Supertrax article-Whats everyone think

[newfie09xtx]

Too bad yamaha wasn't in the article. What does everyone think about these predictions. I looked at switching to the skidoo with r-motion but I just can't get past their motor problems.

http://www.supertraxmag.com/article.asp?nid=2303

 

[Riceburner]

Are these the same engineers who brought us last years Crappy Cats?
I would'nt consider buying a new Cat until they have 2 reliable seasons under their belt.

Polaris Indy. Yup, Nice sled, Good market niche. However, none for me due to non existant customer service on the last Polaris I owned. [ Polaris told me to park it , "it is unsafe" they said. Ten + recalls I think and no help at all getting back on the trail.]

Doo 800 2 stroke . Great rear suspension. The rest not so much for a trail sled. An engine you can't count on to get you home slower than my Stock Apex makes it a non starter in my books.

If you care at all about Reliability and Making it home.

 

[KnappAttack]

Too bad yamaha wasn't in the article. What does everyone think about these predictions. I looked at switching to the skidoo with r-motion but I just can't get past their motor problems.

http://www.supertraxmag.com/article.asp?nid=2303

The 1200 is problem free. You owe it to yourself to give one a try. I'm on my second 09 1200 Doo and planning to upgrade to the new 13 w/r-motion, I'm coming off off a 2012 f1100 turbo and a 2011 Apex XTX. Sold both to go back to the 09 1200, I just like the Doo much more then anything ridden to date. Hard to imagine the R-motion is better, but they claim it is the finest ride out there.

 

[SledFreak]

Are these the same engineers who brought us last years Crappy Cats?
I would'nt consider buying a new Cat until they have 2 reliable seasons under their belt.

Polaris Indy. Yup, Nice sled, Good market niche. However, none for me due to non existant customer service on the last Polaris I owned. [ Polaris told me to park it , "it is unsafe" they said. Ten + recalls I think and no help at all getting back on the trail.]

Doo. Great rear suspension. The rest not so much for a trail sled. An engine you can't count on to get you home slower than my Stock Apex makes it a non starter in my books.

If you care at all about Reliability and Making it home.

Lets face it here... Everybody on this board only like 4 stroke motors. The 1200 is an excellent motor and will run side by side to a Nytro and/or Apex to 100mph. Ski-doo's chassis rules... You need to take the blinders off and take one for a ride. If you still don't see it, then you are just to brand loyal. Every mag has stated that ski-doo has the best rear skid in the industry. After owning a Nytro XTX and an Apex, I will say a new 1200 gade with Rmotion is the best groomed trail out there IMO..

 

[shadow44]

Too bad yamaha wasn't in the article. What does everyone think about these predictions. I looked at switching to the skidoo with r-motion but I just can't get past their motor problems.

http://www.supertraxmag.com/article.asp?nid=2303

The 1200 is problem free. You owe it to yourself to give one a try. I'm on my second 09 1200 Doo and planning to upgrade to the new 13 w/r-motion, I'm coming off off a 2012 f1100 turbo and a 2011 Apex XTX. Sold both to go back to the 09 1200, I just like the Doo much more then anything ridden to date. Hard to imagine the R-motion is better, but they claim it is the finest ride out there.

I wouldn't go so far as to say they are problem free...you're on DooTalk...just as many threads on there about small issues....there isn't a such thing as a perfect sled...it's all about what each individual prefers. I prefer that riding position of my Nytro compared to a Ski Doo..but that's just me. I've ridden Doos with the R Motion, and it is a very nice ride...but then again, I like the Rush in that department.

 

[KnappAttack]

I wouldn't go so far as to say they are problem free...you're on DooTalk...just as many threads on there about small issues....there isn't a such thing as a perfect sled...it's all about what each individual prefers. I prefer that riding position of my Nytro compared to a Ski Doo..but that's just me. I've ridden Doos with the R Motion, and it is a very nice ride...but then again, I like the Rush in that department.

