'07 Phazer Died While Riding and Won't Crank Over Now

[km_tb]

Hi there,

New member and first-time posting here.

Had the 2007 Phazer FX (approximately 2,000 KM on the sled) out over the weekend and ran into a little trouble. Looking for some troubleshooting guidance/assistance before I bring it into a shop.

Here is what I can tell you.....

• Sled was great all day leading into this, no issues starting, no warnings on the display. Was able to kill it and start it up multiple times. Only issue with the sled leading into this was difficulty engaging reverse which would work on/off intermittently.
• Hit a nice flat stretch over lightly snow covered ice, where I was giving it ~50% throttle, when there was a sudden and noticable loss of power.
• Continued along this stretch for another half a minute where the throttle fully depressed would only allow perhaps half the regular speed.
• Slowed down as my buddy stopped in front of me, at which point in time the rpms gradually dropped until the machine shut off.
• I recall smelling a slight burning smell which quickly dissipated, I'm not sure if it is related to what happened or if that was just the smell of track friction on lightly snow covered ice.
• I tried to start the machine and was unable to do so. My first though was that my battery crapped out on me, so I removed it to test and charge. Tried again with the charged battery and also a jump started and no-go. When I turn the key the dash lights come on, fuel primes, but when I try turning it over I just hear a click and no cranking now matter what I try.
• Tried jumping starter solenoid and no-go.
• Noticed a fuse was blown on the small wire coming off the positive terminal. Took a spare and put it in thinking that may be the issue, and no-go.
• Entered diagnostic mode and #61 read the following – 30, 43, 81, 84, 88. #62 read 5, which I then cleared as I thought the thrown errors may be preventing the sled from starting. I've never accessed this menu before, so I don't know if they were thrown just then or if it is a cumulation of all codes thrown since being reset? From what I have seen in the forum these codes are:
  • 30 - Oil pressure sensor or circuit senses low engine oil pressure. ECU turns off main relay and stops engine.
  • 43 - ECU unable to monitor system voltage due to an open or short circuit in fuel system circuit.
  • 81 - Grip warmer open or short circuit.
  • 84 - TORS system has been activated.
  • 88 - Short or open circuit in reverse indicator switch.
  • See the video of the codes here:
• Stupid me didn't check the oil. Checked after it died and noticed it was low. See attached picture for my estimate of the level.

Anyone out there able to point me in the right direction? Thanks in advance!

 

[maim]

@kirkswim , @cannondale27

might have bad ground blocks but i will bet in needs a starter just from how it is acting as they are known to come apart and do weird stuff. just from the year and the milage it has sat a lot so there might be corrosion in the grounding blocks/starter solenoid wiring.

 

[km_tb]

Thanks for your input maim! Strange that you are suggesting the starter. I wouldn't have thought a potential starter issue would cause it to shut down in the middle of a ride. I guess all the electronics are interconnected. I'm no mechanic by any means but I will see if I can take a look at the ground blocks and test the starter if possible.

Is there an easy way to rule out a seized engine? I am not normally pessimistic, but it would give me peace of mind knowing this isn't something significant. With the machine off, key out and plastic trim cover off, should I be able to easily spin the primary clutch? If I wrap rope around the primary clutch counter clockwise and give it a yank should it spin freely?

Much appreciated!

 

[Mooseman]

I sure hope it's not seized, otherwise it might be one of the early engines that had reduction gear issues. They usually blew up fairly early and within the original manufacturer's warranty that they would replace the engine. We had another member who bought a barn find with very low miles and it blew up. Yamaha wouldn't do anything for him because the warranty was expired despite the VIN being within the known bad ones. I guess it would be possible to avoid blowing it up for 2000 km if it was only run easy and as soon as it was pinned... blam.

Try turning the primary clutch in the normal direction and if it's locked up, that would be it.

 

[Mooseman]

Found that other thread:

07 Phazer seized

Any thoughts?

ty4stroke.com

 

[74Nitro]

I sure hope it's not seized, otherwise it might be one of the early engines that had reduction gear issues. They usually blew up fairly early and within the original manufacturer's warranty that they would replace the engine. We had another member who bought a barn find with very low miles and it blew up. Yamaha wouldn't do anything for him because the warranty was expired despite the VIN being within the known bad ones. I guess it would be possible to avoid blowing it up for 2000 km if it was only run easy and as soon as it was pinned... blam.

Try turning the primary clutch in the normal direction and if it's locked up, that would be it.

That was one of my customers machines, not my own.

 

[74Nitro]

If your machine does have the bad reduction gears it most likely would have been making an abnormal whining noise.

These are a dry sump engine so the oil level would have to be a lot lower than that to cause any trouble. In addition, there is a low oil level sensor(obviously on the dipstick), and a low oil pressure sensor.

You should clear all your old codes. Are there any active codes?

 

[cannondale27]

Make sure when you end up replacing or fixing starter that you replace the starter solenoid at same time. It may have stuck engaged.

 

[km_tb]

Hi All,

Again, I appreciated the responses and suggestions. A few updates, I got the sled on a trailer and brought it back to town. Just went to gather some more information for you:

• I was wrong about the mileage. It was higher than I thought 3,350 vs. 2,000.
• I noticed some blue fluid underneath the sled on the trailer between the track and engine. See picture:

• No new codes or indicator lights on the display. See startup sequence and diagnostics menus:

• See what happen when I try turning primary clutch. It partially rotates and then stops:

Obviously the last video is a very bad sign . Is there anything that can be done at this point?

 

[74Nitro]

You'll want the problem to be the gear set and not something else inside the engine.
Is yours in the affected VIN range?
Was the machine making a whining sound, as that was often common if the gears were bad.

 

[km_tb]

No Yamaha dealer in town anymore unfortunately. I tried searching the forum and can't find any specific VIN range. Was there a bulletin from Yamaha anyone has to see if I fall within that range? My VIN# starts with JYE8GN0007AXXXXXX

I didn't notice any whining. It's hard to think back and try to remember exactly what sounds it made. I would say the only time I ever heard anything that resembled a whine would be when going downhill (i.e. down a steep boat launch) and my thumb was off the throttle.

 

[Mooseman]

Unfortunately, there wasn't a bulletin as it was treated as a warranty issue. You could try calling Yamaha Customer Service and see if they can track down the VINs. And if possible, maybe ask that they provide the range?

It certainly doesn't look good. BTW, it's never a good idea to turn it backwards as it could jump the timing chain.

I think you're in for a replacement of the reduction gears and possibly the balance shaft like in the other thread. Probably should start with removing it and inspect.

 

[km_tb]

Just wanted to give you all a quick update. Had someone take a look at the sled and I've attached some pictures. Didn't request any further digging as the engine experienced major failure and definitely not worth fixing. Right hand cylinder is shot, valve broke off and did some damage.

Here is the good side:

Now for the bad:

Without further disassembly, he guessed that something was sucked into the airbox through this hole as the throttle body intake is right behind:

Very disappointing to say the least. Anyone have a suggestion as to what I could ask for it as if I sold it as is rather than parting out? I don't have the time or the space to disassemble it.

Thanks for everyone's input and earlier suggestions!

 

[cannondale27]

Oh man! Sucks

 

[Mooseman]

I don't know whereabout in Ontario you are but there are several sled parts dealers that might want to buy it. Or post it on Kijiji and/or Marketplace. Depends on the condition of the rest of the sled.