Add oil to the engine also?

[03RX1-ER-LE]

I changed the oil and filter on all three of my sleds this fall, I thought I saw somewhere on these message boards to add 1 qt thru the opening in the cam cover and then the other two thru the oil tank, run engine and top off as needed thru oil tank. I could not find the thread when it came time to do it so after looking thru my service manual that does not say to do this I went ahead and did it anyways. I have not ridden the sleds yet however am going to do so this weekend, is there something I am missing here by doing this? Looking at the oil change threads today on this subject, I see where a few people have talked about adding thru the oil tank, and then run engine and recheck and add to tank as needed. Since I have been a master ASE certifed auto tech for 35 years now, it seems compeletly logical what I did, but due to the expense of what engine parts alone cost for this motor I would hate to have one fail from some stupid air lock created while doing this. Any thought on this would be apreaciated from the many great minds on this awesome web site!

 

[Bullet69]

Now I could be wrong here, but it is a "Dry Sump Engine", so you only need to add to the oil tank. I think the owners manual would say to do that if they wanted you to, and the people that are adding to the top of the engine are only doing that by their choice.

 

[kinger]

I "think" you add the oil through the head on a complete engine rebuild, on a normal fill you use the tank only since the system is still primed. That said I just changed oil and did a qt through the head and 3 in the tank, haven't started yet as I am waiting on some parts for the carb. either way just verify your circulating oil by looking into the tank while its running and watch for swirling, then check the level and go have fun.

 

[RedRocket]

Here are the 3 pages directly from the service manual including the procedure and oil types:


Click thumbnails for larger images

They only say to add oil to the tank and not the engine.

And here is how to properly check the oil level:

 

[03griz]

I add two liters to the oil tank, start sled till low oil light comes on pour in the last litre and call it good.

 

[RXMax]

2 in tank and 1 in the motor assures no problems...

 

[Len Todd]

3 in tank and 1 in the motor assures no problems...

Other than overfilling the thing. It is 3.0 quarts w/o filter and 3.2 with filter. You may want to consider taking a moment and reading what they posted up above.

Also, it is in fact a dry sump engine. You can actually mees things up if you fill it from the engine. Adding all the oil all to the tank is fine. Adding a quart to the engine seems a bit much. Maybe 1/2 quart. But adding to the engine is not necessary and increases risk. Think about it a moment, where is all that oil going to go when you put it in the engine?

 

[RXMax]

Edit post for content. I was just stating what I have been taught by a very reputable 5-star dealer with 2 very excellent 5-star mechanics.

 

[Len Todd]

I personally have seen 2 motors go down because of air in the oil system.

BTW what does it take to be a TY Tech Adviser? Being able to give criticism/technical advice in a sarcastic manner? You and LB sure have something going for you. Let the bashing begin. Just my take following the site. Sure I don't have to like, just stating my opinion

Everyone is entitled to their opinion. Hopefully, our opinions are are based on facts and objectiveness.

The likelihood of having an oil system go air bound as a result of an oil change is extremely Low. You are unique if you have personally seen two failures directly attributable to this, after an oil change. Not sure how one could definitively prove an engine failure due to being air bound. I mean what is the "smoking gun" here? I do not recall ever seening an engine airbound as a result of an oil change reported on this site either. However, I do put 1/2 quart in the Engine and the rest in the tank, when I change the filter.

I apologize if I said something that caused you to feel that I was being sarcastic, in a negative way. I do joke around a bit. Occasionally, the "thin skinned" or technically incorrect, get defensive. There is not a lot of room for these folks around here. But, we all make mistakes and typos. Fortunately, we all feel safe helping each other out with a minimum of defensiveness and yes we occasionally are a bit sarcastic.

Please do not group me in with LB. We are different. We do have some similarities, though. Occasionally, he words things a bit aggressively. So do I. But, he too is very knowledgeable about our sleds. He too takes the time to research and post info to help. We both get a little short with the guy who is obviously wrong, comes across ripe for negative sarcasm or is not willing to take the time to read a little or tell us enough about the problem for us to make a specific suggestion versus shooting in the dark.

To be a Tech Adviser, one has to be knowledgeable about sleds in general (i.e. not one specific sled), and be willing to take the time and have the technical ability to research the topics we are not so knowledgeable about. We have to be technically correct, most of the time. We have to know the right questions to ask. We have to have a view of things beyond fixing them with a band aide. We look for the root case of the problem, and then we have to be able to describe it and the fix in words and pictures. And yes, even after 10 hrs at work and couple hours of sledding, we still fire up the computer after midnight and check the "Need a Fix" and other forums for the guys we know we have waiting for help. Bottom line: Our posts have to be helpful. Apparently, the staff of this site felt LB and I (and several others) were doing that. Consequently, they asked us (including the several others) to be Tech Advisers. And given our unique personalities, seldom coinciding good days, often coinciding bad days and hundreds of posts we read, interpret and respond to each week during the snow season, we try our best.

 

[MS-310]

So do you guys change the filter every time you do a oil change? if not how much oil do you fill the tank with???? 2 qts? and with a oil filter change? Just trying to see what every one else does.

Thanks

 

[Bullet69]

Here's what I don't understand. In the owners manual it says,

Oil Quanity:
With oil filter cartridge 3.0L(2.6 Imp qt, 3.2 US qt)

Without oil filter cartridge repalcement 2.8L(2.5 Imp qt, 3.0 US qt)

Total amount 3.8L(3.3 Imp qt, 4.0 US qt)

Now if it takes 3.2 qts of oil with a filter change, than where do they get 4.0 total qts?

 

[RedRocket]

You will never get all of the oil out of the system with a standard oil change and they figure roughly 0.8 quarts of oil will stay in the engine. This is mostly in the lines, pump, and other engine crevasses that do not drain easily.

If you were to rebuild the engine or conduct a full rebuild, it would take 4.0 quarts to fill it since there is no oil in the engine or pump/tank at all.

 

[Bullet69]

I guess that I never thought of that. Thanks.

 

[Len Todd]

This is typical of dry sump engines. And it is also is a reason for adding a bit of oil in the engine, if you have had it apart. (Personally, I always coat things as I put them together, too. Bearings get a bit of STP. These days, they may even have something better to use for this. Again, ... this is just my way of doing things.)

If you watch what is going on in the 4 Stroke Performance Section of this site, they get down to the nittly gritty on engine rebuilds and modifications. I gave up on engine rebuilds when we went to 4 strokes. It looked to me like there is a lot more "tibial knowledge" involved with 4 stoke rebuilds than with 2-stokes. But, that is what that section of the web site is all about. I guess I am just past the adventurous stage.

Back to the point:

Apparently, some rebuilders actually take a few steps to prime the oil system, after a rebuild. If you are really interested in oil system "priming," there was a thread on this last year. A few minutes with a search on "prime" may yield that thread.

 

[4strokelover87]

Quick question somewhat related to this topic....I only put on about 600-800 miles a season and my Warrior spends the offseason in my shop which is held at a constant 65 to 70 degrees year-round. I have been changing my oil and filter every fall. My question is, is this necessary or would I be OK changing it every other year with only putting this many miles on? Thanks!!!