2014

[shadow44]

AKRIDER I am truely get sick of your opions. All you ever do is bad mouth Yamaha and how shitty of a job you think they do. Im glad you sold your Nytro. You dont deserve it. You can ride whatever you want when ever you want. I dont care. May you have many miles without a blown motor, oh never mind didnt that already happen! Really sick of your bashing,go somewhere else. I hear HCS is a great place for people like you. We come hear to talk sleds, Not listen to you cry cause you couldnt ride a Nytro.

I get ya srxpert...I too didn't like all of AKs bashes...but after reading alot of his stuff he does make some very good points. While it may seem like nothing but negativity, it boils down to it being hard critisism and in the right areas...all valid stuff. I am a Yamaha guy a heart and I love my Nytro RTX...but there will come a day I want something new and Yamaha NEEDS to step up to the plate big time. One chassis with a few different motors..IMO they should drop the 4 cyl for weight reasons and go with a boosted and non boosted Nytro motor in a lighter chassis. Regardless, try to look at what the flaws AK points out and how they could be addressed...especially with the Nytro.

 

[Blue Dave]

I has a chat with my dealer today. He said the all new Cats will have Yamaha motors and all Yamahas and Cats will be built in the US Cat factory.
By 2015 Cata and Yamaha will be the same just like GM & Chevy.
He had no new info on new sleds.
I would assume we are going to the cat suspention tweaks.
He also had to sign up as a Cat dealer.

However crazy this sounds it makes a lot of sence. One of yamahas biggest issues has been losses due to currency fluctuations. Moving production to the US is important so they can shift productions based on profitmargins (like the car industrie)

My dealer told me nearly the same thing yesterday when I asked him what he thought was coming. Specifically that he will need to become a two line (Arctic Cat & Yamaha) dealer, the Yamaha engines (since AC cut their ties to Suzuki), and Yamaha sleds being built in Thief River Falls, MN.

Mmm..... I guess that we will just have to wait and see. He is going to the big dealer meeting in February and all will be revealed then. Should be interesting for sure.

 

[Blue Dave]

AKRIDER I am truely get sick of your opions. All you ever do is bad mouth Yamaha and how shitty of a job you think they do. Im glad you sold your Nytro. You dont deserve it. You can ride whatever you want when ever you want. I dont care. May you have many miles without a blown motor, oh never mind didnt that already happen! Really sick of your bashing,go somewhere else. I hear HCS is a great place for people like you. We come hear to talk sleds, Not listen to you cry cause you couldnt ride a Nytro.

I get ya srxpert...I too didn't like all of AKs bashes...but after reading alot of his stuff he does make some very good points. While it may seem like nothing but negativity, it boils down to it being hard critisism and in the right areas...all valid stuff. I am a Yamaha guy a heart and I love my Nytro RTX...but there will come a day I want something new and Yamaha NEEDS to step up to the plate big time. One chassis with a few different motors..IMO they should drop the 4 cyl for weight reasons and go with a boosted and non boosted Nytro motor in a lighter chassis. Regardless, try to look at what the flaws AK points out and how they could be addressed...especially with the Nytro.

Although I have never ridden a Nytro I do agree that AK seems to make some good points and that he does balance his criticism with positive comments when appropriate. It seems to me that those that do not want to hear fair and balanced discussion that sometimes involves constructive criticism are perhaps the ones that are intolerant of others and seem to be more like they belong on HCS or Doo Talk. JMO which I have thought was always welcome on TY!

 

[yamaha1973]

Re: Jive Turkey

What I would like to know is who is going to Minneapolis

Hopefully this guy!

 

[canadianhunter]

I just went back 17 pages and read every AKrider post. I did NOT find any post where AKrider was bashing Yamaha. Rather a display of research and knowledge. Most of his post were about the future and only a limited number of his own opinion were not even expressed that strongly.
Anyone that thinks he was bashing should take off their blue glasses and step on them.

