Help! Suspension adjustments

[yamaha1]

I have read a lot of the different forum on this site and my owners manual about how to adjust the suspension on my '05 Rage. When I rode it with all the stock settings it felt nice and plush but would bottom out on bigger bumps. So left everthing stock and changed the Full Rate adjuster to Hard. Took it out and just about rolled it. When you would let off the throttle there would be so much ski pressure that it would dart back and forth really hard. Could barely keep control of it. So I adjusted the transfer rods and put a little more weight transfer into it. It got a little better. I don't know a lot about adjusting suspensions and seems like I always go back and forth and can never get it dialed in. I need some really specific directions on what to do. Oh and I am 250lbs without gear on.

I am think now I need to got back to medium on the FR adjuster and go full stiff on the the spring pre loads for both the front and rear shock of the skid frame. Which is the other thing......how do you adjust the spring pre load on the front spring without taking out the skid frame. It is really hard to get at.

Sorry for the long explanation.....but any information would be great!

 

[NY_Nytro]

Not sure how adjusting FRA to hard could add so much more ski pressure when you let off the throttle.

Sounds like your center shock isn't carrying much weight and on decelleration all the weight shifts to skis instead of being shared between the skis and the center shock.

First thing I would do is verify ALL stock settings, most importantly the center preload and limiter strap settings.

For your weight the FRA should be defintely set to hard. Set the rear spring to get proper ride height with you and gear on the sled (50/50 split on the transfer rods). When bottoming do not adjust the rear spring use the compression adjustment screw on the rear shock to help with bottoming. The rear spring preload is for ride height not bottoming.

 

[yamaha1]

Well, it added ski pressure but it is not just when you let off the throttle. That is just when it would really want to dart back and forth.

All of the other setting are stock settings..... I just bought the sled in Dec. as a new hold over, and that is the only adjustment I have made. I just don't want to start adjusting things left and right and get it messed up and not get it back to where it was. The balance and everything was good stock just would bottom out the front and rear shocks on the skid on the bigger stuff.

So is there any good ways to stiffen the pre load on the front shock of the skid, without taking the skid out? I know it needs to be stiffer, but I can't seem to get the lock nut loose on it with that stupid little spanner wrench.

 

[Grimm]

I would definately look into shimming your skis, since you mention that they dart alot.

Try to find the article on how to shim skis via the "tech pages" at totallyamaha.com .

 

[NY_Nytro]

Well, it added ski pressure but it is not just when you let off the throttle. That is just when it would really want to dart back and forth.

All of the other setting are stock settings..... I just bought the sled in Dec. as a new hold over, and that is the only adjustment I have made. I just don't want to start adjusting things left and right and get it messed up and not get it back to where it was. The balance and everything was good stock just would bottom out the front and rear shocks on the skid on the bigger stuff.

So is there any good ways to stiffen the pre load on the front shock of the skid, without taking the skid out? I know it needs to be stiffer, but I can't seem to get the lock nut loose on it with that stupid little spanner wrench.

Use a floor jack or some blocks of wood and get the front end lifted so the skis are off the ground, then back off the ski springs until there is just enough tension so they won't rattle. This will reduce ski pressure overall.

I know of no easy way to adjust the center spring. It's almost easier to remove the shock.

Again adjust rear spring preload to obtain the correct static ride height and turn up the compression clicker on the rear shock to help the bottoming problem.

 

[yamaha1]

Well.....I set everything back to its stock position and was able to adjust the pre load on the front shock of the skid. When two turns stiffer. I went for a little ride. Seemed like the front felt better, but the back shock was obviously too soft. So if I went two turns on the front shock should I do something with the pre load on the rear shock to keep it in balance. I know you (NY_W) said that you shoud just get the ride height set with the pre load and adjust the softness with the compression adjustment screw.

Not really sure what the ride height should be at. When I am sitting on it (without gear) there is a little bit more gap at the top of the transfer rods than at the bottom.

