BlgsRX-1mtn
TY 4 Stroke God
- Joined
- Apr 16, 2003
- Messages
- 1,530
- Location
- Billings, MT
- Country
- USA
- Snowmobile
- '03 RX-1 Mountain LE
HAMMER said:
I'll second that one Hammer. A turbo with same boost will not pull a SC out of the hole and, a SC with same boost will never outrun a turbo in the long run.
I have ran against several Benders and a MC-X (all RX-1s) prior to adding boost; I beat them for about the first 5' then, they would blow by me like I had reverse. My SCRX-1mtn definately hits harder than it ever did prior to the install. First test ride on low boost the bars folded back in my lap.
I have't raced a turbo with equal boost since the install however; it took a 100lb kid (Q-Dog) on a customised Ti M-7 on the juice to pull my Stage 1 SC out of the hole (I weigh 285 with gear). Anybody who knows Greg Painter can attest to how well tuned any of his family's sleds are.
Edit; I should add that I have ridden one of the above mentioned Bender kits (Stage 1 Also) and it definately pulled harder than my SC once it reached full spool.
Jim
Robin's last post on SnoWest (10 Feb 2006):
Sounds like he has some tuning issues... Here are a few tips for him:
Run the correct clutching and pulley combination hit the maximum 120,000 compressor wheel speed (Rotrex 30-74 SC). 3400-3600 engagement and 10,500-10,800 peak... If he’s not there already.
Have MPI program his controller for high-altitude if he hasn't already... If he still does not get desired results get the BoonDocker controller (scottbilt95 on SnoWest runs one on his SC and says he would never go back to the MPI controller) I'm just about to that point but I’m going to give the MPI controller one more try early season before going to the BoonDockers controller.
Get MORE cold air to the SC intake and through the intercooler... Mine ran like a terd with A/F ratios all over the place when it was sucking HOT under hood air into the SC... I run an intercooler fan and I built a Short Ram Cold Air Intake (www.turbohoses.com) to get outside air... HUGE performance improvement and stabilized A/F ratios... The one in the picture is not the one will I use on handlebar deep days, it will 45* back with the stock MPI Uni-filter and run up to the windshield so I can just reach over and knock the snow off when necessary.
Blow off valve to control the compressor surge and boost spikes.
Try some "liquid cooling agent" for the charge air...
Sounds like he has some tuning issues... Here are a few tips for him:
Run the correct clutching and pulley combination hit the maximum 120,000 compressor wheel speed (Rotrex 30-74 SC). 3400-3600 engagement and 10,500-10,800 peak... If he’s not there already.
Have MPI program his controller for high-altitude if he hasn't already... If he still does not get desired results get the BoonDocker controller (scottbilt95 on SnoWest runs one on his SC and says he would never go back to the MPI controller) I'm just about to that point but I’m going to give the MPI controller one more try early season before going to the BoonDockers controller.
Get MORE cold air to the SC intake and through the intercooler... Mine ran like a terd with A/F ratios all over the place when it was sucking HOT under hood air into the SC... I run an intercooler fan and I built a Short Ram Cold Air Intake (www.turbohoses.com) to get outside air... HUGE performance improvement and stabilized A/F ratios... The one in the picture is not the one will I use on handlebar deep days, it will 45* back with the stock MPI Uni-filter and run up to the windshield so I can just reach over and knock the snow off when necessary.
Blow off valve to control the compressor surge and boost spikes.
Try some "liquid cooling agent" for the charge air...
Attachments
RX-1 Moose
Expert
The 1 day Rob and I rode there where about 15 people there, he just got the sled back from TJ's and he was running 14lbs to 15lbs of boost. I rode the sled and saw this, he did not blow the blower belt and was not having a butt load of problems. First I don't care if he beats me or not, I bleed blue and love to see Yamahas kick butt. His sled was running good even from TJ's Mouth. Troy works with MT Performance Hand to Hand.
The fact is he needed more boost that day. We were racing up a big hill called Gun Sight in the Wyoming range up at the Horse Creek area outside of Pinedale Wyoming (Spring Snow) Around 10,000'. The Supercharger ran good but there were other sleds that beat him that day. It is amazing when someone gets beat that there sled was not running correctly. He beat everyone out of the hole except for my sled. 2 other sleds ran him down, a Mod Viper on NOS and a Turbo 700MM (Disco from Thunderstruck old sled). Not 1 person remembers him having any problems and he smoked everything else on the hill that day. Bucky's Polaris MOD 975 BB Polaris, Polaris MOD 800 on NOS, Yamaha 800 BB MM, the other guy's would not attempt to race him with there Cats.
The only thing I was trying to say is that the Bender Turbo Works PERIOD!
ROB can live in his world but we all know what happened & by the way I am 340lbs with my gear on, I could have put a 200lbs guy on the sled to make it more even and I was running 15lbs of Boost, It was down from 18lbs.
Fact is his sled could have run better and so could have everyone elses, the Bender Turbo is not a Lemon, they do run good.
The fact is he needed more boost that day. We were racing up a big hill called Gun Sight in the Wyoming range up at the Horse Creek area outside of Pinedale Wyoming (Spring Snow) Around 10,000'. The Supercharger ran good but there were other sleds that beat him that day. It is amazing when someone gets beat that there sled was not running correctly. He beat everyone out of the hole except for my sled. 2 other sleds ran him down, a Mod Viper on NOS and a Turbo 700MM (Disco from Thunderstruck old sled). Not 1 person remembers him having any problems and he smoked everything else on the hill that day. Bucky's Polaris MOD 975 BB Polaris, Polaris MOD 800 on NOS, Yamaha 800 BB MM, the other guy's would not attempt to race him with there Cats.
