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Shootout

Stock to Stock boys, let's be fair.
The Stock Winder is a bit "poochy" on bottom, which honestly makes it a GREAT trail sled.
6000 and up is a "Religious Experience"
The 900R is VERY touchy on SPORT mode. Kinda scary TBH
 
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Honestly i just want to spank the new POO 850's
Both are getting a bit Cocky with me.
So i made a sign for them on my new "extenda flap"

IMG_1711.jpg
 
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Isn
stevewithOCD said:
My sled was EXACTLY 72 lbs lighter then my old Sidewinder when i personally weighed them.
Both 137'' Ripsaw2 tracks with 96 studs.
Both FULL of ALL fluids including 2 burps to fill gas. Winder holds 1 more gallon.
I removed everything else except spare belt.
Both have hand guards & higher windshields.
We put on his stock skis so it lost 2 pounds.
So my Adrenaline is EXACTLY 70 lbs lighter.
The Mach may weigh a few more pounds due to shocks.
We tested both my scales & did it 3 times each to be sure.

Not that i think it matters cuz i still believe the Winder will take it on top but have to wait another week.
Cancelled this week so next Thursday i should know.

I already told my bud if he beats me to 660, i'll set him up with a Red Head.
I don't like Red Heads anyways. So it's a win win!

P.S: He AIN't beatin' me to 660
Click to expand...
Isn't a gallon of gas over 6 pounds?
 
74Nitro said:
Isn

Isn't a gallon of gas over 6 pounds?
Click to expand...
6.1 to be exact
I weighed them just like we leave every morning.
Everyone tops off their tanks & oils.
Some say it's not fair if they hold more gas, but that's the rule.
If someone doesn't top off, they don't ride with me.

Don't forget we're not talking at a drag strip or a speed run.
2 guys trail riding then stop on lake, look at each other, 3 jumps and BANG!!!!!!! Race is on
No ice picks, strapped down suspension, fuel additives, $5000 in clutch work.
Just average guys...........................................................................................................................and me
 
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I don't believe the EPS on the Sidewinder has affected the size of the fuel tank. The EPS motor is lower in the chassis than the Apex.
 
Ya not sure
How much extra weight is it on Winder?
I'm only basing my opinion on EPS on the Apex which i firmly believe has a purpose and use.
I just like it as an option.
I mean i weigh 170 lbs now & i NEED to be 165 or in my OCD head, that's why i may lose!
This head is very busy & complex.
Only music & riding keep it under control!
 
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Got a call from a good buddy today that bought a Mach, he put a bunch of miles on it in the UP this week. It's going to go up for sale soon. I'd like to tell you what he said, but it'd really get me in trouble with the Doo crew. Lets just say he's not at all impressed with the performance or the fancy semi-active shocks. He's actually going back to his old 900t XRS with a tune if that tells you anything. Says they were/are way overhyped, and Doo under delivered.

The Machs sound like they are lacking now that some real reports are starting to come out on their performance. Looks like the 998 will retain its head of the class. The Mach is far from a lake racer! He could only do 110 MPH dreameter speed on a long groomed RR bed. More often then not it'd only Doo 107 MPH. Not good at all for the Doo crew as the speedo are off almost as bad as the old RX-1's were.
 
Did ANYBODY expect any different?
Although something doesn't quite sound right here.
I personally saw my buds' 900T do 110gps against my 24,000 mile Apex that did 113 right next to it. My Ecotrail Winder did 121.
I weigh 165 & my bud weighs 265. That 900 has a 1.6 track also.

So more hp & taller gear HAS to be more than that. Obviously conditions factor in here.
The STOCK Winder in our group, also with a 270 lb rider only did 115. Took him half a lake to catch up also.
ALL gps speeds.

I did NOT buy my sled to be first across a lake, but i believe 115 is acheivable.
If we ever get SNOOOOOOOW i'll post my DRAGY reports. Ordering one today.