 

[Super Sled]

I just went back 17 pages and read every AKrider post. I did NOT find any post where AKrider was bashing Yamaha. Rather a display of research and knowledge. Most of his post were about the future and only a limited number of his own opinion were not even expressed that strongly.
Anyone that thinks he was bashing should take off their blue glasses and step on them.

I concur. AKrider has a lot of valuable points and he has tried many sled models, so has good perspective.

 

[LJ 452]

Are you guys proof reading your posts? This is TY4stroke.com you guys are Yamaha guys and you are talking up Doo our almost direct competitor... Don't get me wrong I think doo has done a good job in bringing the Etec and r motion it's fast and handles well. But 2012 etec 800r and my 06 apex gt are even! Wow if I spent 15000 on a new etec and was even with a 6 year old sled I'd be pissed. And the 800 sounds so bad you guys say Yamaha drones ride a doo all day.... Now onto the topic of the 1200 vs Nytro. I have not ridden either so take this as it is. The nytro 1000cc 3 cyl motor has 120-130 hp the 4 tec 3 cyl 1200cc has 120-130 hp.... there is something not right there...no? the Apex is 1000cc has 165hp.... a 1200 with 130? same with cat 1100 turbo. TURBO and its 180 hp if you turbo an Apex it can go from 200-500 I've seen of course it needs a lot more work to make sure it does not rip itself to pieces but still. these are simply numbers and it proves the efficiency of the big YMC they run faster are more efficient and deliver more hp na than anyone. I cannot say YMC has a better suspension since they do not but that is pretty well the only thing doo beats Yamaha on. I am sure Yamaha is coming out with something big in 2014 we'll have to wait and see.

I think you need to read up on the true specifications on each engine and get a full understanding of each. Including, cylinders, weight, RPM, peak H.P. non-peak H.P., physical size including mounting requirements, etc. there is much more to each engine than just the displacement. Yes the Apex engine is probably one of the most capable in terms of output just plain put a smile on your face for what it is, but it all comes at a cost, don't think that with gear reduction any of the super bike motors couldn't go in a sled, the others have just gone with a more "chassis friendly" engine design. I think the Nytro engine is the direction they will go, less complicated, smaller foot print, lower RPM, very good output per C.C. at that RPM.

As for AK, he and myself have taken some flack for what I consider being honest about Yamahas direction in comparison to the competition. For me it's the fact that they were so close to a well rounded machine but just refused to do anything about it. To sit there and pretend that they are perfect is a joke, I'll tell you three or four things about my current ride (SnoPro) that are stupid, but then I'll tell you it's the best handling sled and most fun overall sled to ride I've been on. Every sled has issues, if you think your sled is perfect I encourage you to try what the others have to offer, I think you will find your self starting to question how much longer you want to deal with the four to six year old issues that continue to go un resolved yet solutions exist all over these forums.

 

[Murse]

[/quote] I think you need to read up on the true specifications on each engine and get a full understanding of each. Including, cylinders, weight, RPM, peak H.P. non-peak H.P., physical size including mounting requirements, etc. there is much more to each engine than just the displacement. Yes the Apex engine is probably one of the most capable in terms of output just plain put a smile on your face for what it is, but it all comes at a cost, don't think that with gear reduction any of the super bike motors couldn't go in a sled, the others have just gone with a more "chassis friendly" engine design. I think the Nytro engine is the direction they will go, less complicated, smaller foot print, lower RPM, very good output per C.C. at that RPM.[/quote]

I agree I can always use more information and I'm no mechanic or engineer but I see how it is with the advertised number although my previous statement may be off a little it still doesn't change the fact that Yamaha is very efficient and can make raw power. I have seen some Yamaha issues first hand and I'm beginning to lose the blue goggles but I still will not buy anything else I see more pro's with other brands then con's now and it is good to compare. NO matter what competition will always be good for the market looking forward to March snowmobile show to see what they are coming out with. I would love to see the Nytro improved and would seriously consider ordering one.

