Cold Weather Starting

[ArcticRider]

I live in the above the Arctic Circle in Alaska and sometimes it gets cold. My 2016 Viper has always had trouble starting when it gets around -10F. A few days ago it started at -4F after turning the key on and off twice to run the cycle. Then at -9F and the next day at -14F I couldn't get it to start, i put a heat gun on the engine to warm it up, but that didn't seem to help. Today i had a buddy drag the machine to a warm building and I changed the spark plugs, they were black. Obviously i had flooded the machine. My question is: What can I do to get my machine started when its -10F or colder? I had to ride my 2010 Polaris Trail Touring instead of my viper yesterday, haha.

 

[murdered141]

Viper's are notorious for freezing relays, try bringing them inside for the night, not sure which ones as I never had that problem on my 15, others put in solid state relays, there's a thread here somewhere.

 

[FrozenTows4]

These are not cold weather machines. Some claim to not have a problem. But how does that help me?
-10f was the start/no start threshold for mine. If coolant temperature read colder than -9f, upon cycling the key, I wouldn't even try. Out came the heat gun to warm up the entire engine to -5f or warmer. Then it would start like a summer day.

I would carry the heat gun on trips. Would have to make sure the sled was parked close to an electrical outlet at the motel. Most times I'd shove the heat gun up the exhaust pipe and go back into the motel for 15 minutes or more.

Frozen relays have been discussed here. I upgraded to the Mouser -40f relays. Relays are not the "no start" smoking gun. Maybe a part of the issue, but only heat would allow the sled to start.

I contemplated installing an engine heater.

https://www.countrycat.com/arctic-cat-7639-584-engine-coolant-heater-2016-2019-bearcat-7000-xt

But I just can't get my head around plugging in a snowmobile. It's a snowmobile.
Sad reality is if we're continually operating in -9f, and colder temperatures, 2 stroke is the way to go. They love the colder temperatures. 4 strokes do not. They need to be plugged in/heated to start.

Keep attempting to start, at -10f and colder, and one runs the risk of the famous shot gun blast through the muffler. Very loud, very violent, and can split the muffler at the seams.

Perhaps the 2018 re-flash will solve this issue. I'm not optimistic since the last 4-5 flashes did little to nothing to improve engine management.

 

[sxr70001]

You should watch some of the videos that Yellowknife made when he had his Viper. There is no good answer. I think that a few things that might help are really good synthetic oil, a jump pack so the battery can really spin the motor over that first start of the day. Also, don't run premium fuel unless required as the flashpoint is higher. There is another thread on here talking about sealed relays for the sidewinder, same as Viper. I think Yellowknife resorted to using a generator and a engine heater on really cold days. 4 strokes like a heated garage.

 

[murdered141]

I went out riding on a -18 morning, sled was on an open trailer all night, had to crank it for about 20 seconds but fired up fine, 5th season coming up and I'm still on original battery, no battery tender for me, have several just don't use them, instead I fire up my sled at least once a week and let it idle up to 150° and shut er down.

 

[sxr70001]

I have only had a no start one time and it was after being on a trailer all day driving. I could tell right away it was the fuel pump because I couldn't hear it running. I put a heat gun on the fuse box for a few minutes and it started right up. Good thing I knew about from here or I would have been freaking out.

 

[SnoNinja]

Viper's are notorious for freezing relays, try bringing them inside for the night, not sure which ones as I never had that problem on my 15, others put in solid state relays, there's a thread here somewhere.

Solid state relays for Vipers do not exist. There is a thread about others hoped to be better, but they are not solid state.

I have relocated my relays to the clutch guard which makes them easily accessible for the times that they freeze. Only happened to me once, but that was enough to make me relocate them.

 

[4strokeluvr111]

How about a battery heater? Keep your power source warm and cranking volts up.

 

[ArcticRider]

Viper's are notorious for freezing relays, try bringing them inside for the night, not sure which ones as I never had that problem on my 15, others put in solid state relays, there's a thread here somewhere.

