hard starting apex

[RTX]

went to start my 2006 apex a week ago (its stored in a different state)
it turned over multiple times but would not start. i tried about 5 times to start it with no luck. I turned on the key multiple times and could hear the fuel pump kick on but still no luck.
It seemed like an issue with getting fuel so against my better judgement i decided to hold the throttle open and turn it over. sure enough the sled started. i let the sled warm up and then moved it out of my way. 10 minutes later i went back and it started right up first turn of the key. I waited another 15-20 mins and it started again with no issue.
I let thesled sit over night and then tried to start it and it would not start without giving it the throttle.

ps, I used fuel stabilizer before the end of the season(mechanic in a bottle or something like that) once running it seems to idle and run fine so i really dont think its bad fuel.
anyone got any ideas??

 

[ecopter]

In my experience with these engines, they're quite sensative to old fuel. It only takes a couple months with the same fuel, stabilized or not. Drain it if you can and put in fresh. I guarantee your sled will change its starting tune.

jf

 

[srxpert]

Change hour fuel and plugs. You should also fog the engine every year and drain the fuel. Stabilizer only works so long. Shame

 

[sx7001]

Sounds like it got fuel soaked on the first start and buggered up the plugs. This is very easy to do on the 4 strokes that sit for a few months. Get a set of fresh plugs and it should fire right up. If you stored it with ethanol fuel it can give you issues. If you have ethanol in there get it out, get some good gas and plugs, fire it up and let it get up to full operating temp. I start mine once a month and add fresh non ethanol fuel every time. In your case that's probably hard to do so you need to fog the engine and fill the tank with good gas when you store it. When you pull it out of storage, drain the tank and give it fresh gas. Oh yeah. change the oil before you store it, dirty oil is hard on the engine when it sits for a long time.

 

[LJ 452]

If you haven't recently checked your exhaust donuts I would also do that. One of the issues I had with mine was that it didn't want to start, much in the same way yours did. I never had to touch the throttle, then suddenly the thing wouldn't start, after several attempts and checking everything else I decided to give it the o'l pin-it trick. It sputtered and stumbled but finally lit. Needless to say the donuts were on there way out. It seems as though the change in back-pressure is enough to mess with the ignition system and foul the plugs. I think you are fouling the plugs, but the root cause needs to be determined. If you haven't/don't use any type of stabilizer, well you may want to start. Siphon out what you can, put some fresh preferably non-ethonol fuel in, along with your choice of stabilizer and run it for a while.

 

[thor452]

when ever your sled has been sitting always cycle the key switch on and off 4-5 times before you atempt to start it. the reason being is the small amount of fuel in the fuel rail loses octane much faster then the large amount in the tank. by cycling the switch you cycle the fuel pump and get better gas from the tank up in the fuel rail. when you just turn the key and try to start it the low octane fuel is sent right into the cylinder and may no longer be able to burn so it foul's out the plugs. at this point i would leave it sit and put fresh plugs in for next season. now that the plugs are foul it will start bad every time it is stone cold.

 

[kinger]

+2 on cycling the key before trying to start. I usually turn it on and off 4-5 times to make sure there is plenty of fuel in the rail ready to spray.

Other then that sounds like gas and possibly plugs.

 

[RTX]

alot of good suggestions thanks.
unfortunately the sled is in a different state so i wont even see it for another month.
Dont exactly know where you guys get your fuel but there is no fuel available in the areas i am in that does not have ethanol so using a non ethanol fuel is not really an option.

i have been using the mechanic in a bottle fuel stabilizer stuff for a while with good results and made sure it was mixed and run through the motor before storing the sled.

every other piece of equipment started wth no issues and ran fine. 2003 rev ,2010 skidoo 1200, 2009 nytro, 2002 viper. all started and ran with no issues and all were put away with the same fuel and the same stabilizer. only the 2006 apex was an issue.

it has to come home in a month for a thorough going over. oil change/filter, time for a new battery. shock repairs. multiple loose rivets to drill out and replace. jackshaft and drive shaft bearings to replace and i was planning to change over to the copper style donuts.
I guess i will figure it out once i get it home.
Thanks

 

[snappy]

I have been chasing a cold start issue all this past season that sounds very similar I did plugs it didnt help (06 injected?mine is an07 attak gt with over 10k on it). Although it never up put any codes my mechanic synched the throttle bodies and tested the T.P.S. and the T.P.S. failed. Apparently the big bikes use the same one and it is a recall on the bikes because it is a saftey issue. They were backordered and cost about $200.00. Starts fine now real test when the cold comes. It cant come fast enough!

 

[RTX]

snappy
Ive been through the tps issue already.
i bought this sled new, the 2nd or 3rd season it had some major issues but only when hot (hot like an hour of hard running)
it would run great but when you came to a stop it would stumble and die. you could restart it but it wouldn't idle while hot. once cold it was fine again, then the cycle repeats. I brought it to the dealer and they couldn't replicate the issue. i brought it home and ran it in my shed for a week testing everything. probably had 40+ hours into it when i just happened to read something about the tps on the r1 bikes. I was on street bike forums because there was really not a lot of help here at the time, just a lot of guessing. sure enough the part # for my tps was the same part # they were recalling on the r1, so i pulled my tps and tested it with a hairdryer heating it and sure enough once it reached a certain temp it went bonkers. i called my dealer and told him what i found. he told me he had a box full of replacement tps switches for the r1 bikes just drop my tps off and he gave me a brand new one.
no more problems since then.
although i am sure it is possible i highly doubt it is my tps causing this issue but i will be checking it when i get my sled home just to be sure.

 

[Blue Dave]

Can someone please elaborate on the TPS recall? Specifically the part number and sleds that it may be installed in. I am not having any issues currently but if I have this part I would like to replace it as a proactive measure.

 

[RTX]

there is no recall for sleds.
the deal is that yamaha used a potentially faulty tps on some street bikes and that same tps carried over into the sled lines. not every tps fails. over time some will and some wont. but on the bike line it was just too dangerous so there was a recall.
If your bike starts ideling weird or stalls at an intersection you could be killed.
i guess they never saw the same urgency on the snowmobile end of it.
yamaha eventually changed the tps on both lines. if you check out microfisch when ordering parts you can see that the part # on 2006 apex is superceeded with a new part #. dont know how long it took yamaha to fix it but it affected my 2006 apex
if you do a google search for yamaha tps recall
there is hours of reading/info

 

[Blue Dave]

I guess that I can look to see if the superceded p/n on the 2006 is the same p/n as what is in my 2007.

 

[RTX]

So i finally got my sled home from maine.
i tried to start it and now it wont start at all.
While trying to get it running i noticed that i was throwing a code 12.
I checked the manual and see that it is the crank position sensor. it actually triggered this code 3 times in the memory which sounds right since this is probably the 3rd time it screwed up.
Ive got too many things to fix around here right now so this one is gonna have to wait a few weeks but the way it looks right now im gonna need a new stator

edit
just found the part # for the crank position sensor
5VY-85896-00-00
I was under the impression that the stator and the crankshaft position sensor were 1
piece and could only be purchased as such. now i see different!!
if after testing i find that its just the sensor that failed, im more than happy to splice/solder a new one in place