 

[srxpert]

I understand he is trying to make a point on how Yamaha needs to change what they are doing but he keeps beating the same dead horse. Everyone on here has read over and over the things he does not like about the Nytro. Its like listenening to a friend who just got divorced bashing his ex wife. After 5 years get over it and move on. We all know of the issues we enconter with our sleds but after 20 years of riding Yamaha i have never been towed home. Enough said.

 

[snobill]

My dealer told me nearly the same thing yesterday when I asked him what he thought was coming. Specifically that he will need to become a two line (Arctic Cat & Yamaha) dealer, the Yamaha engines (since AC cut their ties to Suzuki), and Yamaha sleds being built in Thief River Falls, MN.

That must be why the poo dealer here don't sell cats anymore ! Cuz our yamaha dealer has to very soon . I saw on dealer sign today 2012 nitro $7800 thats cheep ! Making room?

 

[Mighty]

after 20 years of riding Yamaha i have never been towed home. Enough said.

That is your only concern when it comes to sledding?

 

[actionjack]

My dealer told me nearly the same thing yesterday when I asked him what he thought was coming. Specifically that he will need to become a two line (Arctic Cat & Yamaha) dealer, the Yamaha engines (since AC cut their ties to Suzuki), and Yamaha sleds being built in Thief River Falls, MN.

That must be why the poo dealer here don't sell cats anymore ! Cuz our yamaha dealer has to very soon . I saw on dealer sign today 2012 nitro $7800 thats cheep ! Making room?

17 pages in this thread alone. I've even posted that where there's smoke there is fire, but I still find this hard to believe. I'm not against it er se. It just seems pretty radical.

 

[srxpert]

Not my only concern but by far my biggest. I ride thousands of miles alone and the last thing I need to worry about is if I will make it home or will I break down on the trail somewhere. A sled being reliable is a big plus. If the sled I am riding has to be tweaked to make it what I want so be it,thats half the fun of ownership.

 

[AKrider]

I has a chat with my dealer today. He said the all new Cats will have Yamaha motors and all Yamahas and Cats will be built in the US Cat factory.
By 2015 Cata and Yamaha will be the same just like GM & Chevy.
He had no new info on new sleds.
I would assume we are going to the cat suspention tweaks.
He also had to sign up as a Cat dealer.

If there is any truth to this, it would be a very good thing. Cat knows how to build a chassis and has lots of experience with installing 4-stroke motors into existing chassis. They were running 4-stroke sleds before Yamaha, starting back with the little 660 triple and they even offered a turbo charged version. Our club has a BearCat with turbo'd 660 and once the boost comes on it pulls pretty good.

The only thing is, Chris Reid wrote in his blog that both companies sell 4-wheelers and side-by-sides so they overlap in many areas of the market. By the same token he just hinted that "Genesis" is a key word. That could be meant to mean they are entering into an agreement with Cat to supply motors (and hope fully clutches) and Cat will produce sleds for them here in the USA. The yen to US dollar exchange rate is not favorable to Yamaha right now. By producing sleds in the USA, they would lower their costs.

To me, an agreement of some type only makes sense. Yamaha is currently offering huge discounts on '13 models presumably to clear them out. The are a motor company first and foremost and Cat needs motors. Unless Cat is planning to buy Suzuki motors after '14, they will need to either buy motors from someone else or build all their own motors and I just can't see them pulling that off. The other big thing, why is Yamaha doing their big dealer show in Minnesota? I think because it would make people more accepting of some type of joint venture.

 

[biffdotorg]

Interesting post on Hardcore sledder this morning:

http://www.hardcoresledder.com/forums/3 ... -2014.html

"not starting anything here Was up in N.WI and the speedwerx guys were on the lake we were riding on and have meet them a number of times through out the years. (they say ) 2014 Yamaha Apex and all long tracks and crossovers will be arctic cat (like) suspension front and rear. new line up will be all 3 cylinder, apex will have a cat (like) turbo on the current 120 hp 3 cylinder and put out 180hp stock. They have said things in past years to be true so who knows. "