trlbrkr
Extreme
Nice job, who is your dealer?
Any luck solving your turning issues and tippiness?
When you have it working with the groomer in tow you should update your avatar picture
Any luck solving your turning issues and tippiness?
When you have it working with the groomer in tow you should update your avatar picture
air19
Pro
My dealer is All Around Power in St. Johnsbury, Vermont.
Lots of suspension adjustments made to get the right amount of weight up front and stiffened the front shocks for tippyness. Also mounted my Simmons Flexi-skis on the VK Pro now. All this should make a big difference.
After a tough January thaw last week, 40-50 degrees F most of the time, I'm looking forward to more normal January conditions and testing out all these changes next week.
Good eye, you noticed the old Skandic SWT in my avatar. I'll change that in a couple weeks when I get everything set up.
Lots of suspension adjustments made to get the right amount of weight up front and stiffened the front shocks for tippyness. Also mounted my Simmons Flexi-skis on the VK Pro now. All this should make a big difference.
After a tough January thaw last week, 40-50 degrees F most of the time, I'm looking forward to more normal January conditions and testing out all these changes next week.
Good eye, you noticed the old Skandic SWT in my avatar. I'll change that in a couple weeks when I get everything set up.
Jack_Shaft
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
I second the handiwork on the gooseneck mount, now let's see that vertical 
air19
Pro
Waiting on some parts for the gooseneck.
In the mean time went out today to gather some firewood and later to do some grooming. This gave me a good chance to test the changes done recently to my VK Pro.
Moved about three trailer loads of birch from a big blow down. This was about a mile round trip each time and it was a good chance to test the steering.
After putting on my flexi-skies, tightening up the front shocks, and adjusting the limiter strap this thing turns on a dime. Well not quite, but it actually turns now almost like a tracked ATV. Maybe overdid the weight transfer. My arms were a little tired, could have been from lifting the firewood, but the steering definitely took some muscle. I was also riding on hardpack.
The good news is at this level of adjustment there is no way that any of my trailers or grooming implements are going to be able to push the front end around any more. I might back it off a bit, but at least now I know I can get all the steering I want with the VK Pro's front end weight.
Here's a couple pictures of my trailer with a load of birch. This is a summer trailer I use with my ATV and mounts were created from an old pair of skis. The skis pivot up and down so it rides pretty good over a bumpy trail. I'd rather have the skis flexing than have all that happening at the hitch.
In the mean time went out today to gather some firewood and later to do some grooming. This gave me a good chance to test the changes done recently to my VK Pro.
Moved about three trailer loads of birch from a big blow down. This was about a mile round trip each time and it was a good chance to test the steering.
After putting on my flexi-skies, tightening up the front shocks, and adjusting the limiter strap this thing turns on a dime. Well not quite, but it actually turns now almost like a tracked ATV. Maybe overdid the weight transfer. My arms were a little tired, could have been from lifting the firewood, but the steering definitely took some muscle. I was also riding on hardpack.
The good news is at this level of adjustment there is no way that any of my trailers or grooming implements are going to be able to push the front end around any more. I might back it off a bit, but at least now I know I can get all the steering I want with the VK Pro's front end weight.
Here's a couple pictures of my trailer with a load of birch. This is a summer trailer I use with my ATV and mounts were created from an old pair of skis. The skis pivot up and down so it rides pretty good over a bumpy trail. I'd rather have the skis flexing than have all that happening at the hitch.
Attachments
air19
Pro
Overheating problem is back
In the afternoon I went out grooming with the VK Pro pulling the small G2 groomer. The G2 in this configuration weights about 300 lbs.
Conditions - 24 degrees F, hardpacked trails, running with grooming knives down 1/2 inch into the snow, and the VK Pro in low gear always.
I was grooming a 5Km loop. There is one hill in the beginning about 500 meters long with 80 meters of climb spread out very evenly. The rest of the loop is gently rolling with small ups and downs. I went around the loop three times and somewhere along the long hill the VK Pro overheated every time around! javascript:emoticon('
')
The first time up the hill I had the groomer knives barely into the snow. I went up the hill at about 5000 rpms in low gear going about 10 to 12 mph depending on the pitch. I got 60% of the way up the hill and the VK Pro overheated. I turned off the engine, waited 15 minutes. Turned it back on, no more overheating, and proceeded up the rest of the hill and around the rest of the 5Km loop.
