Reverse Testing

[TrueBlue]

If you want to test the gears take off the servo. There is a peace of metal called the fork that you can touch with you finger. Push it to the chain case side, hold it, turn the shaft until it locks in to place, then let go it will stay in place. Transfer to reverse push it to the clutch side and rotate the shaft half turn should go it to place. Forward both shaft will rotate same direction reverse the the shaft will rotate opposing each other. Make sure the smaller chain case shaft is pushed in to the the gear case.

Test the servo- Have the servo off the gear case. Get a 12v battery and two wires. Connect one wire to positive the to negative. On the servo there is 3 pins (1 pin is on the left side from the top looking at the pins it will be alone and 2/3 will be next to each other). Read carefully as it just does not swap for F/R
For Forward connect Neg(-) to 1 and Pos(+) to 2. For Reverse Connect Pos(+) to 1 and Neg(-) to 3.
If actuator moves to the right is in F and if it goes to the right its in R.
The actuator is spring loaded. This will keep constant pressure on the fork until it is shifted in to place and keep it in place once it has. The servo is not supplied constant power to do so.

Testing the sensors-There is on the F side and one on the R side (they are interchangeable with each other). They work just by simple contact from the fork. To test it you cant get a self powered test light and past current from the fork to the sensor (the side it is on) or you cant take of the sensor and test from the ends.

Dry Run-Place the servo in F position. Push the fork in to F position. Place servo back on case. Test it by supplying power to change fork locations for F/R shifts. A fast twist may need to be applied due to tension from the spring. Make sure there there gear are lubed, friction will not help a shift. If it does not fully shift in to place, make sure small shaft is pushed in. If it still does not, the servo gear may be re-indexing if taken apart.

If this all work try a full hook up with everything back together. If this does not work you problem lies with in the Control Pod or ECU. They control when the servo is supplied power to shift (to prevent damages a high RPM shift), D and R lights, and back up alarm.
When putting everything back to getter 1 wire for the sensor will have F on it for Forward, so you know witch sensor is witch.
To make a direct override for addition of reverse - Diagram coming soon for battery connection, switches, and connection to servo.

Pic 1- Yellow Arrow, push the shaft in to direction arrow points. The other Yellow Arrow, what part of the gears the shaft controls. Red Arrows, the shaft and gears it controls. Blue box, inside the box indicates how the gears are aligned and touch. Black indicates the fork.

Pic 2- In Forward gear position.

Pic 3- In Reverse gear position.

Pic 4- Yellow Arrows, indicate witch direction the shaft will rotate in Forward. Red Arrows indicate witch direction the shaft will rotate in Reverse.

pic 5- Testing sensor in Forward with out removing sensor.

Pic 6- Testing sensor with sensor removed.

Pic 7- Servo wire application to change actuator position.

Pic 8- Corresponding Actuator position. Left is Reverse and Right is Forward.

Pic 9- Heavy spring shown in Servo.

Pic 10- Gear re-indexing. Place for in Forward position and place Actuator in Forward position. Top arrow pointing right is the a stop and the bottom is stop. They will contact each other to stop from going to far (unknown how long power is supplied but easier to make that then make senors and some a device for it) When re-indexing make sure they just touch each other and place cover back on.

Pic 11- Just a under view of the cover. # Color Corresponds with the Arrow color for current testing with self power test light. (With #1 sometimes I would get a light sometimes the motor would turn). White Arrow (the stop) is to make sure the gear to go to far and slip out of place.
You will notice the are not all the same length. This is to automatically kill the power once it is full shifted in place. If it was to be bumped out of place it would re-engaged. If the gears are fully in place but the Actuator Arm is not, the power will still be cut. The Arm is spring loaded to keep constant presser until it is engaged and should still do so once its in place.

Pic 12- Yellow Arrow, 3 wires that are used to control the Servo. Red Arrow, wire to Forward Sensor. Blue Arrow, wire to Reverse Senor.

Pic 13- Example of testing.

Pics 14- Contact points (also could be called a brush) for D/R to the complete the circuit.

Do you think all the problems with this electronic reverse has been fixed on the 2018 Vectors. I would like to buy a 2018 but with all the problems maybe I should look for a 2017 instead

 

[jamm999]

Ok so I am having a similar issue as mooseman with the skipping. Mine goes in and out of reverse perfectly though. It seems to skip more after it is warmed up. I took it for a ride and had no issues at all. Got back to my house and put it into reverse, went in perfectly, backed up no problem then went back into drive no problem. Then when I start moving forward around 15 to 25 mph it starts to skip, I did notice the D light blink as it was trying to skip. I am wondering if it is just trying to go back into reverse? If that's the case would it be caused by a weak servo motor or possibly a bad sensor ? Like I said it Always goes in and out of reverse perfectly. Seems like I could drive all day and not have a problem until I put it into reverse , Then it starts to act up. What about disabling reverse all together either by a fuse or unplugging it ?

