[/quote] The reason I keep this sled is the motor....there is not a better na motor in a sled at this time.[/quote]
exactly.....only reason I still own my apex MTN is the motor...there is nothing like it on the snow.....I am looking to buy something else and for the first time in 2o plus years of owning a yamaha I am thinking of buying a polaris RMK...yamaha already lost me for the side by side market as I bought a RZR...they might lose me in the sled market now too....hmmmmmm
exactly.....only reason I still own my apex MTN is the motor...there is nothing like it on the snow.....I am looking to buy something else and for the first time in 2o plus years of owning a yamaha I am thinking of buying a polaris RMK...yamaha already lost me for the side by side market as I bought a RZR...they might lose me in the sled market now too....hmmmmmm
buddah
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cacsrx1 said:
Not trying to start a pi$$ing contest but just because you don't see the numbers, doesn't mean they don't exist. According to IMSA (good enough source for you?) the numbers of sleds registered in MI, WI, and MN EXCEED all other 47 states COMBINED......you really think we got THAT many mountains?
I said I agreed with a lot of points chassis wise and otherwise, but it's still a numbers game and any corporation worth staying in business is going to absolutely address their largest (and hence most profitable) segment first......that's the only point I was trying to make...........
cacsrx1
Expert
Thank you ......when sleds head west through South Dakota, what states do you think they came from?????????????buddah said:
rindtj
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
Don't need to register a sled in a state you don't ride it.
Heritage
Expert
cacsrx1 said:
I don't think all that many are heading west....if they are it's because the upper midwest is lacking snow (except the U.P.)...and quite frankly most of the guys I know who head west...don't take their sleds...they rent them...because it's a pain in the #*$&@ clutching and re gearing, and many of them don't have long tracks.
I prefer a long track, and I run here in the upper midwest (wisconsin)...but the majority of sleds I see around here are 121-128 inch tracks, and by a wide margin.
and there is a reason for that...our trails are not blessed to get the snow you get out west (except in the U.P.)...longer tracked/deeper lugged machines, will just burn slides up on our twisty, thin, icy trails.....the 121's are easier to throw around...alot of our trails are very narrow, in tight wooded areas...driving anything over 136, is like driving a school bus in the woods.
I do agree that longer tracked sleds are becoming more popular, especially in the upper midwest (I see alot more mountain sleds in the U.P.)...but I think the crossover market is growing much faster than the mountain sled market...and the reason is versatility...YOU GOTTA GO WHERE THE SNOW IS....the crossovers can go run powder ....and are decent on packed trails.
Has the mountain market grown in the last 10 years??? Yes it has....but sales of mountain sleds is still miniscule compared to trail sleds...Though I believe the mountain market is smaller, I do think most mountain riders do alot of customising, to make their sleds do what they want/need... in fact I bet on average you guys probably spend twice as much money with the aftermarket as we trail riders do.
If you are not seeing many riders heading east it's because:
1) we don't have any snow this year
2) mountain sleds are not very fun to ride around here
3) you need to reclutch, and gear your sleds to ride here too
4) Why would anybody who has 5ft of fresh powder trailer east 500 miles to ride groomed trails??
5)....THEY JUST DON'T KNOW how good it is here (when we have snow)...Wisconsin, Michigan, and Minnesota have Thousands of miles of groomed maintained trails...many are like super highways through the woods, across lakes, around farm fields...and through hilly beautiful terrain. The entire regional has great pit stops, with excellent resturants, and places to stay...oh..(and something you mountain riders probably don't have)...and lots of available gas stations just off the trails. (you don't need a back pack or a gas can here)
buddah said:
The Pro-RMK 800 has been the best selling mountain sled since it came out and was the best selling sled OVERALL last season. I think I read that in Snotech. I never would have guessed a mountain sled would be the most popular sled. The mountain sled segment experiencing real growth, far more so in past years.
Unrelated to the current mountain debate going on here, but more speculation about Yamaha and Cat here: Supertraxmag.com
Tarzan
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A new 110 tripple in a new light chassi with a mcx turbo with 320hp at 14,5psi 
http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/ya ... ne-triple/
http://www.asphaltandrubber.com/news/ya ... ne-triple/
Paraclete
Expert
Off Trail Mike
Gone Riding!
Motor, Motor, Motor....or should i say reliability, reliability, reliability....
BUT.....
