Tom-RX1
Expert
The phazer will probably be yamahas biggest seller this year so why would they want to go bigger ? and why would they want to call a sled the exiter ? the last one took them from #1 to a distant #4 on the sales list . What they need now is a 100hp sled and a rx1 touring .
Tom-RX1
Tom-RX1
alaskanbowtie
Expert
Why change engines when the Apex will make that already ?
Cat did it, the're over 1000CC and when I talked to my insurance company "Fore Most" they didn't seem to care either way, just costs me a little more, the bigger they are the more money I pay basically. Why change the engine when Fundy power sports can produce that much H.p. with the Apex and it's know less dependable, if it was to spin higher they'd make even more.
>>>Tork said:
Cat did it, the're over 1000CC and when I talked to my insurance company "Fore Most" they didn't seem to care either way, just costs me a little more, the bigger they are the more money I pay basically. Why change the engine when Fundy power sports can produce that much H.p. with the Apex and it's know less dependable, if it was to spin higher they'd make even more.
alaskanbowtie
Expert
Agreed, I don't like the Exciter name either
I do think they need to bump the Mnt. sled H.p. up to around 175 or 180, but since they work on a three year cycle it's not going to happen for a couple years. Maybe they'll make a FX Mnt. sled with 175 h.p. , that would be a start in the right direction! I think your right, they'll have an FX 100h.p. or near that in the next 2 years! Maybe if were lucky the FX chasis will be turbo'd in 5 years or so.......maybe. Either way the future in sledding is going to be ground breaking!
>>>Tom-RX1 said:
I do think they need to bump the Mnt. sled H.p. up to around 175 or 180, but since they work on a three year cycle it's not going to happen for a couple years. Maybe they'll make a FX Mnt. sled with 175 h.p. , that would be a start in the right direction! I think your right, they'll have an FX 100h.p. or near that in the next 2 years! Maybe if were lucky the FX chasis will be turbo'd in 5 years or so.......maybe. Either way the future in sledding is going to be ground breaking!
Oak Hill
VIP Member
The new Phazer is the new line of sleds to come, you will see when the 08's are released! 
i hope they dont get rid of the vector/rage motor...otherwise i'm never selling my sled
4Fighter
TY 4 Stroke God
IMHO: Polaris and Cat NEED turbos to be competitive with Yamaha. We all know that if either one made a 4-stroke Mountain sled, it would fall on it's face without one.
I suppose the option would be nice for the rest of the line-up, but why? You have a choice between 80 Hp, 120 Hp, and 150 Hp. For most people, 80 MPH (Phaser) is too fast anyway. Especially to those who are already working against the sport. The industry is working overtime just to keep the EPA happy. If we press our luck, the industry will be working overtime to keep the insurance companies happy too. Both have a tremendous impact on the success or failure of this sport. Throw a few angry land owners, and someone who loses a loved-one because the machine they were riding, or got hit by, was made insanely fast for a trail that has a posted 55 MPH limit, and then where will we be? We will be fighting liability issues just to travel 10 miles @ 25 MPH on our favorite trails.
Right now, the Phazer should draw a huge following for those who are ready, and willing to dump their old 500cc and 600cc 2-strokes for a less expensive, high performance, clean, quiet, no oil burning 4-stroke, that doesn't weigh as much as they've been told to believe.
So I'm fine with Yamaha letting those who want more power, do what they've always done: Spend more of their own time and money to get it.
I suppose the option would be nice for the rest of the line-up, but why? You have a choice between 80 Hp, 120 Hp, and 150 Hp. For most people, 80 MPH (Phaser) is too fast anyway. Especially to those who are already working against the sport. The industry is working overtime just to keep the EPA happy. If we press our luck, the industry will be working overtime to keep the insurance companies happy too. Both have a tremendous impact on the success or failure of this sport. Throw a few angry land owners, and someone who loses a loved-one because the machine they were riding, or got hit by, was made insanely fast for a trail that has a posted 55 MPH limit, and then where will we be? We will be fighting liability issues just to travel 10 miles @ 25 MPH on our favorite trails.