OK hows this? MY 1200's and many, many others have been problem free. And one of mine was even a turbo and was problem free.

IMO the 1200 is as perfect of a machine as has ever been in my shop. Theres a reason I got rid of all the others. The 1200 rMOTION Renegade is the next machine on my list.

 

[Riceburner]

Are these the same engineers who brought us last years Crappy Cats?
I would'nt consider buying a new Cat until they have 2 reliable seasons under their belt.

Polaris Indy. Yup, Nice sled, Good market niche. However, none for me due to non existant customer service on the last Polaris I owned. [ Polaris told me to park it , "it is unsafe" they said. Ten + recalls I think and no help at all getting back on the trail.]

Doo. Great rear suspension. The rest not so much for a trail sled. An engine you can't count on to get you home slower than my Stock Apex makes it a non starter in my books.

If you care at all about Reliability and Making it home.

Lets face it here... Everybody on this board only like 4 stroke motors. The 1200 is an excellent motor and will run side by side to a Nytro and/or Apex to 100mph. Ski-doo's chassis rules... You need to take the blinders off and take one for a ride. If you still don't see it, then you are just to brand loyal. Every mag has stated that ski-doo has the best rear skid in the industry. After owning a Nytro XTX and an Apex, I will say a new 1200 gade with Rmotion is the best groomed trail out there IMO..

My apologies. You may well be right on the 1200 Doo. I was referring to the 800 XP's [P Tec & E-tec] but did not make that clear in my post. I have edited it to reflect same.

I had no idea a stock 1200 Doo would run with my Stock Apex. They must whoop the E-Tecs then . Surprised anyone would buy an 800 Doo if the 1200 4 Strokes are quicker to 100 mph and more Stable on the trail.

No Blinders here. I've had em all. 94 Doo STX was the best of all the other brands I have owned. It always got me home.

 

[shadow44]

I wouldn't go so far as to say they are problem free...you're on DooTalk...just as many threads on there about small issues....there isn't a such thing as a perfect sled...it's all about what each individual prefers. I prefer that riding position of my Nytro compared to a Ski Doo..but that's just me. I've ridden Doos with the R Motion, and it is a very nice ride...but then again, I like the Rush in that department.

OK hows this? MY 1200's and many, many others have been problem free. And one of mine was even a turbo and was problem free.

IMO the 1200 is as perfect of a machine as has ever been in my shop. Theres a reason I got rid of all the others. The 1200 rMOTION Renegade is the next machine on my list.

Same thing with guys and their Nytros, Apexs, Vectors....many, many guys have had zero issues with many miles on them...Your opinion of the 1200 being the perfect sled is just that..your opinion...and you are entitled to that, but you can't say they are without their problems just becuase you've never had any issues....

 

[Irv]

I wouldn't go so far as to say they are problem free...you're on DooTalk...just as many threads on there about small issues....there isn't a such thing as a perfect sled...it's all about what each individual prefers. I prefer that riding position of my Nytro compared to a Ski Doo..but that's just me. I've ridden Doos with the R Motion, and it is a very nice ride...but then again, I like the Rush in that department.

OK hows this? MY 1200's and many, many others have been problem free. And one of mine was even a turbo and was problem free.

IMO the 1200 is as perfect of a machine as has ever been in my shop. Theres a reason I got rid of all the others. The 1200 rMOTION Renegade is the next machine on my list.

Same thing with guys and their Nytros, Apexs, Vectors....many, many guys have had zero issues with many miles on them...Your opinion of the 1200 being the perfect sled is just that..your opinion...and you are entitled to that, but you can't say they are without their problems just becuase you've never had any issues....

Well said Shadow

 

[KnappAttack]

IMO the 1200 is one of the most problem free snowmobiles ever produced.

There are really no known issues, like bent bulkheads, blown and broken exhaust pipes and donuts, broken suspension rails and arms, blown wheels, rusted and wore out drive bearings and idler wheel bearings, cracked oil tanks, broken drive axles, sloppy steering bushings, broken cam chain tensioners, worn out heim joints, sloppy spindles and a/arms, missing and leaking grease fittings, poor or lacking hand warmers, and on and on.