The only thing I was trying to say is that the Bender Turbo Works PERIOD!
ROB can live in his world but we all know what happened & by the way I am 340lbs with my gear on, I could have put a 200lbs guy on the sled to make it more even and I was running 15lbs of Boost, It was down from 18lbs.
Fact is his sled could have run better and so could have everyone elses, the Bender Turbo is not a Lemon, they do run good.
RX-1 Moose
Expert
This is my Bad, SORRY Rob you where talking about running with ROY and his Bender Turbo.
The day I am talking about Robs sled was Tuned by TJ's and running good.
Rob get on here and help me out.
The day I am talking about Robs sled was Tuned by TJ's and running good.
Rob get on here and help me out.
Certainly not calling you liar Moose, I'm sure that's what happened that day, and I have no issue at all with Bender Turbo's... I just know what I've been through and what others have been through with their Apex SCs... I know first hand how mediocre the SCs run when they're off and how good they can run when they're on... That's why I stated he should look into his setup... Remember where you started with yours in 2004 and where you are now with it... Setup and state-of-tune can make all the difference in the world.
RX-1 Moose
Expert
Yes You are Correct. 
BlgsRX-1mtn said:
I have a VERY different memory of that event than you do. I do not recall EVER seeing you pull us out of the hole. I'm betting that Ryan and Peter remember it a bit differently too. You may have pulled Jon out of the hole... but you need to remember that he just installed his turbo that weekend and his jetting and clutching were FAR from dialed in.
If you did in fact pull me out of the hole then you are the first NA RX-1 that has ever done that without jumping at the starting line.
I would love to ride with a good running SC. I ran with a SC'ed Apex last year and I think there was more tuning to be done to his sled, however, his sled was not impressive at all. After riding two turbo sleds that weekend he ended up removing his SC and buying a turbo.
My experience with SC'ed sleds is to limited to give a complete picture, but like I said I was not impressed with that one.
7.97 @ 170mph what lag are you talking about!!!
A
Anonymous
I just don't buy this turbo with 'no lag' thing...
Be it a Bender or MCX or whatever turbo, there will ALWAYS be some amount of lag...
Just need to tune it to get it running the way you like!
Same for me!
The thing is I want to get bigger boost (20+psi) and move more weight toward the center of the sled instead of the rear and nose (oil pump).
That being said, my next turbo system will need to be tuned too!
Be it a Bender or MCX or whatever turbo, there will ALWAYS be some amount of lag...
Just need to tune it to get it running the way you like!
Same for me!
The thing is I want to get bigger boost (20+psi) and move more weight toward the center of the sled instead of the rear and nose (oil pump).
That being said, my next turbo system will need to be tuned too!
There is lag. I can't dispute that. However, with the right tuning the seat-of-pants-o'meter can't feel the lag from a dead stop. I can feel a VERY slight lag from a rolling start, but it is so minimal that you have to really be looking for it.
If my sled came out of the hole much harder I don't think I could control it.
If my sled came out of the hole much harder I don't think I could control it.
RX-1 Moose
Expert
Thanks for helping me out Guy's (Spray & guba-jr). I thought I was all alone on this one. :ORC
snowy1
TY 4 Stroke Guru
there may be a split second of actual turbo lag but the stock motor is there instantly, then the boost comes on, when you hit the throttle it reacts, it does not bog or hesitate, so it is very hard to notice the lag time from the time the stock motor hits and the boost comes on.
A
Anonymous
What is important to note is the fact I do not ride in trails and this is no drag racing machine that I own.
So the off the line lack of lag is of no importance to me, its more the mid range when I let off the gas and quickly need to get on it back that I need very fast response from the engine.
I don't often ride in open grounds, more like 'hydro-quebec trails' if I can say it like that!
So the off the line lack of lag is of no importance to me, its more the mid range when I let off the gas and quickly need to get on it back that I need very fast response from the engine.
I don't often ride in open grounds, more like 'hydro-quebec trails' if I can say it like that!
snowy1
TY 4 Stroke Guru
the motor will respond just as qiuckly as a stock sled would it just may take a split second to biuld boost, thats why its hard for me to believe that a stock sled would beat a turboed one out of the hole they will come out of the hole the same, except the turbo will biuld boost in about a 1/2 sled length and be gone. so if the throttle response on a stock sled is fast enough for you then a turbo will be as will.
RX-1 Moose
Expert
Most of us are mountain riders and we need the same response as you are talking about. WE ARE GETTING IT. 
Boondocking is alot of fun with no lag and in my opinion if we had the Lag that everone talks about we should just stay on the trail and only climb straight up hills or go across a lake or open medeows. This is not the case. I can take my sled thru the tight trees, side hill, jump basicly do everything a naturally aspirated sled can do with a hell of alot more power and reliability. When you need to get the front end up, Jumping off a cornice or making a hard turn while going up a hill you can't just leave it punched, You need to be able to let off and get back on it with quick throttle respone or you and your sled might tumble to the bottom of the Moutain.
I guess what we all are saying is the Turbos can & do work in every aspect of ridding after they are tune in properly.
Boondocking is alot of fun with no lag and in my opinion if we had the Lag that everone talks about we should just stay on the trail and only climb straight up hills or go across a lake or open medeows. This is not the case. I can take my sled thru the tight trees, side hill, jump basicly do everything a naturally aspirated sled can do with a hell of alot more power and reliability. When you need to get the front end up, Jumping off a cornice or making a hard turn while going up a hill you can't just leave it punched, You need to be able to let off and get back on it with quick throttle respone or you and your sled might tumble to the bottom of the Moutain.I guess what we all are saying is the Turbos can & do work in every aspect of ridding after they are tune in properly.