The second time I took the knives out of the snow, they only hit on a couple of bumps I was working out. I went up the hill at about 4500 rpms in low gear traveling about 8 to 10 mph. I got 80% up the hill and then the VK Pro overheated. Same shutdown routine. After 10 minutes when I turned the engine back on it was still overheated. After waiting another 5 minutes things were back to normal and around the rest of the loop I went.
The third time, the knives were up and I went up at 4000 rpms in low gear traveling about 6 to 7 mph. I got 90% up the hill and it overheated. Gave it 15 minutes to cool down and then went on to finish the loop.
This is very disappointing because this is a very normal grooming scenario. With hardpack conditions like this I want to be out there working my groomer teeth into the snow and churning it up to create a looser surface on the top for skiers. This hill that caused me all my problems today is like a railroad grade. Very gentle, it just keeps going for a long way.
I'll point my dealer to this thread and my description and give him a second chance to try and fix it. There was nothing extreme in anything I was doing today to expect this - reasonably cold temperatures, good snow pack for the VK to have traction and pulling power, groomer knives not used in excess, just a long easy hill with 300 lbs behind it that I thought the VK Pro should have handled with ease - NOT!
Here's a picture of my setup as I went out.
In the afternoon I went out grooming with the VK Pro pulling the small G2 groomer. The G2 in this configuration weights about 300 lbs.
Conditions - 24 degrees F, hardpacked trails, running with grooming knives down 1/2 inch into the snow, and the VK Pro in low gear always.
I was grooming a 5Km loop. There is one hill in the beginning about 500 meters long with 80 meters of climb spread out very evenly. The rest of the loop is gently rolling with small ups and downs. I went around the loop three times and somewhere along the long hill the VK Pro overheated every time around! javascript:emoticon('
')The first time up the hill I had the groomer knives barely into the snow. I went up the hill at about 5000 rpms in low gear going about 10 to 12 mph depending on the pitch. I got 60% of the way up the hill and the VK Pro overheated. I turned off the engine, waited 15 minutes. Turned it back on, no more overheating, and proceeded up the rest of the hill and around the rest of the 5Km loop.
The second time I took the knives out of the snow, they only hit on a couple of bumps I was working out. I went up the hill at about 4500 rpms in low gear traveling about 8 to 10 mph. I got 80% up the hill and then the VK Pro overheated. Same shutdown routine. After 10 minutes when I turned the engine back on it was still overheated. After waiting another 5 minutes things were back to normal and around the rest of the loop I went.
The third time, the knives were up and I went up at 4000 rpms in low gear traveling about 6 to 7 mph. I got 90% up the hill and it overheated. Gave it 15 minutes to cool down and then went on to finish the loop.
This is very disappointing because this is a very normal grooming scenario. With hardpack conditions like this I want to be out there working my groomer teeth into the snow and churning it up to create a looser surface on the top for skiers. This hill that caused me all my problems today is like a railroad grade. Very gentle, it just keeps going for a long way.
I'll point my dealer to this thread and my description and give him a second chance to try and fix it. There was nothing extreme in anything I was doing today to expect this - reasonably cold temperatures, good snow pack for the VK to have traction and pulling power, groomer knives not used in excess, just a long easy hill with 300 lbs behind it that I thought the VK Pro should have handled with ease - NOT!
Here's a picture of my setup as I went out.
Attachments
air19
Pro
CORRECTION - The 500 meter long hill I overheated on repeatedly, ONLY has 40 meters of climb. I had my contour interval wrong on my map. That makes more sense. It's an 8% average grade, not quite railroad standards, but usually a very easy pull.
Jack_Shaft
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Hmmm. I have heard some vague reports of VK Pros overheating up this way too. With the rad+fan, this really shouldn't be an issue at all.
Make sure your coolant is set up at a proper 60/40 mixture ratio and perhaps add a little water wetter to the coolant for more efficient cooling.
In the meantime, perhaps it's time to consider a set of rail-mounted ice scratchers, if I ever get around to finishing off our VK Pro, it will have a set installed for my grooming purposes just in case.
Still for all, the rad+fan should be able to handle the cooling duties during low speed operation, that was supposed to be the whole point of the install, no?
Make sure your coolant is set up at a proper 60/40 mixture ratio and perhaps add a little water wetter to the coolant for more efficient cooling.
In the meantime, perhaps it's time to consider a set of rail-mounted ice scratchers, if I ever get around to finishing off our VK Pro, it will have a set installed for my grooming purposes just in case.
Still for all, the rad+fan should be able to handle the cooling duties during low speed operation, that was supposed to be the whole point of the install, no?
air19
Pro
I've thought about the ice scratchers but that seems like a patch to an important problem (proper cooling) that Yamaha should get right. And I don't like the idea of having to lift them everytime I need to get into reverse.
