2012 Phazer RTX on trail handling

[matty k]

Hello all, this might be my first post on the 4 stroke side of the forum. I've been following posts in the Phazer forum and have appreciated all of the helpful threads to help with maintenance of my new to me 2012 Phazer RTX.

I took my Phazer on my first trip of the year this past weekend and while I was happy with the overall power and ergonomics of the sled I was having a hard time getting the handling dialled in for trail riding. Usually I like to do a couple of test and tune trail days on a new to me machine but this year we don't have much snow around home so all I got in was a couple of hours around a grass field. On this trip I didn't spend a whole bunch of time wrenching because I didn't want to hold up my group but what I did change didn't seem to make a whole lot of difference. The 2 main handling problems were really hard suspension and pushing in corners. I weigh about 255lbs plus my gear, as far as I can tell the sled is set-up with the stock skis, Fox Floats up front and rear suspension.

I started out with settings hard everywhere because I thought being a bigger guy I would need to reduce the sag when I'm sitting on the sled (this is what the field riding would seem to indicate) and because a lot of what I had been reading seemed to be suspension set-ups for women. However once on the trail I realized this was a mistake so eventually I ended up fully soft with somewhat better results but still not great. The large bumps where I could get some air the landings were soft with occasional bottoming when I softened all the skid settings but the usual small bumps that build up on the busy trail sections were still brutal. I would rather have soft over the small bumps than being able to take huge air.

In the front end the sled pushed pretty badly in corners, more than once I was worried about blowing through a turn. I tried tightening the limiter strap more (which I already did on advice from a thread here) I'm now in the second tightest strap setting. Might have helped a little, not much. I started the Fox Floats at 50 PSI which I did reduce to about 40 to try to soften up the suspension but didn't want to try to reduce much more because it seemed to give less ski pressure and more pushing in corners.

So, I'm wondering if anyone else has had similar issues with their RTX and can give a bit of direction on my next steps. Here's a list of the things I tried over the course of the weekend:
-Tighten limiter strap to try to get more ski pressure to reduce pushing in corners,
-Reduce air pressure from 50psi to ~40psi in Fox Floats up front to try to get softer front suspension,
-Reduced preload on the rear skid front shock to the point where there's no preload with the skid off the ground
-Rear torsion springs on soft,
-Rear shock clicker all the way soft.

I was really hoping that for the way I ride which is not too aggressive or really fast this sled was going to work out for me but after 900km over 3 days my back is feeling like I did that distance on my '79 Enticer 340.

Matty K

 

[blueironranger]

You probably need more air in the fronts, 60-65 is a good starting place WITH the skis off the ground. Find a setting where once the skis are on the ground the front bumper drops 3-4" when you sit on it. The RTX also has overly stiff valving on the rear skid shocks, even for a "big guy". As for the skis, if they are stock they are probably the dual keel "tuners" which great on HARD trails but push like crazy on medium to soft trails. They REALLY need to get away from calling them HARD to SOFT setting on springs, in actuality they are for adjusting ride height, which on most modern machine you want the whole sled to drop 3" up front and 4" in the rear when you hop on it.

 

[74Nitro]

Either put snowtrackers on the skis or switch to Polaris or Doo skis.
Someone else on here said they switched to Polaris skis and it transformed the front end.
Notice that all manufacturers have moved away from floats as they just couldn't get the right 'feel' from them. I know that doesn't help, however.

 

[matty k]

You probably need more air in the fronts, 60-65 is a good starting place WITH the skis off the ground. Find a setting where once the skis are on the ground the front bumper drops 3-4" when you sit on it. The RTX also has overly stiff valving on the rear skid shocks, even for a "big guy". As for the skis, if they are stock they are probably the dual keel "tuners" which great on HARD trails but push like crazy on medium to soft trails. They REALLY need to get away from calling them HARD to SOFT setting on springs, in actuality they are for adjusting ride height, which on most modern machine you want the whole sled to drop 3" up front and 4" in the rear when you hop on it.

Thanks for this, I'll try more pressure up front. As for the rear after doing more reading it's looking like I'll have to have the rear shocks re-valved. I don't have the dual keel tuners.

 

[matty k]

Either put snowtrackers on the skis or switch to Polaris or Doo skis.
Someone else on here said they switched to Polaris skis and it transformed the front end.
Notice that all manufacturers have moved away from floats as they just couldn't get the right 'feel' from them. I know that doesn't help, however.

I've been thinking about the semi aggressive snow trackers I'm just hoping I'm not going to spend a whole lot of $$$ on a problem that can't be fixed, between the hard suspension and the pushing. Interesting that the manufacturers have moved away from the floats...

 

[maim]

did you adjust the front skid shock spring at all? i set mine the same way i set a pro action and it turns and rides great. it is a 09 rtx made into an xtx now. i loosened the front skid shock spring until it was stiff to turn with one hand. still transfers like a demon at will but has a good trail ride (once the shocks got some miles onto them from a service). i did loose the floats on the front as one was jammed and some one gave me a set of gytr's for it. it is running curve skis that i had on it as i did not like the snow trackers that where on it when i got it.

6'5" 300lb youngest brother rode it as a shorty on the abitbbi canyon loop with springs on meduim and loved it and we where moving at 65 mph in places.

 

[matty k]

did you adjust the front skid shock spring at all? i set mine the same way i set a pro action and it turns and rides great. it is a 09 rtx made into an xtx now. i loosened the front skid shock spring until it was stiff to turn with one hand. still transfers like a demon at will but has a good trail ride (once the shocks got some miles onto them from a service). i did loose the floats on the front as one was jammed and some one gave me a set of gytr's for it. it is running curve skis that i had on it as i did not like the snow trackers that where on it when i got it.

6'5" 300lb youngest brother rode it as a shorty on the abitbbi canyon loop with springs on meduim and loved it and we where moving at 65 mph in places.

I have adjusted the front skid shock as you mentioned. I had the preload adjusted as per the factory spec but loosened it almost all the way off to the point where I could turn the spring by hand. It this point I've dropped the skid and all 4 shocks are getting re-valved by Shocktec.

I'm wondering what you didn't like about the Snowtrackers, they seem to be one of the go-to recommendations.

 

[maim]

where i ride there is a lot of rock and logs under the trail. i have bent a stock carbide in a 45 on a ski during a ride and did not feel it other than handling. just made me nervous with that much stuff hanging below the ski when i have caught stuff with lower profile before.

 

[equillibrium88]

IMO the stock skis are junk. I used Slydog Trail Hounds with 6" Studboy Shaper bars on my 07' with the factory track and some picks improved the handling considerably. I also fixed the slop in the collector, tie rods and the lower A-arms.

 

[matty k]

IMO the stock skis are junk. I used Slydog Trail Hounds with 6" Studboy Shaper bars on my 07' with the factory track and some picks improved the handling considerably. I also fixed the slop in the collector, tie rods and the lower A-arms.

I ended up replacing the stock skis with Slydog Trails. Much better! Got the package from Royal Distributing with carbides. And I did have all of the shocks (front and rear) re-valved and that made a considerable improvement as well.

Still the RTX is a stiff platform. It handles big drifts well, but doesn't soak up the smaller bumps of a well used trail as much as I had hoped it would. I still like the sled, I'll do at least one more season on it until I think about getting something else.

 

[maim]

oh ya those rtx shocks are stiff. mine was good until i had them serviced (i do not think they ever where in 12000km before i bought it). it has taken 3 seasons of riding before they started softening up and riding better.