 

[1bad10tacoma]

Solved my reverse problem, sold the phazer now I'm rocking a bravo this winter.

 

[Koebes]

Seems like i have a servo/gearbox problem on my MP. Did some 20km through 20cm snow and almost at the end of the trip there was like a ratcheting every now and then. Green D light turns off at the same time. I first checked the chain tension and track tension, but nothing bad there. So I pulled the seats and tank of, and squeezed my sausage fingers into the engine compartment to pull that servo out (shifting forward and reverse works fine). Looks like the axle that holds the shifter arm was bend. straightend it and put everything back together. Tomorrow it's test time. I will have a look at those gears as well before assembling everything again. Hopefully that solves the problem. hopefully I don't need a gearbox rebuild. When shifting ther is quite a loud clonk noise. Is that normal or could the shims on the secondary be missing? No Idea if the previous owner did the upgrade. Would have been much easier to install a decent hand lever to shift.

 

[Mooseman]

A clunk when shifting is normal. You should make sure that washer is there for the secondary because I'm pretty sure that's what screwed up my son's Phazer reverse box with the excessive play and banging on the bearing in the box.

 

[Koebes]

A clunk when shifting is normal. You should make sure that washer is there for the secondary because I'm pretty sure that's what screwed up my son's Phazer reverse box with the excessive play and banging on the bearing in the box.

Thanks for the quick reply. Could you point me to what washer it is in the parts diagram, or where I can find the service bulletins? The weird thing is that I hardly use the reverse and did definetly not use it yesterday when ratcheting started. I don't really feel I am losing propulsion . It's hacking a short moment and works fine afterwards until the next hack. If yamaha had designed the side covers of the driver seat in a smarter way it would be quite easy to remove the tank. and leave the passenger seat on. One multipin electrical connector two bolts from the side and the two for the tank and the tank would be out in notime. Well I hope I get it back to work until the end of the season and can tear it apart in the sun together with the mosquitos.

 

[Koebes]

Did a quick test run this morning but after a short while of joy, the ratcheting reappeared. So now I pulled the sled apart and took the gearbox out. Definetly not a masterpiece of japanese engineering. The castings of my east german made motorcycle are better. As suspected the slightly chamfered surfaces on item 48 and 49 are worn. Obviously Yahama couldn't make 48 symetrical so you would be able to twist it around and have some more troublefree kilometers. The sad part is item 49. Not really cheap in the US and even more expensive in Sweden for sure. One option would be a plastic spacer between 48 and 45 and sacrifice reverse until I find some cheaper spares.
I could remove the chain and all reverse stuff that I won't need and make some plastic spacer to help Item 48 to stay in place. Quick and dirty. Just sad that it is quite a bit of work to get to the gearbox.

From 2008-2009 Item 49 changed part numbers and another item 71 in picture two was added. I think I will look for a newer used gearbox in order to get all the upgrades. 500+ dollars to rebuild mine seems like a bit expensive.

Edit: Found a Gearbox from a 2011 Phazer RTX with only 250km on it. Seems like the main difference is the shaft from the secondary to the gear box most probably because of the wider track. Not cheap but under 400 dollars and I will get another Servo as well.

 

[Mooseman]

The washer I was referring to is the one directly under the large bolt that holds the secondary to the shaft. There are also shims. Side play of the secondary should be 2-3mm max. It's 1-2-4-5

 

[JetAv8r]

Ugghh. I'm fully into this one. Warmed up sled, idle'd at 1800 RPM. REV button pushed - zero nada. Hit the reset button. Nothing. Turned it off. Still nothing. Ran the sled for awhile. Changed the gear oil out, adjusted the chain tension - still no change--Intermittent. Tear down begun. Tested all solenoids, took out servo motor and tested it on the bench - good both directions. Although when I first took the servo motor out the FWD pinion gear (lug) was a little to the right (clockwise) stop from the FWD window specified in the manual. Once tested a few times in both directions it never went that far clockwise in "FWD" stop. I think its time to pull apart the servo motor and take a look. Tested the Reverse Position Switch on the left side - OHM check good. Can't check the Drive Position Switch on the right side unless I take the entire assembly out. Check the harness - ohm checked good. I think I'll put the servo back in and put independent (12v) power to the servo and see if it moves the internals in the reverse drive case. What a pain...

