position so soon...
Qc just got back from the show . I dont think the trail cruisers will have a problem sitting on this appex sled . I had good room and felt like my rx and vector but a little higher but I sank in the seat more. The only problem I see is in the windshield being to low and the straight handle bars go into it about an inch.Which is why the windshield is cut like it is. A higher windshield that curves out by your hands would be fine and higher in the middle would be the ticket. The machine doesnt' put your feet under you like the revand my arent hitting the hood. They are going to sell alot of these sleds. I would like to say good job yamaha for bringing out a fine lineup of sleds . Ex polaris rider
