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Real World 1500 Mile Low Down of new Ski Doo XR-S 900 Turbo vs. SideWinder

stevewithOCD said:
OK, i'm feeling the love & camaraderie again. Sometimes we just need to hear it now & then. Thanks SteveO!
I'm going to bring this thread right back to the title. "New T vs. Winder"
Although i'm partial to Yamaha because of my long time satisfaction with their products, i am in NO way brand loyal.
No matter what you buy whether it's a car, bike, truck or sled, you will find goods & bads to each make.
I also believe with a year or 2 of tuning, the tuners will get this T dialed in. It will never match a full tilt Winder, but it will make the majority of us very happy.

I definitely like the rear suspension on the T more then mine. I like the accessories & options it offers also. Little things like adjustable handlebars with marks on the handlebars for adjusting & also checking to see if something moved, are nice thought out features that show DOO has us riders on their minds.
I like the front end & looks on the Winder much better then the T.

This will probably be my last year on this Winder since it will be hard to sell with over 15,000 miles on it.
The T is high on my list, but will need some "motor massaging" since my 20,000 mile Apex spanks it like a BAD BAD girlfriend.

I've also been hearing with all these new DOO's is to precisely align the clutches. That & installing aftermarket clutch shroud makes a big difference in heat & performance consistency.

P.S. I am NOT condoning violence against women rather taking care of their "abusive Daddy" fantasies which is perfectly acceptable.
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The 900t has no clutch alignment issues that i am aware of. Or even heard of. I think you are thinking of the 850
I own a 900t and it has the coolest running clutching i have ever seen.
 

KnappAttack said:
So NOT true about the long intake. The hardest hitting, and most instant response machine I’ve ever owned or riden was my old cable operated 1200s with single throttle body on it.

So throw that theory out the window.

Both my old NA and turbo 1200s. They were literally instant and would always holeshot ANYTHING. If you weren’t careful with my old turbo 1200s they would put you in the trees. They were not the new throttle by wire though either.

Far more responsive than the decompressed winder with triple throttle bodies.
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Sorry Mike.....(I know we always disagreed on this)

The worst, slowest reacting sled I ever rode was the 1200xr....It reacted so slow compared to apex,viper or any 2 stroke. It was a 2013 X model. I know you loved your XR but it never was good for tight corner to corner, it was fine once you were moving and better then this current 900t iTC design, but the intake is the problem, as discussed by most all engineers.

Im not a Fan of Lester boys but this video helps to show how the response was back then(Pre-iTC). BRP finally decided to address it by adding DBW(drive by wire) or what they coined 'iTC'. And on my 2016 1200 with iTC, it did help alot when using sport mode, far far better response then the pre-iTC models I rode. But the turbo 900t just does not work well at all with iTC, and it all stems from the original issue. You simply cannot have a butterfly that many inches away from the cylinder and expect it to have snappy throttle response, so for big trail guys its less noticed, but for tight corner to corner guys who want to snap the nose off each knoll, forget it....by the time the engine reacts you are already falling down between moguls.

My apex and every other sled I ever owned had instant throttle response, 2s are great for response and the YAMAHA 4strokes are too. Its only one sled that has this horrible elastic feel to the throttle, and it just so happens its the engine with an intake tract that is over 8".

Mike, I do agree with you that the stock Winder has poor response, but that is turbo lag and we know is cured with the originator of early spool tunes(Hurricane). Unfortunately the tunes on the 900t I rode had a poor throttle feel still.

 
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krm said:
Just ck out TD and Hurricanes videos of tuned 900ts being tested .NO lag in my 900t with the newest TD 210 tune ,and im not the average clutching Guru ,been at it for 40+ yrs .Not many have the latest TD or Hurricane tunes .
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I would love to find one that has instant snap and is smooth enough at slower speeds for moguls still...But the tuned one we rode was actually worse feeling in the iTC. Honestly I would love for the 900t to work well, as I wanted one. We need another 4s performance sled for when we get sick of wrenching the Winders. Everytime I demo'd a stocker or tried a tuned one hoping for the best, it was just terrible.

Running tighter trails where we are on/off throttle constantly brings out all the shortcomings of this iTC/intake design. And the weight/handling is really not that great when compared to the Winder which is heavier. The Doo 2s at least is a much much more fun sled to ride and is instant at the thumb. It's too bad BRP cannot make a 2s that will last without blowing up.

Been watching Ben's dyno videos of the 900t, It would be nice if they could even just put a proper throttle lever on these sleds, as the ergo's of the iTC lever is also a factor. Maybe BRP will get it better, or Tuners will....I'd be the first to try one if it felt more normal.

Dan
 
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RTX said:
The 900t has no clutch alignment issues that i am aware of. Or even heard of. I think you are thinking of the 850
I own a 900t and it has the coolest running clutching i have ever seen.
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True....the 900t does many things well, good belt life, cool clutches, good fuel economy....For touring guys its a great choice with decent power. I would probably have tried one if I rode strictly more wide open trails where the iTC was not as noticable.