I like the idea of relocating the relays, i know my buddies nytro had problems with relays. I'll have to read the thread because i can change the oil and spark plugs but beyond that i need to study up. Ayy advice on changing the location of the relays?
I used to have an engine block heater that i plugged in, but it stopped working. I've been trying to heat the engine with the heat gun, but even when I bring the engine temp it doesn't want to start, that makes me think it may be a voltage issue on the battery? Although the Voltage says its at 11.4.
What would a battery heater be? I've never really heard of that.

 

[ArcticRider]

You should watch some of the videos that Yellowknife made when he had his Viper. There is no good answer. I think that a few things that might help are really good synthetic oil, a jump pack so the battery can really spin the motor over that first start of the day. Also, don't run premium fuel unless required as the flashpoint is higher. There is another thread on here talking about sealed relays for the sidewinder, same as Viper. I think Yellowknife resorted to using a generator and a engine heater on really cold days. 4 strokes like a heated garage.

I'll have to check out Yellowknife, i wish i could just put in in a garage, but i don't own one and if I did heating fuel is $10 a gallon so it would be expensive to heat too.

 

[ArcticRider]

These are not cold weather machines. Some claim to not have a problem. But how does that help me?
-10f was the start/no start threshold for mine. If coolant temperature read colder than -9f, upon cycling the key, I wouldn't even try. Out came the heat gun to warm up the entire engine to -5f or warmer. Then it would start like a summer day.

I would carry the heat gun on trips. Would have to make sure the sled was parked close to an electrical outlet at the motel. Most times I'd shove the heat gun up the exhaust pipe and go back into the motel for 15 minutes or more.

Frozen relays have been discussed here. I upgraded to the Mouser -40f relays. Relays are not the "no start" smoking gun. Maybe a part of the issue, but only heat would allow the sled to start.

I contemplated installing an engine heater.

https://www.countrycat.com/arctic-cat-7639-584-engine-coolant-heater-2016-2019-bearcat-7000-xt

But I just can't get my head around plugging in a snowmobile. It's a snowmobile.
Sad reality is if we're continually operating in -9f, and colder temperatures, 2 stroke is the way to go. They love the colder temperatures. 4 strokes do not. They need to be plugged in/heated to start.

Keep attempting to start, at -10f and colder, and one runs the risk of the famous shot gun blast through the muffler. Very loud, very violent, and can split the muffler at the seams.

Perhaps the 2018 re-flash will solve this issue. I'm not optimistic since the last 4-5 flashes did little to nothing to improve engine management.

What would it take to install something like that? No dealers around here, but i have some friends that might be able to instal something like that.

 

[YukonMP]

I saw your initial post last night but since I don't own a Viper and they are a little bit "special" when it comes to cold starts I let others provide the Viper specific news. I do own a Yamaha four stroke and I think I have searched and read every thread on the topic on this website. I wanted to feel confident I could go every day down to minus 40 C/F. The good news is that once you get them going in the morning you are good with the proviso in regard to relays. If you have relay issues just carry a spare at all times.

Be meticulous about the quality of your fuel. I know it is pricey up here but don't take any chances. Fresh gas, full tank to minimize frost in the tank . I run fuel injector cleaner continuously.

If it is REALLY cold turn it over by hand to loosen it up. Turn the primary in the direction of normal operation, never turn it backwards.

Cycle the key several times before your first attempt. When cranking do not let off if it sounds like it has caught, crank a little longer to make sure, don't let off early. Our starters do not grind like a car. If you have been cranking a while just give it a little throttle.

There seems to be a consensus among at least some here on TY that our fuel maps are rich on the bottom and at start. There was one post a while ago from an aircraft mechanic who said it was the same for the fuel injected aircraft. The solution was a switch on the fuel pump. To start they cycle the injectors, turn off the fuel pump, crank and after it starts or 15 seconds turn on the fuel pump. He was talking about the arctic specifically.