The 1200 has some leaking oil coolers on the 09's, a couple stators, and a few complaints of seeping valve cover gaskets on the early ones and a water pump gear that was an issue on the 09's too, easily changed out to an updated gear. No where near the long list I have seen on the Yamaha site.

I have had many, many Yamahas along with my neighbor and friends. I know the issues and they far excede any of the issues on a 1200. Just read the forums.

 

[KnappAttack]

Here's another one where the Ski-Doo voted best in class.

http://www.supertraxmag.com/article.asp?nid=2321

No Yamaha in site, and its a two-stroke they call bulletproof. I don't know, go figure.

Doo is still number one for a reason. Much as I'd like to see Yamaha step it up, they fail to deliver the goods.

 

[shadow44]

IMO the 1200 is one of the most problem free snowmobiles ever produced.

There are really no known issues, like bent bulkheads, blown and broken exhaust pipes and donuts, broken suspension rails and arms, blown wheels, rusted and wore out drive bearings and idler wheel bearings, cracked oil tanks, broken drive axles, sloppy steering bushings, broken cam chain tensioners, worn out heim joints, sloppy spindles and a/arms, missing and leaking grease fittings, poor or lacking hand warmers, and on and on.

The 1200 has some leaking oil coolers on the 09's, a couple stators, and a few complaints of seeping valve cover gaskets on the early ones and a water pump gear that was an issue on the 09's too, easily changed out to an updated gear. No where near the long list I have seen on the Yamaha site.

I have had many, many Yamahas along with my neighbor and friends. I know the issues and they far excede any of the issues on a 1200. Just read the forums.

Take the blinders off Knapp...blown clutches, cracking frames, coolant leaks, oil coolers leaks, startor issues ( not just a couple ) and so on.....NO sled is perfect! I've gone through Doo XR forums and have seen just as many threads with guys complaining about small and large issues...you make is sound like the sled had one bad year lol....not true sport...NO sled is without issues!

 

[SledFreak]

I think what Mike is saying is that DOO did have some issues what the items he mentioned but really only on the 09 sleds when it was first re-leased. They quickly updated the parts for the 10 re-lease. The only other issue that really seemed to carry over to 10's and 11's were some oil coolers and only effected a very small amount of them. You cant say that about the Yamahas, since they do not change anything reguardless if the parts/design is/are junk or not. The handwarmers and idlers wheels and bushings in the Yamaha speak for themselves. They were junk in 06 on the Apex and junk on the Nytro in 08 and beyond year released sleds for both types of sleds.

At least DOO changed the defected parts year after year reducing any issues. (4 stroke sleds I am talking) Doo also adds better design changes on the overall sleds year to year to make the sled even better. Yamaha has no record of ever doing that on their sleds or ATV lines and thats a fact.

The 1200 is a very reliable sled and is very well balanced and is an excellent riding sled, right out of the box. IMO, if you are a 90% groomed trail rider, there is nothing better. Before I came to Yamaha in 05, I always said that DOO made a great chassis, but there engines lacked. That is not true anymore with the 1200. Its an excellent motor combined with an excellent chassis.

All sleds do have issues and some people like different feels to their own ride. But, there is a reason DOO is number 1 in sales across the board compared to the rest and they don't have the highest HP sled. That says alot IMO...

 

[KnappAttack]

Take the blinders off Knapp...blown clutches, cracking frames, coolant leaks, oil coolers leaks, startor issues ( not just a couple ) and so on.....NO sled is perfect! I've gone through Doo XR forums and have seen just as many threads with guys complaining about small and large issues...you make is sound like the sled had one bad year lol....not true sport...NO sled is without issues!

Are you serious? Sorry, but nowhere near the complaints on the Doo forum, not even close to the complaints on the Yamaha forum! The complaints on the 1200 forum are very minimal! Very Minimal!

