What's the truth of the matter?

[Srxspec]

Guys, in two weeks I will be doing track dyno work with an 03 RX-1 with 654 miles on it, but it is fully broken in and has less than 3% leak down average across the cylinders. I will start out bone stock and work my way up to the HH & ECP kit and will also be testing some new weights that I think will be even faster. Look for an update in 2 weeks.

Allen

 

[Mighty]

Looking forward to a racers opinion, thanks Allen

 

[Scooby]

If you are a high mileage rider keep it stock. The stock clutch performs well under almost all conditions.

Super tune HH clutch kits reduce clutch life considerably. The smaller diameter rollers wear faster than normal especially with the narrow load bearing surface of the HH weights. You have a mess when the rollers shatter. The higher RPM contributes to oil burning.

ECP kits are very expensive and plug with snow. You have to watch for the snow build up under continiously changing conditions. Many riders experienced loss of top speed. Their answer was to turn the motor faster.

A onened air box with 170 mains and a ventury extractor for the crank case breather will give more trail performance than the ECP air kit.

Just my opinion over a season where most of us rode 6000 plus miles and some 10,000 to 13,000 miles. We tried it all.

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Under some conditions the HH with ECP does perform better than stock. But there are other conditions their performance is less than satisfactory. An example is in wet heavy snow or slush the HH turn higher RPM and fail to up shift as efficiently. If you combine the EPC kit with it under these conditions the fuel mileage drops by 4 to 6 mpg. This reduced mileage make a big differance if you make the trip or not.

We proved this on some of our bagger trips.

Roller life: It is common knowledge that the small rollers with the narrow HH develop a wear pattern on the rollers. Once the square edged wear pattern develops the roller looses srtength and breakes into two rollers. If you dodn't catch that breakage soon enough you will have a roller shatter.

I started out by saying if you are high mileage leave it stock. We found on extended bagger trips (of 2000 miles or more) clutch service was required during the trip and the stock was fine with only cleaning and lube.

You guy that have taken shots at we They dodn't deserve a reply.

 

[BlueByYou2000]

If you are a high mileage rider keep it stock. The stock clutch performs well under almost all conditions.

Super tune HH clutch kits reduce clutch life considerably. The smaller diameter rollers wear faster than normal especially with the narrow load bearing surface of the HH weights. You have a mess when the rollers shatter. The higher RPM contributes to oil burning.

ECP kits are very expensive and plug with snow. You have to watch for the snow build up under continiously changing conditions. Many riders experienced loss of top speed. Their answer was to turn the motor faster.

A onened air box with 170 mains and a ventury extractor for the crank case breather will give more trail performance than the ECP air kit.

Just my opinion over a season where most of us rode 6000 plus miles and some 10,000 to 13,000 miles. We tried it all.

-------------------------------------------------------



Under some conditions the HH with ECP does perform better than stock. But there are other conditions their performance is less than satisfactory. An example is in wet heavy snow or slush the HH turn higher RPM and fail to up shift as efficiently. If you combine the EPC kit with it under these conditions the fuel mileage drops by 4 to 6 mpg. This reduced mileage make a big differance if you make the trip or not.

We proved this on some of our bagger trips.

Roller life: It is common knowledge that the small rollers with the narrow HH develop a wear pattern on the rollers. Once the square edged wear pattern develops the roller looses srtength and breakes into two rollers. If you dodn't catch that breakage soon enough you will have a roller shatter.

I started out by saying if you are high mileage leave it stock. We found on extended bagger trips (of 2000 miles or more) clutch service was required during the trip and the stock was fine with only cleaning and lube.

You guy that have taken shots at we They dodn't deserve a reply.

We certainly didnt develop the kit based on those conditions (slush). If you consistantly go on bagger trips and are running in those type of extreme conditions on a regular basis, then your have the setup figured out. Stock...BBY

 

[Bossman]

What some people need to understand is that there is no one setup that is perfect for everyone. And yes snow conditions will effect the performance of every setup, not just the ones in question. I hope everyone has been riding long enough to know that temp. and snow conditions are going to effect the performance of your sled.

 

[RobX-1]

I hope everyone has been riding long enough to know that temp. and snow conditions are going to effect the performance of your sled.

Um, apparently not... :itchy:

 

[welterracer]

Scooby i must say that you are only one of a very small handful of people that i am sure of that rides 2000+miles NONSTOP!!

The average sledder only rides 0-250 miles a day!! 1000-1500 miles a year! with a few over 2500miles a year and a very small handful going in the over 5000 miles range!


I personally start to get worried about my sled once it trips 2500 miles on the OD... Thats where the jack shaft bearing start going out!!

You cannot expect aftermarket HIGHPERFORMANCE SPEED parts to outlast stock parts designed for longivitiy and a setup designed to work so so for most snow conditions (which is almost impossible to do) as stock is!

Speed parts are for those looking for Quick speed!

Just my .02 cents

Brian

 

[welterracer]

Let it snow!!

 

[SledderSteve]

The average sledder only rides 0-250 miles a day!! 1000-1500 miles a year! with a few over 2500miles a year and a very small handful going in the over 5000 miles range!
Brian

These bad snow years lately in Wisconsin have really cramped us mileage hounds. Maybe we'll be blessed this year and I'll be able to break 5k again.

