Broken W-Arms 03/04 - explanation

[4Fighter]

Hey Bountyhunter:

Try riding your sled in the EUP for the entire season. From what I hear Canada has a superior trail system. Admittedly, I tried to ride my RX1 like I used to ride my Polaris EDGE :ORC It can't handle-it. I've already expressed my disgust with the antiquated handling and ride quality. I commend LB, a customer, who had to research the issue and determine a logical/reasonable explanation to the problem. Does it exist? YES. Did Yamaha do anything about it? NO! They're in denial. Same thing happened with my cousin's Yamaha Kodiak 4X4, something busted on the rear-end and Yamaha told him to go himself and all he did was drive to his deer blind. Now he owns a Honda Recon.

I.M.H.O. Yamaha promissed me an "Innovative, Ultimate Performance" snowmobile with "dependability and comfort for years to come" Yes, I did think I owed it to myself after all those years to get the snowmobile I deserved - Very clever but false advertising. If you don't believe me, check out the '04 Snowmobiles brochure. From my experience, the RX1 is better suited for long, straight, flat, smooth surfaces - so is a '71 Evinrude Skeeter. If you try to push it beyond that you may end-up fighting with Yamaha dealers over broken shocks and W-arms.

At least the people who held out for the '05 line can get a decent suspension and a Turbo in a Rage or Vector for what I have to spend on my '04 RX-1, M-10, Boss Seat, and wide front-end. just to get the ride and handling like I had on my '02 Polaris. I think allot of RX1 owners got burned by Yamaha, if not, their loyality to Yamaha has blinded them. At least AC stuck by their sleds and "recalled" the problematic issues. The more I have to argue with the Mrs. over "I told you so" and "No we're not spending THAT kind of money on your NEW snowmobile!" the more I HATE this sled .

Yamaha has lost my repeat business. Even if I come out of this on-top, I will NEVER buy another Yamaha ANYTHING ever again.

 

[BOUNTYHUNTER]

4Fighter; That is your right to voice your opinion and I feel your fustration. I totally agree with you on Yamaha Japan,Yamaha USA & Yamaha Canada always seem to find a place to hide more often than not. I have had many a battle with Yamaha over the years on issues, but I still like over all what they make. No manufacture of snowmoblies has ever made something perfect, but In my eyes YAMAHA has come close on a few more models than most. Just look at this years line up for Polaris, Cat & Doo their not even out of the gate on their big guns and already they have problem.

I wish you luck on your next purchase no matter what brand you buy and good riding to you this season!

 

[4Fighter]

Thanks for the comforting words Bountyhunter

I realize nothing is perfect - but what I knew in my Polaris has me regretting my purchase, at least this early in the game. There are some things I actually like about the 4-stroke, but without a complete and total package in the ride, handling, and comfort department, all the power and performance of the engine is easily overshadowed by the poor quality in those areas.

I don't think it's too much to ask of Yamaha to stand by its customers. Especially those who made the switch from other OEM's - fairly clean, oil consuming 2-strokes that rode and handled nearly perfect in comparrison. It was a bigger gamble for me than most because I knew nothing about Yamahas except how well my friends bragged them-up. I just happened to be the first with the RX1. But as anyone would agree, if Yamaha decided to "recall" the pre '05 RX-1 short track suspensions it might change my opinion. That's pretty wishful thinking but it's what it would take in my book. If they're so sure that there's nothing wrong with the 121" Pro-Actions then why did they develop the mono-shock and Pro-Active? So far they haven't even offered the mono as an upgrade - which I wouldn't buy anyway. I'm very disappointed that my '04 doesn't ride like my '02 Polaris or my buddy's 2000 AC. I learned a lesson on my '97 Ultra that a fast sled is a useless sled if it can't handle the rough stuff. Unfortunately, I'm reliving that experience in my RX1

 

[nhrxrider]

4fighter, I'm glad someone else has very similar feelings to mine. I'll give Yamaha credit for coming out with a sled nobody else dared to do. Even AC didn't dare to try a 4 stroke for anything but a mild trail sled for a few years, then even their T660 isn't up to RX performance. Overall I think they did great with their design, and for a first year, completely new sled, I think they could have done worse. Hey, our engines aren't blowing up like many other first-year models!

Any sled can have first year defects or even engineering/design flaws, such as I believe the rear suspension is. The key is how those are handled. A company who cares about its customers will come out with replacement parts which are improved over the defective equipment, and replace them under warrantee or recall. Considering the issues with the rear skid, I would even call that a safety issue which should have been redesigned and all '03 and '04 models recalled for repairs. If that W arm comes apart at high speed, someone could be killed.