I am a simplistic guy. The mid length track @ 144 is a "crowd" pleaser, and I mean this in the corporate sense....what sells the most.... so I would be surprised if Yami does something outside the 144 skid size for the 2014 model year..
Mountian segment may be growing, but the midwestern trail rider is still driving the bus, meaning, its nice to have deep powder performance in a trail sled, but it still needs an excellent trail performer to survive.
Back to the motor....I will always give up 40-50 lbs for a 4 stroke, and seeing that a 2013 HCR 153 stock RTR is virtually the same as my heavily modified Nytro at 565 lbs, it means a 4 stroke manufacturer CAN be competitive within reason if they choose.... Translation: Yami if you are true to your roots you will remain in the market for a long time in all sled segments, your powerplants guarantee this.
My Nytro, with K&N's, header and controller, its probably 145hp of bulletproof reliable engine capable of 30,000km. No other manufacturer can make this claim..... not even close.
I would expect an evolution platform and I'll guess like the Apex or Nytro, Yami will ensure it will out live pretty much everything else on the market.
Is evolution necessary? Absolutely. But don't bash the Yami's too bad guys. These are the first mass produced sleds I know of that can survive 20,000+km's without ever breaking a sweat, and still have decent resale value WAY, WAY, down the line.
I love the latest and greatest, but I really love my resellable 6 year old Nytro platform too....
OTM
BUT.....
I am a simplistic guy. The mid length track @ 144 is a "crowd" pleaser, and I mean this in the corporate sense....what sells the most.... so I would be surprised if Yami does something outside the 144 skid size for the 2014 model year..
Mountian segment may be growing, but the midwestern trail rider is still driving the bus, meaning, its nice to have deep powder performance in a trail sled, but it still needs an excellent trail performer to survive.
Back to the motor....I will always give up 40-50 lbs for a 4 stroke, and seeing that a 2013 HCR 153 stock RTR is virtually the same as my heavily modified Nytro at 565 lbs, it means a 4 stroke manufacturer CAN be competitive within reason if they choose.... Translation: Yami if you are true to your roots you will remain in the market for a long time in all sled segments, your powerplants guarantee this.
My Nytro, with K&N's, header and controller, its probably 145hp of bulletproof reliable engine capable of 30,000km. No other manufacturer can make this claim..... not even close.
I would expect an evolution platform and I'll guess like the Apex or Nytro, Yami will ensure it will out live pretty much everything else on the market.
Is evolution necessary? Absolutely. But don't bash the Yami's too bad guys. These are the first mass produced sleds I know of that can survive 20,000+km's without ever breaking a sweat, and still have decent resale value WAY, WAY, down the line.
I love the latest and greatest, but I really love my resellable 6 year old Nytro platform too....
OTM
brad d
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Nikolai
TY 4 Stroke God
Off Trail Mike said:
Very well said.
RobWarrior
TY 4 Stroke Junkie
$8500??? Fire sale on Ebay...2011 new Nytro $7000!! Great price and still hard to pull the trigger without good riding.
dilligaf
Pro
brad d said:
Looks like I unloaded my FxNytro just in time (last night). Not replacing it until maybe next year depending on the snow. No snow, no new trail sled.
dilligaf
Pro
When talking to the owner of a local Yamaha dealer, he told me 2 things.
1) He's never seen Yamaha so tight lipped about next years sleds.
2) Cat hasn't taken an engine delivery from Suzuki in a year.
Take those statements with a grain of salt I would say. I'm kind of afraid that we're building this up to big, but makes for good conversation and some dreaming (hope I'm wrong about the last part).
And even if Yamaha doesn't change anything and we have a good snow year next year here in Minnesota, I'm in for an APEX XTX. I'm still not going to deal with 3k-5k mile engines from the other manufactures (excluding the doo 4-Tec). In this day and age, that's just not acceptable.
1) He's never seen Yamaha so tight lipped about next years sleds.
2) Cat hasn't taken an engine delivery from Suzuki in a year.
Take those statements with a grain of salt I would say. I'm kind of afraid that we're building this up to big, but makes for good conversation and some dreaming (hope I'm wrong about the last part).
And even if Yamaha doesn't change anything and we have a good snow year next year here in Minnesota, I'm in for an APEX XTX. I'm still not going to deal with 3k-5k mile engines from the other manufactures (excluding the doo 4-Tec). In this day and age, that's just not acceptable.