Dan
 
I swapped my 998 with a buddy last year with a 900t on a ride and immediately felt the ITC but it was in sport , so I knocked it down one setting (sorry don't remember the settings) and it was fine, actually thought about buying one and if it was capable of 300hp when I was deciding between anew 998 or a 900t it would of been the 900t. The 900t I drove was a Hurricane flashed sled that day.
 
ROCKERDAN said:
True....the 900t does many things well, good belt life, cool clutches, good fuel economy....For touring guys its a great choice with decent power. I would probably have tried one if I rode strictly more wide open trails where the iTC was not as noticable.

Dan
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Dan,You need to ck.out the new video on FB from TD on the 900t .And get a ride on one with the latest tunes .Ben says his newest 900t tune is the quickest spooling turbo motor to date ,.
 
NYTurbo said:
I swapped my 998 with a buddy last year with a 900t on a ride and immediately felt the ITC but it was in sport , so I knocked it down one setting (sorry don't remember the settings) and it was fine, actually thought about buying one and if it was capable of 300hp when I was deciding between anew 998 or a 900t it would of been the 900t. The 900t I drove was a Hurricane flashed sled that day.
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From hot to cool you have Sport, Standard and lastly Eco. I agree Standard spools out very smoothly with or without a tune and I’m thinking the throttle complaint is in Sport which can be an edgy squeeze. All together I adjusted just fine from an Apex xtx.
 
Watching that video makes me want to ride an Apex again!
It was just as snappy if not snappier then the DOO 800, but when those 4 cylinders started to sing.......OH MY GAAAAWD!

When i get to Heaven, i'm gonna ask St. Paul if i can test 4 Cylinder In-Line Jap motors for ETERNITY!
 
clutch-master-bater.jpg


ClutchMaster said:
View attachment 148875
Told you it was true! We have photographic proof!
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Hey nice Sasquatch Pics. I found this!
 
ROCKERDAN said:
Sorry Mike.....(I know we always disagreed on this)

The worst, slowest reacting sled I ever rode was the 1200xr....It reacted so slow compared to apex,viper or any 2 stroke. It was a 2013 X model. I know you loved your XR but it never was good for tight corner to corner, it was fine once you were moving and better then this current 900t iTC design, but the intake is the problem, as discussed by most all engineers.

Im not a Fan of Lester boys but this video helps to show how the response was back then(Pre-iTC). BRP finally decided to address it by adding DBW(drive by wire) or what they coined 'iTC'. And on my 2016 1200 with iTC, it did help alot when using sport mode, far far better response then the pre-iTC models I rode. But the turbo 900t just does not work well at all with iTC, and it all stems from the original issue. You simply cannot have a butterfly that many inches away from the cylinder and expect it to have snappy throttle response, so for big trail guys its less noticed, but for tight corner to corner guys who want to snap the nose off each knoll, forget it....by the time the engine reacts you are already falling down between moguls.

My apex and every other sled I ever owned had instant throttle response, 2s are great for response and the YAMAHA 4strokes are too. Its only one sled that has this horrible elastic feel to the throttle, and it just so happens its the engine with an intake tract that is over 8".

Mike, I do agree with you that the stock Winder has poor response, but that is turbo lag and we know is cured with the originator of early spool tunes(Hurricane). Unfortunately the tunes on the 900t I rode had a poor throttle feel still.

Click to expand...

Dan the videos you posted with and without iTc, the 900t seems 3 times as bad as the XR.
 
:rocks:That’s a whole other level of FUCKED UP!!!!
Even for a summer time forum debate!!!!
LMFAO
 
ROCKERDAN said:
Sorry Mike.....(I know we always disagreed on this)

The worst, slowest reacting sled I ever rode was the 1200xr....It reacted so slow compared to apex,viper or any 2 stroke. It was a 2013 X model. I know you loved your XR but it never was good for tight corner to corner, it was fine once you were moving and better then this current 900t iTC design, but the intake is the problem, as discussed by most all engineers.

Im not a Fan of Lester boys but this video helps to show how the response was back then(Pre-iTC). BRP finally decided to address it by adding DBW(drive by wire) or what they coined 'iTC'. And on my 2016 1200 with iTC, it did help alot when using sport mode, far far better response then the pre-iTC models I rode. But the turbo 900t just does not work well at all with iTC, and it all stems from the original issue. You simply cannot have a butterfly that many inches away from the cylinder and expect it to have snappy throttle response, so for big trail guys its less noticed, but for tight corner to corner guys who want to snap the nose off each knoll, forget it....by the time the engine reacts you are already falling down between moguls.

My apex and every other sled I ever owned had instant throttle response, 2s are great for response and the YAMAHA 4strokes are too. Its only one sled that has this horrible elastic feel to the throttle, and it just so happens its the engine with an intake tract that is over 8".

Mike, I do agree with you that the stock Winder has poor response, but that is turbo lag and we know is cured with the originator of early spool tunes(Hurricane). Unfortunately the tunes on the 900t I rode had a poor throttle feel still.

Click to expand...
i miss my Apex .... u watch that and remember why it was so good .
 
Augie said:
Sasquatch reads the latest press release from Yamaha that they are re-introducing the four-cylinder Apex for 2021 to be built in Japan with an all new chassis.
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OMG LMFAO!!
 
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