Thats where Yamaha is making its mistake- customer satisfaction. Some dealers follow Yamaha's form and just try to dodge all the problems, and just hand the customer's a bill for repairs, while others try to keep their customers happy. But then they have problems trying to deal with Yamaha. No dealer can make all customers happy if Yamaha won't admit to problems. I spent my money for what was promissed to be the best sled on the market. Then I have to start modifying it when it was a year old just so it will be equal to other stock sleds. Its pretty sad that I have to install a 6 year old rear suspension to IMPROVE a sled that was only 1 year old at the time! I have tried dealing with Yamaha directly, and their response was that customer problems were in the hands of the dealer, and if my dealer wasn't giving me satisfaction, I should just look for another dealer. Thats fine in some areas with 4 dealers within a half hour drive, but I had one local dealer, another that was 45 minute's drive, and the next was 2 hour's drive.

So yea, I love my sled, but thats mainly because no other brand has anything to compare it to. If there was another 140+ hp 4 stroke out there, I'd be interested in it. And I fault Yamaha directly for most of the problems, because they just don't stand behind their product, and won't admit to problems.

Jim

 

[4Fighter]

Yes Yes Jim, however, I seem to be the only one who is passionate about it. It looks as if most die-hard Yamaha guys were already accustomed to the crappy ride quality so maybe it's just the ones who gave-up their AC's Polaris' and Doos who noticed it. To me there's more to a snowmobile than the engine. :ORC But like you said, there's not much alternative in the 4-stroke arena.

That's why I'm scoping out F7's

IT's just a matter of pride really - Do I want to try and make my RX1 better, or would I rather unload it for spite? I've found with the RX1 that aftermarket suspension products aren't a nicety, they're a necessity. It's a shame that something as simple as the suspension ruined my experience with Yamaha, despite the innovation of the 4-stroke. But I may just have to suffer through one more season, or no season at all.

If I put a motorcycle engine in a Radio-Flyer would it be considered innovation too?

 

[BOUNTYHUNTER]

Yes Yes Jim, however, I seem to be the only one who is passionate about it. It looks as if most die-hard Yamaha guys were already accustomed to the crappy ride quality so maybe it's just the ones who gave-up their AC's Polaris' and Doos who noticed it.

You know I never really though about it like that before, and your right. For years I just didn't know any better, I for one never rode anybody elses sled unless it was a Yamaha. I really never had any desire to ride or even try another manufactors sled. So I sure have nothing to compare it to.

I rode nothing but V-MAX 4's from 1992 up to 2001 when I Bought a 700 SRX, Those V-Max's had nothing for suspension to boast about. The 2001 SRX rode like a cadillac, and my 2004 Warrior is even that much better.

When I started snowmobling they had bogie wheels and no sliders, and the bogie wheels would flip over inside the track and you had to carry a hockey stick to flip them back over. [ Convert is going to remind me about my age on this one you watch and see ] As they got better we just accepted what they offered.

You talk about being passionate, I bleed Yamaha Red!, sometimes daily . But I would never and I mean NEVER ride another brand, I get great mileage, speed and reliability par none on all my sleds[ except the V-Max's]. I can honestly say I haven't come across an other Yamaha broken down on the trail, now Cat & Doo that's another story all together.

I guess anyone who has switched over to Yamaha will be a better judge on the ride than myself, but I hope you guys will remain open minded on this and if you go back to your old brand. Perhaps you might come back when they truely resolve those suspension issues.

Believe me when I say that the local Yamaha rep gets a ear full when he heads this way, I wish I say or do more to help make some positive changes. Unfortunately it always seem to fall on deaf ears, but I will never give up the fight to help make postive changes as I may be only one voice but I am TENACIOUS!

 

[RedRX1]

I have owned a lot of Yamaha sleds. My last 8 prior to my 03 RX1.

After spending a lot of $$$$ trying to make it survivable to ride, I traded it for a REV 600 SDI. I was upset that Yamaha didn't do something to make things better.

I rode the REV for a year. I have to say it never gave me a sore back, but I was never fully comfortable on it. My knees and shins were constantly getting banged up on the cowling and there was no changing ride position on long rides. Then there were the quality issues. Severe vibrations, exploded clutch, high oil consumption, 2 bad starters, ect. There were some good ideas in that sled, but the quality and durability concerned me.... so I bought a 05 RX1.

I am giving Yamaha 1 more chance!!! I hope they have this one down.

 

[nhrxrider]

Red,

I found the same things when I tried a REV. I'm 6'4" with long legs and long arms. I think I made it about a mile or so before my arms and back were hurting. It also felt very unstable in the corners. That observation was confirmed when I read that although the REV has a lower center of gravity WITHOUT a rider, the new riding position actually makes raises the center of gravity when there is a rider on the sled. It wasn't a bad sled, its just not for the kind of long distance riding I like to do.

Jim

 

[4Fighter]

Bountyhunter,

My first snowmobile, back in the '80's, was a '70 Yamaha SL396 w/oil injection. I remember boggie wheels, and passing them on the trail when I'd do my return trip HA HA I remember one time the oil pump belt broke on me - I only caught it because my dad showed me how to check on it. We had an SW396 also that was for parts to keep it going. Those Phazers were pretty sweet when they hit the scene too. I guess it didn't matter what it was when you're 8, just as long as it ran. I later received a Scorpion Stingeroo for Xmas, I got 1 ride out of it and still have it sitting out-back. So I was actually excited about returning to Yamaha.