Right now, the Phazer should draw a huge following for those who are ready, and willing to dump their old 500cc and 600cc 2-strokes for a less expensive, high performance, clean, quiet, no oil burning 4-stroke, that doesn't weigh as much as they've been told to believe.
So I'm fine with Yamaha letting those who want more power, do what they've always done: Spend more of their own time and money to get it.
Yamahnator
TY 4 Stroke Guru
4Fighter said:
The issue really isn't that there already are great sleds out there at the needed HP categories. It's that with a Turbo Yamaha could finally get rid of the "weight" reputation. Now you and I know that the weight on these things isn't like what others make them out to be. My Attak handled better and took the bumps better than most sleds out there. A lot depends on setup to for each make. But 4 strokes are performance machines now whichever way you slice it. They still have the rep though of being heavy, even though it often doesn't come into play.
Turtle
Lifetime Member
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- Marathon, WI
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- USA
- Snowmobile
- '17 Polaris Switchback 800 Pro S LE
'15 Viper RTX SE w/ MPI turbo - sold
'07 FX Phazer GT
One thing that nobody has mentioned though - is warranty.
Right now yamaha has been able to build their 4-stroke engines with enough hp to be competative in every market, without a turbo. And they've been able to do with with great reliability.
If they were to add a turbo, or supercharger, I'm sure that Yamaha would do a great job of making it work. However, someone would have to assess the amount of risk they may be taking, and do lots of reliabilty testing. Because that turbo may turn out to be a huge warranty nightmare. For every new part or new feature added to a sled, there is a potential warranty claim.
Right now yamaha has been able to build their 4-stroke engines with enough hp to be competative in every market, without a turbo. And they've been able to do with with great reliability.
If they were to add a turbo, or supercharger, I'm sure that Yamaha would do a great job of making it work. However, someone would have to assess the amount of risk they may be taking, and do lots of reliabilty testing. Because that turbo may turn out to be a huge warranty nightmare. For every new part or new feature added to a sled, there is a potential warranty claim.
craze1cars
VIP Member
I'm not always the "normal" consumer, but count me as one person who has absolutely no interest in the added complexity and parts of a turbo. If Yamaha offered one on a certain model, I would be hard pressed to convince myself to buy that one and I'd likely look elsewhere.
As a matter of fact I came to Yamaha specifically becasue they are the only manufacturer that is able to get a large amount of solid, smooth, and reliable HP out of naturally aspirated engines, without the need for forced induction. I'd much rather they spend their R & D dollars on further improvements to their existing motors and newer/better/more numerous naturally aspirated motors.
For those of you who want turbo, no problem at all and I respect your desires. Mine are just different, so I thought I'd briefly share the other side of this argument. Some of the die-hards on this site may want turbo, and the aftermarket will gladly feed them to you. But I'm not personally convinced the market as a whole actually wants a turbo Yamaha...and the market as a whole is what Yamaha needs to cater to, not the desires of a small niche of people.
I am also not convinced that a turbo would reduce weight. For example if we shrink a motor by 200cc's then slap all the turbo hardware on it to make up for the lost HP, will it actually be lighter as a whole package? I'm not convinced...I think from a weight standpoint it would be pretty much be a wash
I simply don't see the point of the whole turbo thing.
As a matter of fact I came to Yamaha specifically becasue they are the only manufacturer that is able to get a large amount of solid, smooth, and reliable HP out of naturally aspirated engines, without the need for forced induction. I'd much rather they spend their R & D dollars on further improvements to their existing motors and newer/better/more numerous naturally aspirated motors.
For those of you who want turbo, no problem at all and I respect your desires. Mine are just different, so I thought I'd briefly share the other side of this argument. Some of the die-hards on this site may want turbo, and the aftermarket will gladly feed them to you. But I'm not personally convinced the market as a whole actually wants a turbo Yamaha...and the market as a whole is what Yamaha needs to cater to, not the desires of a small niche of people.