My MP really responds to a little heat. I don't think I really warm the engine up, I think I just fool some sensor into thinking things are warmer than they really are and the ECU cuts back the fuel a bit. I always use a battery maintainer in colder weather and hook up the fully juiced booster pack right from the start. All of the heavy thinking that the ECU is doing is based on voltage dependent sensors that aren't all telling the truth if the battery is low.

I'd park it out of the wind, I put a tarp over mine. If you think you can rig it safely throw a 60 or 100 watt bulb in there too. Maybe a fox set too, you never know who might move in. Good luck, welcome to TY, this site is awesome for people in locations like yours.

 

[FrozenTows4]

What would it take to install something like that? No dealers around here, but i have some friends that might be able to install something like that.

I have not personally installed this heater. Directions say....

"Requires removing the muffler, intake box, and clutches to install this kit"

Something that I could have done if chose to do so.

I will send you all of these new -40f sealed relays that you need for free. Been saving the extras for such a time as this. Just PM me your address.



I did not have a relay freeze since these were installed. Yet, even when on a battery tender continually, engine would not start unless engine was warmed up.

Merry Christmas!

 

[ArcticRider]

I saw your initial post last night but since I don't own a Viper and they are a little bit "special" when it comes to cold starts I let others provide the Viper specific news. I do own a Yamaha four stroke and I think I have searched and read every thread on the topic on this website. I wanted to feel confident I could go every day down to minus 40 C/F. The good news is that once you get them going in the morning you are good with the proviso in regard to relays. If you have relay issues just carry a spare at all times.

Be meticulous about the quality of your fuel. I know it is pricey up here but don't take any chances. Fresh gas, full tank to minimize frost in the tank . I run fuel injector cleaner continuously.

If it is REALLY cold turn it over by hand to loosen it up. Turn the primary in the direction of normal operation, never turn it backwards.

Cycle the key several times before your first attempt. When cranking do not let off if it sounds like it has caught, crank a little longer to make sure, don't let off early. Our starters do not grind like a car. If you have been cranking a while just give it a little throttle.

There seems to be a consensus among at least some here on TY that our fuel maps are rich on the bottom and at start. There was one post a while ago from an aircraft mechanic who said it was the same for the fuel injected aircraft. The solution was a switch on the fuel pump. To start they cycle the injectors, turn off the fuel pump, crank and after it starts or 15 seconds turn on the fuel pump. He was talking about the arctic specifically.

My MP really responds to a little heat. I don't think I really warm the engine up, I think I just fool some sensor into thinking things are warmer than they really are and the ECU cuts back the fuel a bit. I always use a battery maintainer in colder weather and hook up the fully juiced booster pack right from the start. All of the heavy thinking that the ECU is doing is based on voltage dependent sensors that aren't all telling the truth if the battery is low.

I'd park it out of the wind, I put a tarp over mine. If you think you can rig it safely throw a 60 or 100 watt bulb in there too. Maybe a fox set too, you never know who might move in. Good luck, welcome to TY, this site is awesome for people in locations like yours.

I wish i could by higher quality fuel, all of our fuel is flown in and cost $9 a gallon, but the quality is crap. i filter all my gas, but i think adding some ISO Heet might help. You give some great tips for helping me start, i'm gonna try it today, only -7F out right now. I never thought of turning the primary, i'll have to try that too. Thank you for all your help and solutions.

 

[ArcticRider]

I have not personally installed this heater. Directions say....

"Requires removing the muffler, intake box, and clutches to install this kit"

Something that I could have done if chose to do so.

I will send you all of these new -40f sealed relays that you need for free. Been saving the extras for such a time as this. Just PM me your address.



I did not have a relay freeze since these were installed. Yet, even when on a battery tender continually, engine would not start unless engine was warmed up.

Merry Christmas!

Thank you! That is very generous.