I totally agree about keeping things stock if you're going for mileage. Part of the attraction/challenge I find with doing high mile runs is the conditions can change radically very quickly and you have to be prepared for most anything. Mr. Murphy of Murphy's Law fame seems to like riding with me and he just loves it when I improve my machine until it doesn't work anymore. (Yes Gina, that's the reason I carry all those tools.)

High mile riding certainly isn't for everyone but I'm sure happy there's life after being a "tweaker". :wink:

 

[Sasquatch]

Well I ride 3,000 to 5,000 miles a year. If I get a year with less than 3,000 miles I call it a bad year. I get the groceries with the sled, I shop at the local stores with the sled, I ride to work with the sled, hell I've even gone parking with a sled. I open the garage door go. Any excuse will do.

I've put 7,500 miles on my Cat's clutches so far. At 3,500 miles I took it in to inspect the clutches. They found nothing wrong with them. It still runs and shifts fine. I will get it inspected again before season begins but doubt that it needs anything. If it does it will be done and at 7,500 miles who can complain no? I mean its a Cat and we all know how unreliable they are. LOL

I keep hearing about guys rebuilding thier clutches at 2,000 miles or so. Thing is all my high mileage buddys are like me. Very high mileage very little maintence needed. Maybe I'm a wuss rider?

I've read every post on the ECP kit and the airbox mod. I like the idea of a few more ponys and better breathing. Thing is I want to go faster not nessasarily quicker. I'm not quarter mile runner ( although my touring T-Cat-Pantera would turn 94 96 mph quarters with my fat #*$&@ on it. At about 1,000 pds combined weight, sticky snow and +freezing temps. I was happy with that. ) as much as a lake racer. Everyone says quicker but more than one has said they lost a little top end with the ECP and clutch kit. Which lost the top end clutch or ECP and why? Airbox with ram effect and cold intake sounds like it gives more on top and in the middle. This makes me perk up and take notice.

I'm very interested in the airbox mod and may get a new hood so I can put it away for returning to stock when the time comes. I want more top end from this and if that means stock cluthing then stock it will stay, HH or Daltons if it gives me what I want. I hear that the RX-1 gear in the Warrior is a good start. Maybe a little more gear with the airbox mod could be pulled on top? Black John talks about shims under the secondary helix for more on top.

I like speed, I crave speed. I don't allways run at top end in fact probably very little in comparison with the miles I put on. But them cold crisp nights when I fell the urge I like to burn up the 20 mile long lake in front of my house. It calms me! Kinda takes the edge off the day if you know what I mean. The rest of the time I cruise. Part throttle motor lazing along.

Maybe thats what some of are asking I don't know. I know I am. I want a kit that gives me more top end. If I get bottom end as well then bonus. Telling me over and over how much quicker it is means nothing to me. Tell me how much faster it is! Whats the radar read at max speed. How fast before the mods? Does it run like a dirt bike? You know always reving or will it shift out more like stock sled say!

The Airbox mod sounds like it may make me very happy. Is anyone else out there like me? Has anyone tested for top end? Would one kit do both? Being as the airbox is something new this year it may be to soon to know. I'll keep reading and listening.

Stay Cool Winter is almost here.

 

[wolfie]

Excellent post 'squatch, you've captured my sentiments pretty well too. I'm not a drag racer, so I'm not so concerned with quickness, particularly if it causes a loss of top end. I don't want to lose top end. I'm always looking for a little more performance, but I also do alot of saddlebag trips, and get out in deep snow and snow storms, so I'd hate to compromise the sleds ability in those conditions. I know overly aggressive clutching is not your friend either in those conditions. I still have recollections of how well my SRX ran through a blizzard in New Brunswick some years back, when all the Polaris and Doo buddies carbs were icing up from snow injestion. I'm all too well aware of the compromises that can result in changing from stock. What I have learned is the RX1 has good stock clutching. Not every sled can claim that. Most SkiDoos come with good stock clutching. Many of the Polarises I've owned left alot on the table. Cats are touch and go, depending on the model. So it looks like the only no brainer for me so far is the machining, which I had planned on doing anyways. I did alot of searching on these forums and still can't decide if some of the other mods are for me just yet. I appreciate the comments people have made, this thread has been very informative for me.

 

[grauser]

Scooby, Yes, you have an opinion and it is just that - -an opinion !!! Not to be confused with the facts. :ORC

 

[QCRider]

Count me as another Top End guy. I don't want t lose acceleration, but if I can gain Top End without losing acceleration, sign me up. I could care less about lining up sleds from a dead stop on a lake. I want to know what it will do from 50-60 MPH to 120 plus!!

 

[Mighty]

Different strokes for different folks. Me I like quickness from corner to corner. I rarely hit the lakes anymore. I guess my question is this; Why is there a perception that you can't have both?

 

[SUPERTUNER]

I do believe that the loss of top end has been rectified...100 TIMES!!!

Thats it I am closing ECP and going into the deli business

Whats that you say?...you didn't like your sandwich?...Here allow me to give you another. (at about .75 cents loss and 600% markup)

Gotta love the food business. It is the only business where you could actually make someone throw up and still they patronize you!