As far as the darting. It is much better this way, but still does it some. I think it is enhanced by the fact that we had some rain here so the snow is very ice crusted. So when one side breaks through it catches and pulls to that side.

Need some colder temps and more snow so I can get some real riding in.

 

[NY_Nytro]

Well.....I set everything back to its stock position and was able to adjust the pre load on the front shock of the skid. When two turns stiffer. I went for a little ride. Seemed like the front felt better, but the back shock was obviously too soft. So if I went two turns on the front shock should I do something with the pre load on the rear shock to keep it in balance. I know you (NY_W) said that you shoud just get the ride height set with the pre load and adjust the softness with the compression adjustment screw.

Not really sure what the ride height should be at. When I am sitting on it (without gear) there is a little bit more gap at the top of the transfer rods than at the bottom.

As far as the darting. It is much better this way, but still does it some. I think it is enhanced by the fact that we had some rain here so the snow is very ice crusted. So when one side breaks through it catches and pulls to that side.

Need some colder temps and more snow so I can get some real riding in.

Sounds like your ride height is about right 60/40 on the transfer rods is good and optimal for aggressive riding.

Also too much transfer will make the rear soft as well. Reduce the transfer and the rear shock will couple with the center shock sooner and this will stiffen the rear. Take away a little transfer at a time. The quick adjuster nuts are great and allow you to adjust as the trail conditions change.

 

[yamaha1]

I don't think that I need less transfer at this point. Just need to stiffen up the the rear a little. Not sure if I should do this by changing the FRA to hard (too much ski pressure last time with this) or just go a couple clicks stiffer on the rear shock pre load or go a few clicks stiffer with the damping screw? Or a combination of all of the above? I have not had a chance to really play around with it much due to lack of snow and warm temps.

 

[Groomerdriver]

I don't think that I need less transfer at this point. Just need to stiffen up the the rear a little. Not sure if I should do this by changing the FRA to hard (too much ski pressure last time with this) or just go a couple clicks stiffer on the rear shock pre load or go a few clicks stiffer with the damping screw? Or a combination of all of the above? I have not had a chance to really play around with it much due to lack of snow and warm temps.

stiffen up the rear preload...not the shock

 

[yamaha1]

So if I need to stiffen the rear shock pre load, by how much? I have gone two turns stiffer on the front shock of the skid. I would think you would want to go (percentage wise) about the same on the back. So would that be one, two or three notches. Or would I be better off changing the FRA to hard and maybe back the pre load off a notch or two?

Just trying to analyze how all these adjustments affect each other and what would make you adjust one thing over another.

I am a mechanical engineer so I probably over analyze things.

Thanks everone for the input.

 

[NY_Nytro]

I don't think that I need less transfer at this point. Just need to stiffen up the the rear a little. Not sure if I should do this by changing the FRA to hard (too much ski pressure last time with this) or just go a couple clicks stiffer on the rear shock pre load or go a few clicks stiffer with the damping screw? Or a combination of all of the above? I have not had a chance to really play around with it much due to lack of snow and warm temps.

stiffen up the rear preload...not the shock

This taken from the OHLINS suspension tuning manual.

Increasing the spring pre-load does not make
the shock absorber stiffer, other than the initial
force to compress the suspension from fully extended
position. Since the suspension shall be
compressed as soon as you sit on the
snowmobile, the suspension will not be stiffer
after increasing the pre-load, only higher.
• Within reasonable limits, the spring pre-load
does not affect bottoming. The spring stiffness (weaker or stronger)
and the hydraulic damping are the keys to
bottoming control.

 

[yamaha1]

NY_W.....where can a guy find a good suspension tuning manual like that? Does the shop manual for these sleds go through suspension tuning in greater detail?

Thanks

 

[NY_Nytro]

NY_W.....where can a guy find a good suspension tuning manual like that? Does the shop manual for these sleds go through suspension tuning in greater detail?

Thanks

Its in PDF format on www.ohlins.com. It's a great manual.
Here's the link http://www.ohlins.com/pdf/07230-02A.pdf

 

[yamaha1]

Sweet.........Thanks