I am also not convinced that a turbo would reduce weight. For example if we shrink a motor by 200cc's then slap all the turbo hardware on it to make up for the lost HP, will it actually be lighter as a whole package? I'm not convinced...I think from a weight standpoint it would be pretty much be a wash
I simply don't see the point of the whole turbo thing.
It is the HP to weight ratio that would improve not the physical weight. With a higher HP to weight the extra HP negates the extra weight.
alaskanbowtie
Expert
interesting
you have some good points, but Cat doesn't need the turbo, Suzuki is more than capable of competeing with yamaha in 4 stroke applications if they so desire. There current 1050cc has some nice features to the design, reliability is still subjective but I think it will be fine considering Suzuki's reputation. Cat also uses kawasaki engine in there quads so this could be an avenue for them to consider in the future as well. Polaris...well there just S.O.L. with the high end technology in the 4 stroke market, but you never know what they'll do. The future will be exciting reguardless.
>>>4Fighter said:
you have some good points, but Cat doesn't need the turbo, Suzuki is more than capable of competeing with yamaha in 4 stroke applications if they so desire. There current 1050cc has some nice features to the design, reliability is still subjective but I think it will be fine considering Suzuki's reputation. Cat also uses kawasaki engine in there quads so this could be an avenue for them to consider in the future as well. Polaris...well there just S.O.L. with the high end technology in the 4 stroke market, but you never know what they'll do. The future will be exciting reguardless.
MinnBobber
Newbie
Love to see a Yamaha turbo mtn sled. That's where most of the aftermkt turbos are being sold. I have personally seen a boosted FACTORY Yamaha being tested by the Yam factory boys out in Cooke City for the last two seasons. But, Yam may very well not produce it 
A reliable 200 HP, at altitude, mtn sled would sell like crazy, even at $15K and they could do it for much less than that. IMO
A reliable 200 HP, at altitude, mtn sled would sell like crazy, even at $15K and they could do it for much less than that. IMO
aimhigh
Newbie
Check this out for back in 1982 a turbo on a motorcycle
XJ-650 Turbo (1982)
With its world’s first carburetor turbo system, the XJ650 Turbo was quick to draw attention at the 1981 Tokyo Motor Show. This, added to the introduction of the electronic fuel injection turbo system on the XJ1100 Turbo, focused much attention on Yamaha’s turbo technology. The aerodynamically designed full faring was the product of repeated wind-tunnel tests and employed much of the modeling technology and know-how from Yamaha’s marine division.
'Overall length x width x height: 2,200mm X 730mm X 1,355mm
Weight: 230kg
Engine-type: Air-cooled 4-strokeDOHC 4-cylinder 653cc
Maximum power output: 90ps/9,000rpm
Maximum torque: 8.33kg-m/7,000rpm
If they could do it back then they can do it better now
rxrider
Jan-Ove Pedersen
- Joined
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- 2014 Phazer XTX, 2013 Phazer RTX, 2008 Apex RTX, 2007 Warrior, 2006 Attak
Turbo or not that is the ?, but Yamaha released the 2007 R-1 resently. This all new bike has got a new engine setup that cranks out 180 HP without ram air effect. We may see a R-1 derivated sled engine in the near future at 170+ HP.
grader
TY 4 Stroke Master
i owned a 1982 650 yamaha turbo bike, and it had no reliability issues at all. i was 20 yrs old at the time, and like most 20 year olds, totally indestructable(lol) i ran the living snot out of that bike and it took it all. put over 40000 miles on it before i sold it to buy a v-max. to see how far yamaha has come, compare the turbo at 650cc and aprx. 100hp to the current non turbo 600cc at aprx. 125 hp. dont be fooled by hp numbers, if yamaha wants the apex next year to have 180hp. it will, without a turbo.