This cooling issue has always been one of the big advantages that air cooled Ski-Doo Skandic SWTs had over everyone else. I was hoping that Yamaha had gotten it right this time with their 4 stroke with the rad/fan setup, and I'm still hoping.
I'll look into the mix ratio - thanks.
I also wonder if there is any way to adjust the timing of the fan so that it comes on sooner?
This cooling issue has always been one of the big advantages that air cooled Ski-Doo Skandic SWTs had over everyone else. I was hoping that Yamaha had gotten it right this time with their 4 stroke with the rad/fan setup, and I'm still hoping.
I'll look into the mix ratio - thanks.
I also wonder if there is any way to adjust the timing of the fan so that it comes on sooner?
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that could be possible. see if yamaha makes a different temp sending unit that activates at a lower tempurature. i know they make them for transports.
Kråkan
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Just a thought, Have you tried grooming in high gear? That might get the rpms down and keep the engine cooler? You could go 12mph and ony at 400-4500 up that hill and in the easyer parts help the engine get alittle cooler before the next hill??
There shouldnt be a problem with to little power. Maybe something to test until your dealer comes up with a solution? Sounds as if the fan just dont get on soon enough and that cant be a big deal to change imo.
When i have been grooming with our VK there has not been any problems at all and our VK havent got any low gear. Although the groomer is not as heavy as yours but it has wings that hold ALOT of snow sometimes. Maybe I dont have enough paitients so I go alittle faster like 30km/h and that might be why.
One thing that I notised was when going over a lake the first time last year in app 30cm of fresh snow and on the lake there was ALOT of water on the ice. I just pinned it and no problems at all. THIS THING CAN PULL...... With the old VKIII or the bearcat 4stroke I would have been walking home!!!
There shouldnt be a problem with to little power. Maybe something to test until your dealer comes up with a solution? Sounds as if the fan just dont get on soon enough and that cant be a big deal to change imo.
When i have been grooming with our VK there has not been any problems at all and our VK havent got any low gear. Although the groomer is not as heavy as yours but it has wings that hold ALOT of snow sometimes. Maybe I dont have enough paitients so I go alittle faster like 30km/h and that might be why.
One thing that I notised was when going over a lake the first time last year in app 30cm of fresh snow and on the lake there was ALOT of water on the ice. I just pinned it and no problems at all. THIS THING CAN PULL...... With the old VKIII or the bearcat 4stroke I would have been walking home!!!
Kråkan
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
4000-4500 not 400-4500
Might be tough getting the cluth to engage at 400rpm HAHAHA
Might be tough getting the cluth to engage at 400rpm HAHAHA
Jack_Shaft
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
I would try setting the fan to "always on" if Yamaha doesn't have a lower temp sensor. Just wire it directly with some bullet connectors, that could work too. You might go through a fan every couple of years, but they're not too expensive.
trlbrkr
Extreme
I am not familiar with the radiators on Vk's but on my Rage that has the same 3 cylinder motor as yours and on our Attak with the 4 cylinder I had the dealer add a switch so I could turn on the fan manually and I added the rear cooler to both to eliminate overheating when I am riding in hard pack with my wife or daughter at lower speeds. The other trick I used before the mods is piling snow on the running boards to keep it cool.
air19
Pro
Good ideas everyone - thanks. I really like the idea of having a switch so I can manually turn the fan on. That way on a hardpack day, I could turn it on and just leave it on all day.
My dealer and specifically the service manager have been reading this thread and its a great source of ideas they are going to talk to Yamaha about.
I'll give you an update when we decide how many of these ideas to go ahead with. I usually like to try and tackle these types of problems on multiple fronts. Like my steering challenges, we did multiple suspension changes and the flexi-skis and it steers great now.
My dealer and specifically the service manager have been reading this thread and its a great source of ideas they are going to talk to Yamaha about.
I'll give you an update when we decide how many of these ideas to go ahead with. I usually like to try and tackle these types of problems on multiple fronts. Like my steering challenges, we did multiple suspension changes and the flexi-skis and it steers great now.
YETI
Extreme
air19 check with your dealer but I was told if it flashes it is overheating but you can still go, BUT if it is solid light you have to turn it off. This could be wrong but my apex would flash when I felt it should not be all that hot, and this is what I was told. It never smelled to hot or boiled over. I think yamahas have a very touchy temp sensor(imo) If you find out differant let me know please.
