New Apex Belt Drive Systems

[stevewithOCD]

I've always thought this was a much better system especially since i blew 2 chaincases in last machine. Lack of reverse & tapped out budget will prevent me from buying this in next 2 years, but when i turn it into a lake brawler, i'll consider this system. To replace my chaincase after blowing, ran me almost a $1000; that was every single part. Think of the benefits of this belt drive. 1. You could carry a spare belt. 2. You could change pulleys for gearing in minutes ( drag racing on lake in morning then trail riding later) 3. you can see any problems starting to exist 4. Weight & rotating mass which we've all complained about on Apex's 5. SIMPLICITY 6. If bearings have zirks we'll hardly ever have to change them 7. Less maintenace 8. Easy track change just to name a few. Most guys will not give up reverse, but there are many people here that love to play & make improvements & speed gains that will consider this belt drive. P.S. If you do design a bearing with zirk fitting, can you design one for the clutch side also. Then i'd only change bearings with a track change evey 10,000 miles...

 

[heelingcowboy1]

From what I have seen over the years is that its about $100 per 1 horsepower---If your looking at a product at ads 5-6 horse then I would expect to pay somewhere beteen $500-$600. (although Less would be nice!!)

 

[2ooosrx]

It will not be that cheap of a system just based off of all of the parts that go into the making of this system. I appreciate the input but we will not be able to manufacture this entire system close to that inexpensive. If you compare purchasing all parts for a completely new chaincase and both the jackshaft and drive axel (included in this kit aswell), you are already looking over $1500 MSRP. With that said, this system is not exactly targeted for the average trail rider. There is one other belt drive manufacture out there I do believe and there systems are going for around $1500. The difference our system has is lighter components and a different tensioning system which allows you to run much more power through the belt. We are also providing a lightweight drive-axel and jackshaft in this system. I guess a better method to determine MSRP would be to throw out a very very rough estimate of a cost of the system. Without looking at manufacturing costs which could significantly be lowered by the demand of the product, lets assume that the cost of the system will be anywhere from $1500-$2000 for the time being. What would be the interest in that ball park range. Thanks for the comments guys and keep them coming

 

[kviper]

I think the price tag was the other companies reason for not selling many. When you talk about handling more power how much are you talking? It would not be legal in any stock or even improved classes and you would need to handle in excess of 600 HP in a pro mod. I think you would be hard pressed to get many trail rider's to give up there reverse and put out $1,500. I'am sure there would be some intrest but it would probably be a narrow window.

 

[heelingcowboy1]

Sorry 2000SRX---Didn't mean to severly lowball your product---I was just going on what I had seen power products go for over the years price per horsepower.

 

[2ooosrx]

Sorry 2000SRX---Didn't mean to severly lowball your product---I was just going on what I had seen power products go for over the years price per horsepower.

I knew you weren't trying to low ball the product, I just wanted it to be known that this system does not fit those standards due to the difficultly of machining all of these parts.

As far as handling power, I do not have a conclusive answer for that due to lack of a machine of extremely high HP to test on. I was simply saying that the pulley system on this model is superior to previous systems because nearly twice the amount of teeth are engaged.

This system will more than likely not be oriented to the average trailer rider as I have said before but it does prove fairly signifcant performance gains on the dyno and the system will also be dropping an inconclusive 5 - 10 pounds off the sled. When I have more conclusive numbers, I will be happy to pass them on.

 

[kviper]

Here's another way to look at it and the reason I asked how much power it will handle. If you have a 3 % gain on a 600 HP sled the cost per gained HP comes more in line. On 150 HP sled it is way to expensive per gained HP and the money would be better spent on other thing's (studying,clutching,gearing,PC-3 and ignition module,air box). All these thing's set up properly will give you serious gain's over stock on an Apex for about $1,500. And there are more option's from there at a cost of about $100 per HP,give or take. Sorry I usually look at thing's as negative as possible to start wit so I don't get any surprises.

 

[rindtj]

I think that a lot of guys in the mountains might be pretty interested in this as well- not a huge need for reverse- weight savings- and a great way to ensure to stranded surprises.

3% HP at the track seems like a pretty good amount to me as well- no expert but I thought I read somewhere that a Yamcharger increases track HP by like 12 or so? Not comparing this package to a Yamcharger just illustrating that the meager looking gains may need to be taken with a grain of salt.

 

[2ooosrx]

Yes I agree with both of you that because this is based off of a percentage of HP, the higher HP sleds will benefit more from this type of system. As it can be seen on the dyno charts, near the end of the run, the difference gets to be as high as 5-6% increases in power. On a 600 HP sled you are looking at ~30 HP added by only changing the drive system.

Another thing to be noted is the reduced rotational mass which could be the leading cause for a 0.3-0.4 faster 1/4 mile times.

 

[Essarex]

I don't know what the OEM driveshaft and jackshaft sell for, but if you were in need of those parts anyway, then the belt drive suddenly becomes more affordable. All Apex owners with 5000 - 6000 miles, should be considering their next PM purchase of a driveshaft, as the OEM will fail eventually.

5 or 6 track hp is equal to 10 or 12 crank hp, and that is significant. The nice thing about driveline efficiency improvements is that they are 100% efficient, ie, you do not have to live with any compromise. The gains are there at all rpm, no sacrificing low to mid for upper hp gains, as in a cam change for example. In fact, the belt drive becomes more efficient as rpm increases, as angular energy increases with the square of speed (double rpm and you quadruple angular kinetic energy).

I would gladly pay $1500 for a new driveshaft (I need anyway), new bearings, new jackshaft, and everything else.

 

[kviper]

At 49 I would not give up reverse for it. I use my reverse a lot, Back out of the trailer, parking lot's, Gas station's etc. If I were Looking for more power in an Apex for trail another $800 on top of the drive kit and I could net a solid 15 track HP through out a wider band and still have reverse. Every ones situation is different but that is mine.

 

[Snowmobileaddict]

I remember reading about this design (looks very similar) in early 2007 back when I was a Polaris enthusiast. In those days I spent a lot of time on the www.snowmobilefanatics.com message board.

Here is a 4 page thread with pics including some spirited discussion regarding the belt drive conversion for the SRX.

http://www.snowmobilefanatics.com/forum ... sted-video

 

[arteeex]

How about moving the brake system down to the drive axle? I've always liked the idea of having brakes in the event that a belt/chain lets go.

 

[Super Sled]

I remember reading about this design (looks very similar) in early 2007 back when I was a Polaris enthusiast. In those days I spent a lot of time on the www.snowmobilefanatics.com message board.

Here is a 4 page thread with pics including some spirited discussion regarding the belt drive conversion for the SRX.

http://www.snowmobilefanatics.com/forum ... sted-video

That was 4 pages worth of the most ridiculous thread
I've ever read. And that "Arctic Matt" guy reminded me perfectly of every obnoxious Arctc Cat owner stereotype out there. World class arogance there by that guy!

I thimk this is cool, but I wouldn't dream of giving up reverse on my Apex. Have you ever tried pulling that thing? Reverse is mandatory equipment!!!!!!!!

 

[kinger]

I wish we could get away from it all together go from primary down to drive shaft. But I know we cant. 50% efficiency of a drive system is horrendus. If we could get a 90% efficient drive it would be like supercharging your sled! Although I'm not sure any drive system on the planet is 90% efficient other then a jet engine LOL.