P.S: My 600 was only 2 mph off at 100 compared to gps. Speedo said 101; gps said 99

SNOOOooooooooooooooooooooooOOOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dam it

P.S2: I really only want to beat that 850 POO. Can't get beat by a 2-SMOKE. Won't sleep at night
 
stevewithOCD said:
Did ANYBODY expect any different?
Although something doesn't quite sound right here.
I personally saw my buds' 900T do 110gps against my 24,000 mile Apex that did 113 right next to it. My Ecotrail Winder did 121.
I weigh 165 & my bud weighs 265. That 900 has a 1.6 track also.

So more hp & taller gear HAS to be more than that. Obviously conditions factor in here.
The STOCK Winder in our group, also with a 270 lb rider only did 115. Took him half a lake to catch up also.
ALL gps speeds.

I did NOT buy my sled to be first across a lake, but i believe 115 is acheivable.
If we ever get SNOOOOOOOW i'll post my DRAGY reports. Ordering one today.

P.S: My 600 was only 2 mph off at 100 compared to gps. Speedo said 101; gps said 99

SNOOOooooooooooooooooooooooOOOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Dam it

P.S2: I really only want to beat that 850 POO. Can't get beat by a 2-SMOKE. Won't sleep at night
Click to expand...


Well my buddy expected different, and I actually expected better too. I think we expected them to be over 200HP with the 17 lbs. of boost they were supposed to be running. I figured it would be faster than the old tuned 900t's at least, and it appears the 205 Hurricane tunes on the old 900t are faster than the Mach as well by a fair bit.

Of course conditions and locations are going to play a part Steve on how that top end is going to be, but I could take my old NA 1200 out and go 107 in ANY conditions or trail and 114-117 down a long RR bed in the UP on the dreameter anyway. And my little stage one turbo 1200 (180 MCX) would do 126-127 on the dreameter on the RR bed. We don't run GPS when we go to the UP. I tried it on my NA 1200 once on my road again the GPS and 117 was 109 on the GPS.

IMO the renegade you own will be quicker & faster than the Mach as the Mach is quite a bit heavier than the Renegade. More that what even Ski-Doo claimed. There may be a reason the Mach is only a one year sled. IMO the buyers got hosed in a sense. supposed to be a lowered lake runner that has more speed then the rest of their lineup, and those speeds are pretty lame for it. Yes, there will be guys that go faster as they setups somewhat improved, but they are a long ways from a Winder or T-Cat. The taller gearing in fact has done nothing for it. Even on the lake they are no faster than the old tuned 900 that was geared lower. On glare ice they are not fast either it sounds. The speed I heard was 114 on glare ice, same as the old 900t tuned yet geared down. Not sure on the distance on that however. Just that they are the same speed even with different gearing.

The worst of it is my buddy is not that impressed with the semi-active suspension either. He feels pretty letdown and thinks it was hyped WAY-WAY too much. So much so that its going down the road and he's going back to the old tuned 900t XRS sitting in his garage. Can't say I'd want that much tied into a machine and not be happy either. I see Cudney has his for sale too now. I think you'll see many coming up on the block soon, they'll want to cash in on COVID pricing before too many hit the market.
 
RAMSOMAIR said:
That’s what BRP is sooo good at, the hype and fishing you in!
Click to expand...

That and building good quality hi-priced sleds, at least the four-strokes are, but they just are not fast, that's all.

I really do like the Doo's, but since going to the Cat/Winder I have no desire to go back to to the ski lifting Doo. My 1200 was fabulous, light and fun, but was a bear to control with ski lift that could not be tuned out while keeping the ride decent. They do build a quality machine however.

I wonder when we'll see a new chassis from Cat/Yamaha? Hopeful that Textron/Yamaha address and re-engineer all the little stupid driveline stuff we have to fix on the the current model sleds while keeping all the good about the chassis we have now. I bet we wont see it for 2023 Model with the COVID issues.
 
I do agree, their fit finish and build quality is way better than any other manufacturer out there. Just look at the rear suspension and paint. Castings are nice and smooth and no flash
 
Maybe skidoo and yamaha need to make a baby, and poach some cat engineers to keep the front down.
 
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