Unfortunately, the RX1 was a step backward for me in the ride and handling dept. From what I was hearing, I thought most of that would have been taken care of in the '04 run. Now instead of checking an oil pump belt, I'm checking the W-arm after every bumpy ride. Go figure? If I end-up keeping it, and never get an M-10 for it, I'll never be able to trust it. What good is that?

 

[jimmie d]

I have good friends that are pure DOO riders that were part of the test group and raved about the sled in testing of the original RX1.

I think the big problem is that everyone was so impressed with the engine and the fit and finish of the sled that they overlooked the design faults with the front and rear suspension.

Because this sled has been knocked so bad it has the worst depreciation in the history of snowmobiling and Yamaha has basically abandoned the 03 RX1 owner and the dealers who are stuck with a bunch of 03 and 04 basically because the riders know the suspensions do not work unless you are willing to study study study and adjust adjust adjust.

But as everyone says Yamaha does not have recalls.

Hopefully mine will ride the way it was meant to with the extra $2,000 put in this summer, but honestly the only other option is to torch it or give it away. I find most Yamaha purists are totally blind and believe Yamaha takes advantage of that blind loyalty.The 05 sleds should be great but buying the 03 was a huge mistake.

Jim

 

[4Fighter]

Greenmachine wrote :buying the 03 was a huge mistake.

Ditto on the '04 as well. It is truly sad that the '03 and '04's will not have the resale as the '05's. I still have $3,849.23 to go on my RX1, throwing another $2,000.00 for an M-10 and a seat isn't very appealing to me. There's a 2002 XC 700 SP for sale locally (not my old one) for $4700.00, I wonder if my RX1 would even fetch that after 3 years.

I still think Yamaha should bring the '03 and '04's up to date with the mono so the RX-1 can truly be the Innovative 4-stroke as promised. If they'd go good for it, I'd quit complaining. But for my money (if I had it) I'd put it toward an M-10.

 

[nhrxrider]

I have a suspicion the rear suspension is responsible for more problems than just the harsh ride. Of course there is the W arm issue, and also some problems with transfer rods. I also had my relay rods break. But besides the direct connection to the rear suspension parts, after installing my Cat rear skid I noticed that ski lift in corners was almost completely eliminated. For some reason the action of the rear skid was effecting the ski lift. So that would explain another major engineering issue, and link it to the poorly designed rear suspension.

I wouldn't hold my breath waiting for Yamaha to do anything about the rear suspension. A friend of mine bought a first year SRX700, the one with crank problems. After his crank had been welded, then replaced, under warranty, soon after the warranty ran out the crank bent causing severe engine vibes. Yamaha wouldn't do anything about it since the sled was off warranty! It was a known problem, and he had documentation showing the previous repairs, but they still wouldn't stand behind their product. Yamah builds some great vehicles, and as long as you get a good one on the first try, you are fine; but just try and get them to admit to a problem, and you are wasting your time.

Jim

 

[4Fighter]

I can still tell them to shove it up their poop shoot and paint "Yamaha Sucks!" on my windshield if they blow me off. THANK GOD I didn't buy a Yamaha jacket this time around, pheeew or shwew??? (whiping my brow)

 

[4Fighter]

I think the big problem is that everyone was so impressed with the engine and the fit and finish of the sled that they overlooked the design faults with the front and rear suspension.

Now the owners are "overlooked" by Yamaha.

As I've said before: What good is a fast sled if you can't ride it half-of-the-time? I'm afraid to take it out without an M-10 in it for fear that the W arm will break again or worse.

Jim, I suppose if I found a good deal on an AC skid I'd consider that too. Again, the engine aspect does nothing for a rutted, G-bumped trail.

 

[banjo04414]

I have read this tread with interest. I have been riding sleds since the late 60's. One thing I have learned over the years is to give manufactures a couple of years on a new design to work the bugs out. It's just not Yamaha that fight's warranty issue's or poor engineering on the first few year's model's.
As an example, my 99 ZRT 800 had more problem's and couldn't get out of it's own way. 3 CDI boxes later [Cat paid for 2, never could straighten out the heavey front steering] and 4 month's figuring out what was causing it to die on the trail [ a $.30 washer replacement for the throttle, but cat never sent a bulletin on it.
My 02 ZR 800 was magic. Perfect. So what does Cat do, stop making them. I won't even get into my 03 F7. Talk about problems, spending money just to get it to run.....Oh BOY!.
When Yamaha came out with the RX1, I knew I would end up trying it out. But thank God, my experience told me to wait a few years for them to get the major bugs out of it.
I am also a firm believer that your Dealer makes all the difference in the world. Dealer's up my way are few and far between. I traveled an extra 30 miles to buy from one from a dealer I understand not only backs his product up but also rides it. Who know's, maybe he will be just as bad as your seem's?
Anyway, go get that other brand sled. But just a suggestion, buy one that has been out a few years and most of the problems have been address! Good luck.