 

[Skytt]

Hi,
Found this old gem of a thread and was hoping perhaps someone here was still active
I recently bought a 08s Phazer MTX, around 3400km so in really good condition overall.
Had an issue with starting in the cold so last weekend i replaceed the relay for the fuel pump since it wouldnt prime.
I removed the bracket for the battery to easier access the relays and also to change chaincase oil and check the chain tension while i was at it.
Put everything back together, started the sled and everythin seemed fine.
Put the sled in reverse and from there everything went sideways.

Now i got a flashing D, error code 88 and as soon as i start the sled the fuse for the gearbox pops. Like a perfect trifecta of s**t.
The sled starts fine and primes the fuel pump but its in limp mode.

I have no idea to start to be honest. Im used to working with 2strokes but when it comes to this electric issues im at a loss.
Any tips of like top 5 things i should check in order would be greatly appreciated

 

[Mooseman]

The flashing D would mean that it's not shifting properly and staying hung either in R or in between, which is why it's in limp mode. Try the tricks to get it to shift like lifting the rear end or turning the secondary manually back and forth.

However, the popping fuse is a new one to me. Either there is a short in the wiring or possibly the relay since you were working around that area. I'd be checking the wiring from the relay to the motor and fuse power feed for continuity, a short either to itself or to ground. A wiring schematic from the manual would be useful. After that, I would pull out and test the shift motor. Another possibility is the gearshift in the reverse box is damaged and will not allow the motor to move, which may be causing the motor to hang and eventually pop the fuse due to the jam and overcurrent. After taking the shift motor out, try to look inside the reverse gear box with a mirror or borescope. Once you have the shift motor off, you can also try to move the shifter fork with your finger and turning the secondary by hand (not running). Moving it towards the clutch is forward and towards the chaincase is reverse.

 

[Mooseman]

Note that the first couple of years for this sled had an issue with leaking gear oil due to an issue with the oil feed pipe and grommet from the chaincase to the reverse gear box that would eventually empty most of the oil out. If it wasn't fixed with the updated parts or the oil not checked on a regular basis, the gearbox can be damaged.

Thread '07' FX chain case leak????'

Oct 27, 2013

I helped my friend michdog2011 buy his first Yamaha this summer which was an 07' FX with less than a 1,000 miles on it. He bought this from another friend of mine. Actually I helped my other friend buy this FX last year when it had 350 miles on it. Anyways, it is a low mileage, garaged stored all of its life, clean FX.

michdog2011 and I did a track stretch and swap this summer and some other mods. Running the sled after the track swap on the lift, the sled leaks chain case lube after it sits for a while. And I have to say, it leaks pretty good. I can tell you that it is not...

• Gone Blue
• Replies: 75
• Forum: Phazer & Phazer MTN General Talk

 

[Kevin0311]

Did you adjust the chain case chain?

 

[Skytt]

The flashing D would mean that it's not shifting properly and staying hung either in R or in between, which is why it's in limp mode. Try the tricks to get it to shift like lifting the rear end or turning the secondary manually back and forth.

However, the popping fuse is a new one to me. Either there is a short in the wiring or possibly the relay since you were working around that area. I'd be checking the wiring from the relay to the motor and fuse power feed for continuity, a short either to itself or to ground. A wiring schematic from the manual would be useful. After that, I would pull out and test the shift motor. Another possibility is the gearshift in the reverse box is damaged and will not allow the motor to move, which may be causing the motor to hang and eventually pop the fuse due to the jam and overcurrent. After taking the shift motor out, try to look inside the reverse gear box with a mirror or borescope. Once you have the shift motor off, you can also try to move the shifter fork with your finger and turning the secondary by hand (not running). Moving it towards the clutch is forward and towards the chaincase is reverse.

By diving into the wiring and after scratching my head a lot yesterday i realized that i forgot on other thing I replaced.
I replaced a relay that was not looking fresh with a new OEM relay at the same time as i replaced the fuel pump relay.
After reading an earlier comment in the thread about the wire for the gearbox being baby blue/white I retraced my steps and replaced that relay(which had the wire running to it) with the old crappy looking one and voila, everything started working again!
So by my guess the new relay i got from the yamaha dealer(Over counter, even brought the old relay) was probably a DOA/dud and was somehow not working and causing havoc.

Thanks for the help and tips, hopefully the sled will hold toghether the rest of the season at least