No starter issues, but a FEW stator’s gone bad yes. It’s a very small percentage, not a rash of stators like you make it sound.
ONE GUY, NOT MAY GUYS! NOT EVEN TWO GUYS, BUT ONE (#1) GUY, just posted about a minor cracked chassis piece that has no structural use to it, in fact, it’s not even on the 2011-2013’s!

Clutches rarely blow, only the guys who neglect the arm bushings and fail to inspect, had a couple clutch parts break on the stockers, its rare and the clutch doesn’t blow but the arm inside the clutch. One year (2010) had a clutch inspection for oil on the taper and a different clutch bolt update and a few the clutch bolts broke, the clutch spider come off and some carnage occurred. The coolant leak IS the oil cooler and easily remedied and, yes is limited to the 09's and an update kit for the 09’s was available for them RIGHT AWAY! No the 1200 is not perfect, but IMO the closest to perfect snowmobile I’ve ever seen.

MY BLINDERS ARE OFF! Last year I tried a new Cat F1100 turbo, year before that tried a "New" Apex XTX with power steering, Before that tried a Z1 turbo, before that had well over a dozen Yamaha Four-strokes, turbos, stock, four cylinder and three cylinders. I've been all over trying to find a better sled than the 1200 Doo and haven't been successful yet.

When is the last time YOU tried a different brand shadow???? Perhaps it’s time YOU take the blinders off!

 

[shadow44]

Take the blinders off Knapp...blown clutches, cracking frames, coolant leaks, oil coolers leaks, startor issues ( not just a couple ) and so on.....NO sled is perfect! I've gone through Doo XR forums and have seen just as many threads with guys complaining about small and large issues...you make is sound like the sled had one bad year lol....not true sport...NO sled is without issues!

Are you serious? Sorry, but nowhere near the complaints on the Doo forum, not even close to the complaints on the Yamaha forum! The complaints on the 1200 forum are very minimal! Very Minimal!

No starter issues, but a FEW stator’s gone bad yes. It’s a very small percentage, not a rash of stators like you make it sound.
ONE GUY, NOT MAY GUYS! NOT EVEN TWO GUYS, BUT ONE (#1) GUY, just posted about a minor cracked chassis piece that has no structural use to it, in fact, it’s not even on the 2011-2013’s!

Clutches rarely blow, only the guys who neglect the arm bushings and fail to inspect, had a couple clutch parts break on the stockers, its rare and the clutch doesn’t blow but the arm inside the clutch. One year (2010) had a clutch inspection for oil on the taper and a different clutch bolt update and a few the clutch bolts broke, the clutch spider come off and some carnage occurred. The coolant leak IS the oil cooler and easily remedied and, yes is limited to the 09's and an update kit for the 09’s was available for them RIGHT AWAY! No the 1200 is not perfect, but IMO the closest to perfect snowmobile I’ve ever seen.

MY BLINDERS ARE OFF! Last year I tried a new Cat F1100 turbo, year before that tried a "New" Apex XTX with power steering, Before that tried a Z1 turbo, before that had well over a dozen Yamaha Four-strokes, turbos, stock, four cylinder and three cylinders. I've been all over trying to find a better sled than the 1200 Doo and haven't been successful yet.

When is the last time YOU tried a different brand shadow???? Perhaps it’s time YOU take the blinders off!

I edited this, and was going to banter with you some more...but you seem to have it in your head that the Doo 1200 is the be all and all sled...enjoy it, just like I will enjoy my Nytro. You're not worth arguing with Knapp...you say you don't have blinders on...but really you do...they are just a different colour now. FWIW, I get a chance every year to try new stuff. Last year it was a Rush 800 LE ( very nice sled, great handling, nice trail grunt, great ergos...just lacks top end ) and a Doo Etech 800 with R-Motion...again, nice sled but I don't care for Doos riding postion period, so I highly doubt I will like the 1200...but would try one if given the opportunity. Either way, done arguing with you...enjoy your 1200.